LC4 Roller Bearing Upgrade: How To

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by markjenn, Mar 26, 2005.

  1. Highjnx

    Highjnx Serious Orange Crush

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    Jan 25, 2010
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    Hey Chester. I've got an 05' that just crapped out. So much for the newer style bearings.

    Any chance you've got the puller to lend.

    Thx
  2. Chester13

    Chester13 n00b

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    Highjnx,

    Send me a note with your address and I'll get it out courier next week.

    Not a problem.

    Cheers,
  3. johnno950

    johnno950 Long timer

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    1,076
    Shame to hear about these problems even with the upgraded roller bearing,also seen well docomented threads of rocker assemblys failing,crankshaft etc etc,i have owned a few lc4s from the 620/640adv to 640/660 rallyes,i always replaced the internal oil seal on the lhs caseing every couple of years or so,always found it to have gone "hard" on sealing surface regardless of kms/mileage of bike,if it leaks top end/crank etc will suffer from oil pressure lose,maybe something to be aware of.From memory its the same part number/seal as the lc8 seal on balance shaft that spews oil into front carby via crankcase breather.
  4. markjenn

    markjenn Long timer

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    FYI, I doubt any homemade puller designed to work with the early bearing is going to work with the later-model one.

    - Mark
  5. Highjnx

    Highjnx Serious Orange Crush

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    I was Hopeful that the standoff would work at the very least, and I could build a set of pullers to my needs.

    It's really a moot point if I can't pull the needle roller bearing out of the opposite side case, where the main shaft enters the clutch slave assembly. I wonder how many others have seen both main shaft bearings go out. I've read one other post on here for sure, where the case was completely trashed.
  6. markjenn

    markjenn Long timer

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    Bummer. Sounds like things are far gone enough where you probably just need to bite the bullet and split the cases.

    - Mark
  7. wrya1

    wrya1 n00b

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    I was riding my 2002 640 Adv, with 45,000km on a standard motor, across the Simpson Desert, a third of the way into a 500km crossing, when my clutch started to engage sooner at higher engine loads. Then some unpleasant scraping sounds from the clutch cover at about 4-4500RPM. Nothing to do but keep riding; retrieval cost from the Desert was more than my bike is worth! Clutch started slipping in the last 30km, I had to cross my fingers and keep going...

    Here is the culprit. That dastardly main shaft bearing. I was planning a full rebuild this summer, including that bearing. Guess it was the northern summer I was thinking of. No other major damage visible thus far, though lots of metal through the sump and one cracked oil pump gear. Still have my fingers crossed though.

    <a href="http://s1324.photobucket.com/user/wrya1/media/2013-07-05214521_zps1283af75.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1324.photobucket.com/albums/u603/wrya1/2013-07-05214521_zps1283af75.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 2013-07-05214521_zps1283af75.jpg"/></a>
  8. wvrocks

    wvrocks Been here awhile

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    Can someone describe what kind of noises a failing bearing might make? My bike seems to have developed a light scraping noise. Sort of like brushing sandpaper against a piece of metal or maybe a broom on concrete. Seems to be coming from the lower part of the engine/tranny. I only really notice it when stopped. Its cyclical and will speed up with added revs. 2000 640A with 9200 miles btw
  9. Highjnx

    Highjnx Serious Orange Crush

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    Instead of guessing I would do an immediate oil change, and see if you have metal in the magnetic bolts. After, pull the clutch cover, and clutch basket. Very easy to do. From there you can check for any side to side play in the main shaft.

    You might be lucky and just have a bad clutch bearing.

    Good luck.
  10. wvrocks

    wvrocks Been here awhile

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    Thanks, Did an oil change about 100 miles ago and the drain plugs weren't bad. A bit of fuzz on the magnetic one. The screen was clear. This was the first oil change I've done on this bike since I just bought it recently. Guess I'll pull the cover and have a look.
  11. Highjnx

    Highjnx Serious Orange Crush

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    These tend to be noisy when the valves are adjusted properly..:)

    Without hearing it, hard to tell. I could feel mine in the clutch. When engaging it went away. When releasing it, if there's any play, the basket wobbles and you feel this through the handlebars. Also more audible when severely worn.

    This is a symptom of either the clutch bearing, or main shaft bearing. I wouldn't rule out the main shaft bearing behind he clutch slave either. Not likely, but it does go.

