Moto Guzzi Monza.....

Discussion in 'Old's Cool' started by Voltaire, Feb 6, 2013.

  1. Voltaire

    Voltaire Bored Of The Rings

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    I have always liked Moto Guzzis but never owned one, and they are getting pricy here in New Zealand. I've never really looked at the smaller bikes but having bought a BMW R65 last year I was pleasantly surprised now practical and fun it was.
    last September a Moto Guzzi Monza appeared on Trade Me ( like Craigs List/Ebay) and it was about 5 minutes away......:evil
    I went for 'a look'...
    The seller thought got it off the previous owner who had not used it in 10 years, he's taken it to the Guzzi dealer who like a lot of motorcycle shops here went under.....he managed to get it back off the receivers.
    The mufflers were off but he said it ran, just would not move...." probably the clutch or summit...."
    Oh well, if nothing else I could get it going and then decicde what to do with it..... money changed hands and bike was brought home under cover of darkness...:evil
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    I found a manual and parts book for a V50 on the net and when time allowed I had a look at why there was no drive.
    There is a small round hole like BMW's for doing the timeing and I could see the clutch operating...so I took off the rear wheel..
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    So....why would there be bolts missing from the brake disc.
    On the brake disc, its inboard and the wheel has a cush drive in it.
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    The manual showed a crown wheel but none was present.
    I rang the local Guzzi guy and he said they were VERY expensive, Ebay sort of said the same...
    At that point I put it all in a box and pushed it back in the corner.....:cry
    That was in September.......
    #1
  2. huub

    huub Been here awhile

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    any drive box from a smallblock guzzi will fit,
    they all have the same gearing.
    shouldnt be too hard to find one on ebay
    #2
  3. Voltaire

    Voltaire Bored Of The Rings

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    This is true, but Ebay seems to have changed since I first was buying and selling worldwide in 2000....there seems to be very little used bits and the ones there are a priced " there if you need them"..and the rest is just an on line $2 shop.....with eye watering postage.

    So..... a couple of weeks later after getting a copy of Guzziology ( a great read) I pulled off the swing arm and shaft.....


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    Clearing a combinaton of neglect and Guzzi's take of BMW's shaft not needing an oil bath......
    Then I had a look on German Ebay.....lots of used bits there.:clap
    #3
  4. chris a

    chris a Been here awhile

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    I'm in on this one !
    Looks like that was abused !The missing gears were probably even worse...
    They do not like anything less than 80/140 hypoy in there.
    Nice little bikes - by the look of the drive shaft you'll be looking at new head bearings too.
    Second hand drive boxes for small blocs are pretty cheap as a rule- try one of the guzzi specialist breakers like reboot guzzi or gutzibits.
    #4
  5. huub

    huub Been here awhile

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    the Uj is a standard size , should be easy to find the parts if you want to rebuild it
    oh and do yourself a favour, and fit a steel sleeve inside the gearbox where the UJ fits in the gearbox,
    if you dont , you will be looking for a gearbox when a UJ fails,
    #5
  6. Voltaire

    Voltaire Bored Of The Rings

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    Thanks for info, I had not heard of the steel sleeve. I heard the ring gear bolt/washer arrangement is also an issue, are the bolts special?
    cheers
    John
    #6
  7. Voltaire

    Voltaire Bored Of The Rings

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    I found a drive in Germany last October and he he had a shaft too.... " would you post to New Zealand? " " yes no problem"
    Paid with Paypal and then waited......and waited.......after about 3 weeks I asked for the tracking number.......heard nothing.....bugger.....and other rude words.
    Then after about 5 weeks got an email with the tracking number.....when I entered it in came up Oslo....... re-entered yep Olso in Norway......
    I got hold of the seller.....oopps...... posted to wrong place....do you want to wait or get a refund? Given it was a pretty good deal I went for the former.....and waited....
    In the meantime found that the shocks could be pulled apart.... usual black splooge inside....
    Much the same as some Konis I did but without the adjustment on the damping.
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    Swingarm is pretty neat, pivots off the rear of the gear box and its a nice alloy casting. The paint was knackered so off it comes.
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    #7
  8. Box'a'bits

    Box'a'bits In need of repair

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    Looks like a cool little project. :D Will this replace the R50 racer?
    #8
  9. Voltaire

    Voltaire Bored Of The Rings

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    No probably replace the Yamaha 200 scooter as back up 'work hack' to the R65. ( as the scooter rego is the same as under 600cc bike :cry)
    It actually been a cool project as I like hunting down parts, reading up, googleing, dismantling, figuring out stuff....
    I have only spent the bare minimum as they are not worth much here.... maybe 2.5-3k on a good day.

    How are you, on the mend ?
    #9
  10. mtiberio

    mtiberio Adventurer

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    love the monza... whereas the lario is a mini Lemans IV, the monza was a mini Lemans III and better looking that any of them IMHO...

    hang in there, be patient, get your parts. it will be worth it...
    #10
  11. Voltaire

    Voltaire Bored Of The Rings

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    thanks for the positive comments....I need them....

    Forks:

    removed the forks, and drained what was in them....
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    The caps were a bit....crusty and the bit above the vise jaws did not want to move :cry
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    I only have an early V50 manual and Guzziology talks of 'cartridge" damper units.

