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Discussion in 'Moto Bellissima: All Other Dualsports' started by young skywalker, Jan 8, 2006.
could the V7 frame support all of which is being suggested?
My biggest concern would be the subframe and if it could support the luggage, especially offroad. I've never seen a V7 stripped of bodywork, so I wouldn't even want to speculate if it's up to the task.....
I had a 650 NTX; my wife had a 650TT. A big advantage (or not?) of using a current small-block bike in an ADV machine would be the fuel injection system, assuming it can be remapped for more low-down torque.
One issue to consider is that the gearbox casing is part of the frame, and that the swingarm pivots on the casing too. So you'd need to fab up a stronger swingarm pivot. One that's in line with the UJ would be good, to maintain drive-line length during rear-wheel travel.
Also, adding longer rear shocks will make the UJ spins in an inclined position all the time - you really need a dual UJ rear end.
Sticking on the monster forks from the Stelvio defeats the object - I'd be looking for something off about a 530 KTM as a maximum; the BMW 650 guys use Yamaha 450 forks.
Ditto sticking the small-block motor in the Stelvio frame - all that would do is save about 50lbs and cut power in half.
There is no "sub-frame" on the small-blocks - at least not in the older ones - it's steel tubing all the way to the rear seat & mudguard mount.
If they're stiill using bicycle ball-bearings in the steering head, I'd use taper-rollers, I prefer 21" front wheels and an alloy bash-plate would be the work of minutes for a competent sheet-metal worker.
Any thoughts on whether the California 1400's engine will make it into the Stelvio?
Why would you want to do this?
The small block has no CARC. It's got a standard swingarm and bevel box. They used modified versions in Dakar 20 years ago, so they can handle a little more travel.
I don't think this mythical 750NTX needs the USD 45mm Marzocchi.
H+B already make racks for the V7, so I don't think luggage will be an issue.
No. No way the small block chassis can handle any off road...
(rear drive is from the Tonti California on both of these, with a custom swingarm).
correct me if I'm wrong, but 21" front & 18" rear....
or would it be better for most to be 19" front & 17" rear..
The 2012 appears to be on par power-wise with my 2005 GS. I would want a bit more.
They must be sporting that new weightless, "invisible luggage" that I heard NASA was working on......
The small frame can take lots of luggage. I haven't tried hard-core offroading, but I do some gravel and dirt paths heavy loaded with 2 big Junior panniers (40L each) and I haven't had any issue whatsoever.
And by the way, some folks in Paris haven't waited for Guzzi to release their V7 scrambler and tuned their owns:
More pictures and info on this spanish forum thread:
I really still think it depends on the expected purpose for this V7 Stelvio NTX type bike.
If it's for the type of riding Rocker shows in the pictures above, I'd be more inclined to look for bikes like James Adams showed in his picture on Page 237, Post #3553. Call them 90 (off-road)/10 (on-road) bikes -- street legal motorcross bikes that can be used (in a pinch) for back woods camping trips with strap-on bags and bungee cords. I saw a lot of those at the AdvRiders West Fest in Darby, MT in '11. Most were either owned/ridden by somewhat local people or came in on trailers.
If, on the other hand, the expected purpose is something similar to the NTX but lighter in weight, then IMO, that's a different bike. That's more an 90 (on-road)/10 (off-road) bike where the off-road stuff is not quite as "rough". That bike will be more robust, designed for sustained highway speeds, have more permanent luggage carrying capability, more rider protection from the elements and will be larger/longer for possible two-up riding. As a result it will be heavier. It will probably be up close to the Quota, which I think is in the 550# range.
Last, for calibration purposes, the Trax rear cases on my NTX weigh 11# each, add ~4# each for mounting, total for the system ~30#. Center stand ~20#.
Your image isn't showing up, but thanks for the link. This one is quite is nice!
SM, I love that bike. It looks like there is a Triumph Bonneville behind it.
The swingarm pivots on these bikes are obscured by the riders' feet - but they do not pivot on the gearbox hosing like the standard small-blocks do - there's a chunky extension to the frame in that area!
The rear drive can be from any Tonti-framed Guzzi, not just the California - and there are a variety of crown-wheel & pinion ratios available for them too. However, the rear drives are HEAVY - and it's unsprung mass too.
Yep, the original 650 TT & NTX models had 21/18" and they worked well; as of now, getting tyres isn't an issue; 19/17" just makes the bike less dirt-worthy.
Whatever for? Are you of, ahem, "Generous proportions" or do you regularly tote a tame hippo and her luggage interstate? Perhaps you'd more usefully consider a Ford F350 turbo-diesel instead?
The standard Stelvio can cruise at well over 100 mph all day long (you do have speed limits where you live, right?) and has enough power that if you bothered, you'd be spinning the wheel well into fifth gear on dirt: all that achieves is a waste of rear tyres, a cloud of dust for your riding buddies and means you arrive at the scene of the crash first.
Morbid obesity isn't a reason for more horse power. I'm "generously proportioned" so that with gear and luggage I'll exceed the payload capacity of my bike slightly. But even limited to 25kW (thats 34bhp) that's plenty to break our national speed limit to a degree that I'd instantly lose my license. And while I agree that overtaking is a chore if you are fat and burdened with that lack of power, 100bhp is plenty to undertake the most stupid of overtaking maneuvers.
Just had to post. Despite it being cold today, I jumped on the Stelvio for a ride. I hadn't ridden in about two weeks because I was out of town. All I did was just some running around...beyond a couple errands, I had no particular destination in mind.
I love my Stelvio. Fun, comfortable, it sounds great, it handles well, it's stable at speed, and it never fails to generate a conversation when I stop. Just a fantastic bike!
Oh Lordy, Lordy!