Montana 650 - Loss Satellite Reception

Discussion in 'Mapping & Navigation' started by gtj, Feb 7, 2013.

  1. gtj

    gtj Adventurer

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    Glad to hear your G4's work perfectly.
    I did ask what the difference between the G9 and G4 was, as you had mentioned previously that the G4's worked with the Montana, but the response was mainly the difference in the "click to link" allowing a greater number of riders to communicate.
    #21
  2. advNZer?

    advNZer? Long timer

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    could it just similar to the emf interfrence that another user had and solved by using a "choke".Hope i have the terminolgy right
    #22
  3. WU7X

    WU7X The Old Fart

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    I was reading through this post, but have neither the Scala or a Montana GPS on my bike. The idea of a choke is a good one. I found that it helped me in previous setups on my Dakar and a GPS system.

    If you have a friend who is an amateur radio operator "ham", ask him for a type 34 snap-on type ferrite bead or two. Wrap any wires leading into the Scala and the Montana in them, snap them shut, and see what happens. Sometimes any wires running into units like these act as antennas and can pick up unwanted signals that will screw up the unit. hope this helps.
    #23
  4. OneEffinName

    OneEffinName Been here awhile

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    Its very common for electronic devices - especially ones that use any type of wireless technology or antennas to interfere with each other.

    The fix is simple - just move them to either side of the handlebars.


    Failing that, put tin foil on your head.
    #24
  5. Emmbeedee

    Emmbeedee Procrastinators

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    The Scala radio in this case is already up on the riders helmet. Some distance from the Montana.
    #25
  6. bighopper

    bighopper Been here awhile

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    I have been using a SMH10 & SMH10R with my 650 on rugged mount that is connected to SM10 and no problems.
    #26
  7. gtj

    gtj Adventurer

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    Thanks for this. A neat looking setup.
    How did you find the security of the mounting for the battery and unit?
    #27
  8. bighopper

    bighopper Been here awhile

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    Not sure if your asking about the SENA system or the Montana. But I had no issues with either Sena systems on the 1150GSA or the SMH10R mounted on my Neotec helmet in the 6,000kls we did.

    The Montana I have had 1 year & have had no issues with the battery, but then I did the ear plug on the battery from the start.

    Only issue I have is the security screw on the rugged mount failed this trip, so I'll be doing the fix mentioned here some weeks ago. Might even do the rugged mount on the LT that way I can save some weight & not have to carry the Garmin Special Screw Driver :rofl.
    #28
  9. gtj

    gtj Adventurer

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    Thanks for the info. I was referring to the mounting of the SMH10R. Looks like it is an adhesive mounting. With 6,000 km on your setup I assume it is solid.

    Yes, my security screw failed me as well. Plan to do the modification along the lines described.

    Thanks Again.
    #29
  10. gtj

    gtj Adventurer

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    Where would the "choke" be placed? The intercomm system is self contained unit and operates with Bluetooth tecnology. The GPS unit is self contained unit as well, but it does have a 12 volt power wire. Would there be any advantage to installing a "choke" on the 12 volt wire? Also by "choking" out some RF waves, would I be decreasing the effectiveness of either the intercomm or the GPS? Sorry for my ignorance here.
    #30
  11. Emmbeedee

    Emmbeedee Procrastinators

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    Scala's response on Facebook was to say "Hi Mike, please contact our support team at Phone: +1 412 788-4533 or via e-mail support@cardosystems.com"

    But another person confirmed this interference problem between the G9 and the Montana today:

    "We drove a graveltour this weekend . Tre bikes with new G9 and garmin Montana . And sorry to say..it didnt work out well. It looks like G9 block Montanans satelite connection. We test to turn of G9 and then Montanan works like it should. We have also test with G4 and in our amatour test it looks like that kombo works wll too. Have Cardo scala rider any soluition for this?"

    It would be interesting to see if the G9 causes interference with other gps units. Seems odd if it only affects the Montana.
    #31
  12. intr1gue

    intr1gue Been here awhile

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    Man, I thought I was bonkers when this happened to me a couple weeks ago, but good to know at least ONE other person's having the same problem.

    So far my diagnosis efforts:
    • on bike: Montana in satellite view, turn off G9 and watch Montana connect to multiple satellites within seconds. Turn G9 back on, watch Montana lose contact with 6 satellites completely, lose most of signal strength with remaining four, and pop up Lost Satellite Reception notification window.
    • off bike (Garmin on table, G9 on table, no cradles or cables: Same results.