    How many miles are on the bike?
  12. wvrocks

    wvrocks Been here awhile

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    Has about 9200 miles. Just adjusted the valves around 300 miles back. Changed the clutch cable recently but that shouldn't have affected anything, assuming I adjusted it correctly. Clutch as a bit sticky before the oil change, it would stall the bike when you first dropped it into gear in the morning. Got better with an oil change though.

    I ordered a main shaft bearing yesterday. I'll check out the roller bearing in the clutch if I get time tonight.
  13. wvrocks

    wvrocks Been here awhile

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    I got everything opened up. No obvious wear to any of the gears or housings. There is a very fine scratch in the top of the clutch cover. There is movement in the clutch basket. If you grab both sides you can rock it on the shaft. How much, play, if any, is acceptable here?
    The clutch bearing seems pretty smooth. If you pull the needle bearing out of the clutch basket and put it on the the inner sleeve it is pretty loose and can rock around on the sleeve.

    [​IMG]


    The main bearing itself looks to be in great shape, no vertical or horizontal play. If you push or pull on the shaft it has less than 1mm of movement, possibly less than 0.5 mm.

    Since I've ordered the bearing I'll probably just go ahead and swap it.

    [​IMG]

    While I'm asking questions, how do these friction discs look?

    [​IMG]

    Didn't take a picture but the magnetic drain plug just had a small amount of black fuzz on it.
  14. bmwktmbill

    bmwktmbill Traveler

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    Plates look good, not sure about the general movement.

    In the basket are the side cuts where the plates slide notched?

    The spec for plates is:
    Plates must be flat
    7 steel discs 1.5mm(0.066 in) free of groves
    8 lining discs 2.7mm(0.16 in) wear limit 2.5mm(0.1in)

    If you call me and explan how to send a pdf file I will send a copy of the factory manual to you.

    I have it in My Documents but don't know how to copy it to you or anyone.

    715 966 2001
    bill
  15. Highjnx

    Highjnx Serious Orange Crush

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    A little play in the clutch is natural. You should dig around in the Thumper thread for more specifics. What condition is the basket in. Any cracking?

    As for wear, you need to look at them individually for scoring. At 9k they should be fine. A bad bearing can cause some unusual wear.

    You probably know this, but make sure you orient them in the same direction on the install. I've heard of others who didn't, is why I mention it.

    When you drive the new bearing, make sure it doesn't go in to far, and bind the main shaft. I was following a thread where someone got to that point, and then ended up splitting the cases.

    Have fun..
  16. wvrocks

    wvrocks Been here awhile

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    Thanks Bill, I got a copy of the manual. Appreciate the offer.

    Highjinx, thanks for the reminder on the driving depth. That is certainly something you don't want to get wrong. I've kept my clutch plates organized and oriented just as they came out.

    The 2 plates I measured before I left for work this morning were in spec and didn't show any grooving.

    There are some marks on the basket and hub from the tangs on the clutch discs. They look worse in the photos than they feel. No obvious cracks in the basket.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG] <!-- / message --><!-- sig -->
  17. bmwktmbill

    bmwktmbill Traveler

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    I have filed groves out of mine a couple of times either with a flat file or a dremel or both.
    b
  18. wvrocks

    wvrocks Been here awhile

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    Thanks, I knocked some burrs off with a file last night. Should be good.

    Does anyone out there have a bearing kit I could borrow before I make my own? I'll pay shipping of course.
  19. Chester13

    Chester13 n00b

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    OK, I'm confused.

    It looks to me like 'wvrocks' doesn't have a bearing issue but that 'wrya1' sure does.

    I have a bearing puller and can ship it anywhere. Let me know where and I'll get it shipped out this week. I'm going away starting next week for 2 weeks so if you need a puller I'll ship on or before this Friday July 26.

    FYI, when my bearing went it ate those two plastic oil pump gears and sent metal and plastic everywhere.

    If I could figure out how to attach pictures I would but alas, I can't.

    Send me a note.
  20. wvrocks

    wvrocks Been here awhile

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    Sorry about the confusion, the clutch questions came when I was making my way in to look at the main bearing.

    My existing bearing was in good shape, well it was before I started drilling out the cage last night. I'm going to change it anyway for the new style and consider it preventative maintenance. I'm planning on having this bike for a while.

    No need for a puller now, I made my own last night. When I'm done with it, I'd be happy to mail it to anyone who needs to borrow it.