Mystery Power Outage 84 R80

Discussion in 'Airheads' started by Sutherngintelmen, Nov 4, 2012.

  1. Bill Harris

    Bill Harris Confirmed Curmudgeon

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    Still, the rotor is readily available from Rick and I'm getting an spare to carry when I go transcontinental.

    --Bill
    #21
  2. hardwaregrrl

    hardwaregrrl ignore list

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    I realize that Bill, but if switching from a stock system with a known good rotor, its an extra expense and something to point out when making a descison.
    #22
  3. photomd

    photomd Been here awhile

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    Mine did something similar on the stock system: charging would drop as it got warm, but not bad enough to show any problem when cold. I checked the entire system several times and installed two new batteries. In the garage, everything looked good. Then I used a heat gun to heat my rotor. The resistance opened up to infinity with heat and was reproducible...might be worth checking.
    #23
  4. Sutherngintelmen

    Sutherngintelmen around the bend

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    Seven hours on the bike and battery was electric. I added ADVMonster's voltometer (which I really like for peace of mind) and 1" of electrical tape to cracked casing wire under the hood (2:00 above the rotor.) Volt reading is a bit off multimeter but maybe because I didn't run the ground back to batt :dunno

    I didn't run the PIAAs :thumb I had all in case- with stupid light Shorai, jump cables, bivvy and new aaa card. Beautiful day up there, the very last little bit of Fall. Had some gates open for hunters, saw some new places too.

    Still going for Omega 450. :1drink

    Ready

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    On board

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    Trail's end

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    Back in shed

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    #24
  5. hardwaregrrl

    hardwaregrrl ignore list

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    Nice! You'l get an exact reading if you run the voltmeter back to the battery, but it;s close enough:thumb
    #25
  6. Sutherngintelmen

    Sutherngintelmen around the bend

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    Speaking of readings.....

    I am running the 'blue lead' back to pos on the batt and tapped ground behind lamp. I'm going to test gauge ground to neg batt and see if it gets all the way to multi meter - curiosity.

    Volts read 13.9 - 14.1 almost all the day. As long as I was on the throttle or engine brakes above 2k revs volts were good. And I looked a lot.

    Multi meter has been compared with another multi meter and I believe accurate. So, I'm .1 to .2 v > ADVmonster reading at the batt (pretty sure.)

    Battery was hot last night ~ 13v and still is this eve.

    I didn't press the PIAA button until I was in sight of the house. :D It knocked v down by .4 Math doesn't work for me - even though experience did.

    If you believe the gauges, charge with PIAAs lit volts at batt would be 13.6 to 13.8. Seems plenty to keep a batt going let alone the absolute and complete death it suffered after 45 mins of road revving. :pep

    Omega 450.:tb
    #26
  7. Other Bob

    Other Bob Been here awhile

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    That's a confusing inconsistency, so maybe it's a clue. Compare it with this info, copied from the Omega site:


    "Another refinement the Omega now offers is a fail-safe parallel circuit provided for the generator warning light bulb. On the original Bosch system design, the warning light circuit supplies the exciter current to the alternator rotor. If the circuit is interrupted by a blown bulb or a failed rotor winding or worn out brushes, the red light won't come on with the key and the alternator WILL NOT CHARGE ! Unfortunately, BMW nor Bosch ever seemed to really emphasize this important information. Even though bulb failures are actually very rare, it can be a real show stopper if you aren't aware that a red light that doesn't come on means a problem, just as surely as a red light that stays on all the time."

    I would add 'poor/loose/intermittent connection' to the list of things that keep idiot bulbs from glowing and rotors from being excited. Perhaps the light chose not to glow during the ...


    ... because of an intermittant connection which tested fine later (thus, appeared 'operational'), and also worked fine on your most recent ride. Now that pattern is consistent with an intermittent electrical problem. They suck.


    It sounds like the Omega's parallel circuit will at least bypass/moot the consequence of a bad idiot bulb circuit, and might even mask the symptom itself with higher output at lower rpm's (i.e., never triggering the light, even at idle, even with a good bulb circuit - I don't know, maybe Bill Harris can comment).

    If you've already committed to the purchase then it's probably not worth digging into ... unless you want to know why the &#@*! you just had to spend $_____ to replace perfectly good parts because of a &#@*!'ing bad bulb connection. I feel your pain.

    Schweeet bike, though!

    Bob
    #27
  8. hardwaregrrl

    hardwaregrrl ignore list

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    ....you should come see us here.
    #28
  9. Sutherngintelmen

    Sutherngintelmen around the bend

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    That's a great idea - is there a drop off option. :ear :lol3

    I could come back from out of town and be all zapped up with Omega 450. :norton

    Sounds like a great time - only thing missing is a band. :freaky
    #29
  10. Sutherngintelmen

    Sutherngintelmen around the bend

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    Thanks - I really like it.

