Moto down in Guatemala - Need Advise (1100GS)

Discussion in 'GS Boxers' started by dwj - Donnie, Feb 10, 2013.

  1. dwj - Donnie

    dwj - Donnie Long timer

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    Hi!

    My normally very reliable 1996 R1100GS has had a few issues on this 6 weeks of a three month tour. First it was the Halls Sensor and now, I believe the fuel pump has went bad. You can hear it come on when the key is turned on, but it acts like it is not getting fuel. One problem that has been found during the past few days is that the screen before the fuel pump has come apart and the red lining that BMW put inside the tank is flacking off and stopping up the screen from the inside. Is there alternative fuel pumps for this moto. I am in San Juan Ostuncalco, Guatemala. Thanks!

    Donnie
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  2. dwj - Donnie

    dwj - Donnie Long timer

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    I just found where I had Book Marked a Thread on a replacement pump. Now if I can find one here and hope that it it actually the problem!

    Another question. I looked for a replacement fuel filter this morning and all I could find was a clear plastic unit with a paper filer inside. Will this function correctly inside the tank. It seems to me if the gas from the inside don't hurt it, gas from the outside won't. But, will it contain the fuel pressure of the pump?
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  3. mouthfulloflake

    mouthfulloflake Not afraid

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  4. MC_Collector

    MC_Collector Riding Again!

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    Hi Donnie,

    If you find a fuel filter made for fuel injection it might work. Fuel pumps for engines with carbs operate at pressures typically <= ~ 5psi, while every fuel injection system I've looked at operates between 40-50 psi. Generally FI Fuel filters have metal housings to withstand the higher pressure. You probably wouldn't want to be riding the thing if it ruptured from overpressure. I've read about cleaning out tanks by putting stuff in it and shaking it a long time like maybe bb's, a few handfuls of metal nuts, or gravel might even work so long as you could get it all out. Sort of a manual bead blasting....

    I still have the pressure gauge for your old Corvette. If you can get one in the discharge side of the pump, it would tell you if it's making enough pressure. Generally > 40 psi is reguired to make it run right. The caveat here is the only ones I've had any issue with are on GM car engines.

    The flaking material would make me suspect the filter first
    #4
  5. vintagerider

    vintagerider Long timer

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    You've seen crackhead's thread? If you can not locate that Bosh kit in Guatemala then have someone over-night it to you. It's pretty light. I would pressure wash the inside of the tank. By-pass the in-tank filter with a suitable jumper such as a piece of steel brake tube. Fit Wix 33323 externally to the rear abs line mount hole using the supplied clamp.
    [​IMG]


    Time required to take r-r pump plate and clean tank is just a couple of hours if you have the parts. I have new in-box spares if you need them.

    Use posi-lok red barrels inside tank if you don't have a soldering iron.

    IMO there isn't a good substitution for the filter inside the tank. PP use one that is not rated for injection and doing so can lead to plugged injectors. The Wix is 10 micron and has plenty of spare capacity. You can also mount it to the rear, under the rear porter. The forward facing pump plate nipple is your pump output. That goes to the external filter then on to the black nylon fuel distributor inlet. Pump outlet pressure should be capable of 100 lph at 50 psi. The air box mounted regulator is pre- set to 43 1/2 psi. Lots of pumps can supply this but only a few mount well to the 11xx pump plate.

    Jot down the do's, don'ts and common mistakes before you begin such as not busting off tank studs or using only submersible rated hose inside the tank and you will be fine.
    #5
  6. Mudcat

    Mudcat Unregistered

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    There is supposed to be a good BMW mechanic in <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:smarttags" /><st1:place><st1:City>Antigua</st1:City>, <st1:country-region>Guatemala</st1:country-region></st1:place>, if that is any use too you. I know you would rather fix it yourself.
    Below is a link to the thread where he was used, post 7
    <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:eek:ffice" /><o:p> </o:p>
    http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=856765<o:p></o:p>
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  7. H96669

    H96669 A proud pragmatist.

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    Darn that liner, had enough problems with that years ago. Removing the rest can be a real pita if you don't have access to the right products.

    Down there, I'd look up a radiator shop, they may be able to help you if just to clean the tank.

    DIY and not tested by myself, apparently good old vinegar will work altough it may take a few days and you may have to toss a few screws in there and shake.Better maybe if you can find cleaning/stripping vinegar, it has a higher acetic acid content.

    I sure shaked a tank a lot back then, even drove around with it in the back of the car for days letting the accell/decell move the weighted "Kurly Kates" I had stuck in there.

