NEW 2018 GOLD WING

Discussion in 'Road Warriors' started by slipknot, Jun 29, 2017.

  1. KMC1

    KMC1 There is no spoon.

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    I’d like to see Piaggio come out with an MP3 that uses the Goldwing engine, DCT, LIDAR, TC, ABS, CANBUS, LED, DVD, MTC, PFP, a gyroscope, remote start, lane guidance, Google Maps, Facebook integration and an optional roof / tourpak option with forced air induction to a twin scroll supercharger on an carbon fiber frame with in-frame gas tank utilizing the mass centralization philosophy. If they can get it under 400lbs and 180 HP, for around $15k, I’m totally buying it. :deal:beer
    Night Ryder, Rick G and CbDude like this.
  2. wannaklr

    wannaklr Long timer

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  3. Podman

    Podman Rocketman

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    Interesting that there is no weight difference between DCT and manual
    Only about an inch narrower
  4. Rick G

    Rick G Ranger Rick

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    Just described my dream bike! LOL

    Rick G
  5. Scooterdoodler

    Scooterdoodler Been here awhile

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    It's deterring me, and I can't sell my Indian Vintage fast enough. I love the bike, but the constant hosing by Indian for everything associated with the bike since day one has erroded my enthusiasm to the point where I just want 'out'.

    I swear, I'll never purchase another motorcycle for over $15,000, and probably a lot less.

    As for a 'fun' car, if I buy something like that, it won't take the place of my motorcycles, but be in addition to them.

    I guess I'm not a likely 2018 GL buyer.
    bobw and ARiderX like this.
  6. Scooterdoodler

    Scooterdoodler Been here awhile

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    Heck, if Suzuki would fit cruise control and heated grips to the 650 Burgman (ok, maybe bump it to 750cc's too), I could probably go for that as my 'tourer'. We owned two of those bikes, a 2006 and a 2007, and although we never used them as such, I always thought they would make a superb, solo, long-distance bike.
  7. Crilly

    Crilly Been here awhile

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    All the D models we’ll have ABS like the rest of the Honda line.
  8. KMC1

    KMC1 There is no spoon.

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    :lol3:clap
  9. ARiderX

    ARiderX Long timer

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    No one is saying a car is a motorcycle. The argument, as I read it, is about the value proposition. In the sense of "why are motorcycles so expensive". For the same money you can buy a fully equipped great car. Obviously the experience is not the same! The only explanation that comes to mind is 'economy of scale', but as a consumer I could care less about the reasons, it's about the numbers you see on the stickers...

    Everyone is different, and their ability to stretch and justify budgets as well, but it definitely deters me. Of course I've been salivating over those new HD softails for example. But at 20000 euro (!!) for a base model fat bob, that's just extreme. As far as vehicles go, that's expensive. That is enough for any fully loaded 1290 KTM (every version), full option GS, and almost a R1200RT. Not too mention cost of ownership down the line, which in Europe with HD is self inflicted robbery. I can afford all of those, but won't as it simply doesn't make any sort of sense anymore it todays market.

    I don't know, motorcycling used to be 'charming', not meant to cost you an arm and a leg with hyper complicated exaggerated machines. I've done some motorcycle soul searching in the past few years, and I've totally calmed down from the annual hype train that are all the new models. I used the be as exited as anyone else, and the marketing guys got me close every time to spending indiscriminately on the next new fancy shiny toy, but after some bad experiences with BMW and giving the 'motorcycling thing' a different place in my life (no more commuting), I'm just never going there again.

    I get that in the US triple digit annual salaries are a common thing, and most of you wouldn't bat an eye lid plonking down this cash for ... a motorcycle. And with the great distances over there it would actually make sense, I get it! But Europe is different. 30000 euro goldwings and K1600s are for 50 something year old weekend warrior accountants and doctors. These machines aren't used to a tenth of their potential. You could literally substitute it with a maxi scooter, and have the same experience.

    I agree that a downsized, efficient goldwing would make more sense right now. This 1800cc crap is so 20 years ago when bikes really were toys and over the top exercises in futility were celebrated. Today it's almost insulting to the buyers public, and completely retarded and ridiculous. I've read posts here asking for a 200HP 2L engine in the next goldwing. To do what exactly? At what point are you going to use that to it's full potential, ever? On a 800 pound single track vehicle? A few times in a straight line? Just because 'you can'... Yes motorcycles need to accelerate faster than cars, we all agree, and all of them do. You think a 1,2L properly engineered goldwing would leave you out-accelerated by a nissan juke? I don't think so.