    Thanks for the ideas too. A friend of mine sent me his Clasic Boxer Charging and I'm reading up on the finer points of how these pieces work in prep for more thorough go through along with Omega upgrade.

    Just need a rainy day in December. Will take lots of pics so you guys can point out my FUps :lol3
    #30
  11. Bill Harris

    Bill Harris Confirmed Curmudgeon

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    The Alternator Light bulb only comes into play when the engine is first started and provides the initial excitation of the rotor. Otherwise it's just along for the ride and sometimes provides fault diagnosis for the rotor and/or diode board. The bulb leads an easy life and rarely goes out (though I make it a point to carry a spare in the headlight shell). As an initial exciter, it's not even 100% necessary since the residual magnetism in the rotor could provide the intial excitation (but that's iffy). The Omega "parallel circuit" is simply a 330 ohm, 1/2W resistor placed in parallel with the Alternator light bulb. It's an old, old trick, been used for years. This way if the bulb expires there will still be excitation.

    Nothing will prevent bad wires and bad connections. Nothing, of course, except the vigilance of the owner... :deal

    --Bill
    #31
  12. Sutherngintelmen

    Sutherngintelmen around the bend

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    Omega 450 has shipped!!!! :freaky :clap :thumb :pynd
    #32
  13. disston

    disston ShadeTreeExpert

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    We had one at the Spring Tech Day this last Spring in Maryland. Ken removed his instruments to send them off for repair but still had to ride the bike home. Seemed the distance was enough that he might make it or might not with out the battery charging. The alternator came on and he had charging all the way home.

    Gotta love residual magnetism.
    #33
  14. Sutherngintelmen

    Sutherngintelmen around the bend

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    Nice to know the road won't end if the light goes out.

    Look what star spangled santa brought me this afternoon. :D

    We'll see what I muck up tomorrow during install. :lol3

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    #34
  15. Sutherngintelmen

    Sutherngintelmen around the bend

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    Now, where was I?

    Tomorrow became today, but for the best of reasons. And the job is only part done.

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    I started the switch this evening. Directions that come with Omega 450 are great so gratuitous pics below are not a how to but more of a wtf. :lol3 I'm not good at this, just learning.

    This is the old regulator. There are some grounds running to the back fastener but new reg is plastic. I sanded paint from frame and added some dialectic grease.

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    Newly installed:

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    Cover off

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    Good time to make fun of me :lol3

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    This rotor popped off ez

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    5th gear and locked brake to remove the old.

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    Seal is sealed

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    Brushed off

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    Tomorrow's case:

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    #35
  16. hardwaregrrl

    hardwaregrrl ignore list

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    :thumb.
    #36
  17. Sutherngintelmen

    Sutherngintelmen around the bend

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    Hmmmm?

    I thought I was all wrapped up and ready to ride.

    I'm not getting gen light when the bike is switched on. Headlamp does work, oil pressure glows but something is not right. I didd not attempt to start the bike, and am about to take it back apart but thought I'd troll for ideas.

    "Final" wiring

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    #37
  18. Sutherngintelmen

    Sutherngintelmen around the bend

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    Never mind - just a bit nervous here. :D

    I started video camera before I switched ignition - didn't want to miss a youtube moment. :lol3

    Went back to handy diagram which prompted still in 5th gear not neutral. It's lit now :evil


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    #38
  19. Sutherngintelmen

    Sutherngintelmen around the bend

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    Seems properly done! :clap
    #39
  20. Sutherngintelmen

    Sutherngintelmen around the bend

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    Went out for an hour this afternoon, urban stuff. Charger is behaving well so I beleive the job's done proper. Big thanks to you guys for all of the help along the way. :clap

    Next on the list is steering head bearings and fork boots, wish me luck. :lol3

    Couple more pics of the last few steps:

    I wasted lots of time here. Had a cracked casing on one of the brushes, decided to replace it but smallest diameter heat shrink (pictured) caused the wire to bind prior to brush reaching full extension.

    Opted to get some new brushes so spent as much in gas getting up to Norcross only to find 'new' stuff had no casing at all. This was pretty funny but not as funny as when I found the fresh (fully cased) brushes that shipped with Omega 450 buried under a layer of mess. F me! :fpalm I guess that's what happens when you open your presents and don't install them for a few weeks.

    I decided to go with originals as I'd spent the time 'fixing it' Anyone need a pair?

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    My soldering rivals my welding.

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    Rick suggests a biz card to assist keeping the brushes clear of rotor. Maybe it's Southern humidity but I had better luck with a snip of piss you off impossible to open without blood plastic packaging.

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    Thought I was about done here but needed to access the starter solenoid for red wire attachment (kept the original too as it was in reasonable condition.)

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    Yellow wire want for a spade but I clipped and used a ring. Zappy!

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    #40