    The filter sock, that's not all that much good at filtering, you may have plugged the pump itself but if it still runs I'd look at cleaning/flushing it first and some bench testing. Plugged fuel filter well....just removed one such from a BMW at half the recommended milleage.Not that good for the pump and now I am worried.:cry

    Anyway, quite a lot of info on the net as how to deal with the "Redcoat", lots on here:

    https://www.google.ca/search?source....1983.2-1j1j2j1.5.0...0.0...1ac.1.iZNILDkj-dI
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  8. dwj - Donnie

    dwj - Donnie Long timer

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    The pump and filter have been replaced. That was not the problem! A mechanic is going to look at it this morning, plus I have a person lined up to haul it to the BMW Store in Guatemala City. Guatemala City is only 110 miles from my location.
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  9. dwj - Donnie

    dwj - Donnie Long timer

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    But in the mean time, I am staying in a fairly nice hotel for $10 per day. Three good meals per day, including steak cost $7, so all is good! :D:D
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  10. dwj - Donnie

    dwj - Donnie Long timer

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    It seems to me to only run a bit on one cylinder, but I don't know which one. Every now and then for a split second it will hit on both. If you try to give it throttle, it dies instantly.
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  11. mouthfulloflake

    mouthfulloflake Not afraid

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    verify fuel flow, Roger_04 s method is likely the easiest to do where you are.

    maybe this will help

    http://bmwsporttouring.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=790010#Post790010

    http://www.streamlineleaders.com/images/fuelfix10.JPG[/img

    [img]http://www.streamlineleaders.com/images/fuelfix11.JPG

    [​IMG]

    quote from Robert at the above link:

    I ran the motorcycle for 60 seconds and collected 3 lbs. 13 oz. of fuel which equates to 0.64 gallons (6 lbs. per gallon), which translates to 145 liters per hour. Much better than the pump spec of 110 l/h and easily 3 times the amount required to produce full power. Every 10 minutes the pump runs 5 gallons of fuel through the system.

    Thinking back on the failure of my system and the multiple cracks in the hose. I suspect that my system was running fine with some leaks but then one opened to the point where there was little to no fuel pressure. If I'd been measuring pressure and volume once a year I might have caught this long ago.

    The 145 l/h will serve as a baseline for future measurement to assess the health of the fuel delivery system including pump, filter and internal hose condition.

    As a side note, the new pump is noticeably quieter than the old one. Also the engine is noticeably smoother (am I imagining this?) Which I believe is due to the better injector matching (< 2%) after cleaning.


    LINK TO HIS ORIGINAL POST

    http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=806681
    #11
  12. Dan Cãta

    Dan Cãta Long timer

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    Donnie,

    I have already been where you are now with your bike. It was the same, a 1100 gs. I have tried everything and all should be OK, but the bike ran like crap. It would idle fine and when twisting the throttle, it would die.

    The problem was the fuel filter. The owner had some paint on the inside of the tank. It was as if someone put in there 1 liter of paind and twist the tank on all sides so that it would get covered on the inside. Needless to say that the paint came off.

    He said the he already replaced the fuel filter, so I left that one alone. After a while, I opened the tank again and cleaned ALL the paint on the inside and put in a new filter. The bike then ran as new :)

    Dan.
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  13. dwj - Donnie

    dwj - Donnie Long timer

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    I have pretty much gotten all of the loose paint out of the tank and then installed a new fuel pump, including the pre-filter and a new fuel filter. It changed nothing.
    #13
  14. mouthfulloflake

    mouthfulloflake Not afraid

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    If you are confident in the tank internal parts, then maybe some tank liner got lodged in an injector?

    try to hook a 9volt battery to an injector and open it, and then spray cleaner or compressed air through it.

    maybe that will fix it?
    #14
  15. Dan Cãta

    Dan Cãta Long timer

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    Yes, my bad.

    Forgot to add that I also cleaned the injectors in a ultrasound cleaning shop.

    Dan.
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  16. H96669

    H96669 A proud pragmatist.

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    Fuel injectors....most if not all have a filter screen at the fuel inlet. Yes the 9V battery will open them and back flush with cleaners can clear them to some extent. Not sure that I'd use really strong cleaners such as carb cleaners, they may eat the internal seals. Brake cleaner???

    [​IMG]

    Internally degrading fuel lines or even the wrong type of lines can certainly plug them filters.:eek1
    #16
  17. Dan Cãta

    Dan Cãta Long timer

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    That is why you should take the injectors to professional cleaning. Besides doing a good job, they can take measurements, tell you if they were clogged and most importantly, tell you if there is any difference between them.

    Dan.
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  18. vintagerider

    vintagerider Long timer

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    Check the TPS! A bad one will cause Motronic to enter a limp home mode the symptoms of which mimic fueling problems very closely.

    Corroded electrical connectors at TPS and injectors?

    Leaky intake manifolds. If original will almost certainly require replacement. New ones have improved seal.

    Ignition,kill switch and ignition key sub sub harness.
    #18
  19. dwj - Donnie

    dwj - Donnie Long timer

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    The plan is to take it to the BMW Shop in Guatemala city tomorrow.
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  20. dwj - Donnie

    dwj - Donnie Long timer

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    Anyone know of a cheap hotel close to the BMW Shop in Guatemala City? I will be going there in the morning.
    #20