    I can't get the lower part of the top off as yet, tried some heat.....no wanna go.

    Thinking seals, fork oil and put them back on......

    Are the early ones conventional damper rod forks or do I need to get new damper units..... ?:eek1

    The steering head bearings ...balls....were all nicely greased like it was done recently.....as unlikey as this seems.

    I have't see ball races since a T110 I restored 20 years ago...... Mr DeTomaso and Tonti were sure on a budget.
    #11
  12. tenelson

    tenelson n00b

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    #12
  13. chris a

    chris a Been here awhile

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    And the mark up on replacement cups and cones is more than considerable!
    Good to see your cracking on...
    #13
  14. th_01

    th_01 n00b

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    Voltaire

    HOLY CRAP. The deeper into the bike the worse it gets. Looks like this project is growing in costs exponentially.
    There is an expression in poker. "Know when to hold them and know when to fold them.":D

    IMHO I always ask myself why am I taking this project on? Extra time? Extra money? Emotional attachment to the machine? BTW I have 2 $10K+ :puke1rebuilt bikes. My original 1976 T-3 , now a cafe bike and a 1973 Eldorado (modified)

    There are lots of classic, running Moto Guzzs down under. You may be well advised to seek out another candidate. Preferably one that is running.

    Go to www.mgnoc.com and join the wildguzzi forum. Lots of knowledgeable MG owners actively on the list willing to help. Look up Pete Roper on your continent.:clap


    Good Luck

    Tom in Boston,MA
    MA Rep MGNOC
    #14
  15. manxkipper

    manxkipper Fishpistel

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    It certainly looks bad from my vantage point. However the pleasure you will get from getting it sorted seems to offset the costs somehow. I priced a reconditioned magdyno for my latest project at 1200 GBP. Takes your breath away initially.

    Good luck and enjoy. Guzzies are great fun.
    #15
  16. huub

    huub Been here awhile

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    actually the project doesnt seem too bad so far , i am used to finding way more junk parts in the bikes i buy.
    probably says something about the project bikes i tend to buy. :D

    if the fork cartridges are shot ( you just managed to dismantle them ,i never even tried. ) new ones are 40 euro/pair over here. might be slightly more down under,but probably still cheap.
    one of the reasons why i end up with a shed fullof guzzi's , parts are cheap, and available.
    try that with a ducati....
    #16
  17. Voltaire

    Voltaire Bored Of The Rings

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    Its not as bad as it looks.....:evil
    last night I got the cartridge apart....it looks like one that holds hatchbacks open on cars.....was empty and felt rough....I pumped some ATF thru them and that seemed to make it better....but the shaft seal is worn out.....
    I have a set of Lansdowne cartidges for my Commando with rebound on one leg and compression with the other.... hmmmm. Looked at the FAC ones.... $300 US....... might go for a set of stock ones for the moment.
    My internet keeps dropping out...dang...got more rusty worn part pics to load up.:rofl
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    Next the UV rebuild
    #17
  18. Voltaire

    Voltaire Bored Of The Rings

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    It all presses apart quite easlily if you follow Guzziology.

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    Next the Swingarm bearings
    #18
  19. Morizzi

    Morizzi Been here awhile

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  20. Voltaire

    Voltaire Bored Of The Rings

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    Been a while, over the summer working on the house, keeping the BMW R90 track ready for classic racing the Monza got neglected, mind you no where near as much a previously.
    Dismantled the forks and steering head.

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    The forks were to use a local expression munted.
    chromed needed doing, new cartridges were needed, and so on....
    I put them back together in the mean time.
    The steering head rotates on some bicycle bearings that Moto Guzzi must have got in a job lot from the English.....last time I saw that arrangement was on a 1958 T110 I restored in the early 90's.
    I put it all back together with new grease and hoped that it was going to be nice and smooth.
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    There are 3 brembo P05 calipers, small versions of the ones used on Ducatis and big block Guzzis ( Guzzi jargon :D)
    The local Guzzi guy said there are no parts available, the internet suggested otherwise. Steve at Bevel Heaven had all the parts as Pantah use them too.
    The pistons did not want to come out after 10 years of sitting...
    Used the old grease gun trick and they came apart easily.
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    After rebuilding the calipers I put the whole thing back together and got it running and rideable.
    The motor always ran but responded well to a carb clean, points and advance fettle, oil change etc.
    Took it for a test run down the street and around the block and around the block again.... wow that V twin sound sure is nice.
    That was back in Jan/Feb and since then I have been pondering about the forks and the steering head.
    Trawled the net and found that you could get a taper roller conversion, also found that V65 forks would fit.
    Eventually found a reasonably priced set on Ebay Germany and post was very reasonable.
    My engineer friend made up a set of taper bearing housing that press into the frame, just need a longer steering head pin.
    Well, as luck would have it the V65 forks came with a triple tree and the pin is longer :clap
    [​IMG]
    Did a trial assembly this week and it all looks to work, realised that I need a 15mm longer axle and a spacer.
    At this stage I'm going to run with handlebars as the top clamp has the fittings and get the bike complied and back on the road.
    #20