    Note that I tested this out OFF the bike as well; this means the choke idea below would likely not solve my problem, since the results were identical even without any cables connected to anything.

    Have emailed Scala, will call later today as well. I haven't tried it out with another G9 yet; if another G9 doesn't do this, then I'm gonna ask them to simply replace my G9 under warranty.

    updates as events warrant.

    #32
  13. intr1gue

    intr1gue Been here awhile

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    ...and the first response was not promising:

    To: Cardo Systems Customer Support
    Subject: G9 interferes with Garmin Montana GPS receiver?

    Hello,

    I have a Scala Rider G9 I purchased from a local retailer in mid June, and two weeks ago when using it with my Garmin Montana 600 I noticed that the Garmin was not connecting to satellites. I've since confirmed that the Garmin will connect to satellites just fine as long the G9 is not turned on. When the G9 is turned on, however, the Garmin's reception drops from 10-12 satellites at near full strength down to 2-3 satellites with marginal strength.

    I'm not sure what to do. I've run all the updates on both devices and they're both running the latest firmware and software versions, and I've tested this in numerous environments, even off the bike to ensure it's not an RF issue related to antenna lengths.

    Help?

    Ranjan

    On Fri, Jul 26, 2013 at 12:13 PM, Cardo Systems Customer Support <support@cardosystems.com> wrote:
    Hello Ranjan,

    Thank you for contacting the Cardo Systems Support Center.

    Unfortunately we don’t have any suggestions that would allow you to resolve this issue as the devices may be interfering with each other.

    Please feel free to contact us if we can assist you with any other questions.

    Best Regards,

    Geoff Grey
    Customer Service
    www.cardosystems.com
    +1 412.788.4533
    +1 800.488.0363

    to: Cardo
    Actually, the G9 is the one interfering with the Garmin. The Garmin can't interfere with the G9; it's a receiver, it transmits no signal, and has no Bluetooth functions. This is not an acceptable response.
    #33
  14. Emmbeedee

    Emmbeedee Procrastinators

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    That's a tough one - I wonder if their new series, the Q3, is also disrupting the gps signal?
    #34
  15. intr1gue

    intr1gue Been here awhile

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    OK, so since I bought the Montana from Touratech here in Seattle, and they also sell the G9, I thought I'd pop down to them and have a chat. Their G9's and mine all had the same effect on both my Montana, their Montanas, and also a GPSMap 60 and 62 series. TT guys were a little stunned; this has never been a problem for them, and it's likely because of the distance between their heads and their GPSs.

    I ride with my GPS on the left handlebar; I'm a short guy w short arms so mounting the GPS dead center over the gauges would be too far, and dead center on the handlebar clamp would interfere with my view of the gauges.

    So, with positioning in mind, I rode out this weekend with my gf, and swapped her g4 for my g9; no problems arose, and the GPS worked just fine.

    Recommendation: Move GPS further away and not on the same side as the G9.

    Called Scala and they were confused but helpful on the phone. Recommended an update, which I ran while they were on the phone; now upgraded to internal SW version 1.5, which may address the problem; I'll test it out sometime this weekend.

    #35
  16. Emmbeedee

    Emmbeedee Procrastinators

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    Thanks for doing that. Maybe if more people and especially dealers know about the potential problem, it might get fixed.

    Might be interesting to try the Montana with an external antenna to see if that alleviates the problem.
    #36
  17. _cy_

    _cy_ Long timer

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    bummer about lack of antennae support on Montana .. when I informed Garmin about this issue .. they acted like it was not their problem. since my Montana just went pass one year and out of warranty
    #37
  18. Emmbeedee

    Emmbeedee Procrastinators

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    Huh? This is not a broken antenna issue. I just thought an external one might not pick up Scala radio interference.
    #38
  19. Coastal Beemer

    Coastal Beemer Loven Adventuren

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    To add a little more info. I have experienced the loss of satellites two or three times on my Montana. It has just enough to be a minor irritation. I am using a G4 and a radar detector. On my last 1,000 mile trip, I experienced it for a very short time. The radar detector was not on at that point since I was in Virginia. Whatever is going on is intermittent with me.
    #39
  20. Emmbeedee

    Emmbeedee Procrastinators

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    I've only ever heard of it happening on the G9. It's never happened on my Montana, or my wife's, and we're both using G4s.
    #40