    When I made the comparison earlier with that 1,2 turbo Nissan Qashqai, I caught a lot of grief, because apparently I was justifying 'slow' motorcycles. Way to miss the point there. if a 120HP 1,2 L is enough to propel a 1,4 TON car, it will DEFINITELY leave every regular car in the dust in a 0,4 TON vehicle. So downsizing is definitely possibly (won't happen, not holding my breath), but of course it would crush the bragging right and dick swinging of the typical motorcycle consumer base ("my bike has 200HP!!")

    This is also the reason I'm slowly turned off by todays motorcycle industry. Everything is way 'niched up' into very specific single purpose niches, and everything has to be everything to everyone at all times, making for expensive uncompromising experiments. So a goldwing has to carry 2 fat people and shitloads of gear, accelerate like a sport bike, have a 200+HP engine, run the twisties like a scooter, ... The result is an abomination. The goldwings up to 1985 or thereabout are perfect. Make a modern iteration of that, or split the line in a dreadnought class and 'retro/light' class. That 1200cc crosstourer thing is close, but too cruiser-y, and a bit low on amenities for the class of bike.

    I have a feeling most manufacturers (and consumers) are looking at motorcycles like super cars for the masses (ferrari, aston, porsche...) with the same complexity and luxury and extreme specs, but affordable for the general public. Thing is, I don't want super car complexity, reliability and maintenance costs. That's ok for the owner of an aston martin.

    Today, 'compromise' is a bad word, whereas to me it's a sign of great real-world engineering. It's always more difficult to make a 'balanced' product , a "total is greater than the sum of its parts" kinda design. I'm more drawn to, and exited by, a tiger 1050 sport than a multistrada for example.

    To come back to your point, it is deterring to me. Not only sticker price, but ownership cost as well. As @Scooterdoodler mentioned with his Indian, I've had some bad experiences in that regard with BMW. I can only imagine how much worse it is for that Indian he has. I've seen accessory prices being posted here (300 dollar for some grips??) that would just about leave me gasping for air. It's such a soul crushing downer to have to fork over the price of a small scooter in maintenance at a ducati dealer for example. The 'charm' is all gone, right there. I paid 180 euro at triumph for my first service. I felt fairly treated and paid with a smile. For those who want to mention 'do it yourself maintenance' not everyone has that luxury. Not everyone has a garage, if you're living in a city in a regular apartment you can't just disassemble a goldwing on the street in front, or in your underground car park.

    Just two more small, unrelated, thoughts, nothing to with goldwing per se. I just came across an assembly video of a GS, and a multistrada. Great engineering, very complex, but who can keep these things on the road in ten years time? Dealers won't touch them (not enough revenue, knowledge base will gone) and wrenching yourself you'd be looking at a head scratcher.

    At this point, the dreadnought class touring bike is so far 'out there', concerning weight, cost and everything, that a 750cc mega scooter would be preferable for long distance touring, and would more embrace that spirit of long distance adventure. I've done some long distance overland trips, nothing worse than having to fuel up 100+ euro per day in tree fuel stops on a thirsty motorcycle, for multiple weeks at a time...
  10. dceggert

    dceggert Been here awhile

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    The 'single purpose' perception is the way everything is going these days. My Ultra Classic goes down gravel roads just fine, and so does my K1200GT, but the perception is that if one wants to do that you need a GS or a Super Tenere. I have photos collected showing people in the 1950's and probably earlier exploring back roads on what was then 'standard' looking bikes (Harley's and Indian's). The Lincoln Highway, the first coast to coast highway in the USA was traveled by a couple of young ladies on motorcycles in the early days when the whole thing was dirt. What was available back then? Today a rider would 'require' a GS, a Tiger, a KLR, or some other scoot rather than the beautiful Ultra sitting in their garage. They would need the other bike or never go.

    I liken all this to a conversation I had with a friend a few years back about exercising. The individual needed to increase exercise due to a particular issue with their hip (I think it was a hip) and walking was too painful. I suggested getting his old bicycle out and using that to ride around. The answer was 'no.' That puzzled me so I had to ask why not..."I would look silly in those tight little bicycle shorts and multicolored shirts." I then noticed that all the adult bicycle riders are wearing this stuff. What happened to just jumping on your bicycle with shorts and a t-shirt and going for a pedal? Seems to me that people are way more concerned about how they look to others than just doing what they want to do with what they have.

    I agree with you on the speed thing. Not every motorcycle needs to be set up for power over efficiency. My K1200GT will ride just fine at 35 MPH in top gear. It should not be that way. Top gear should be a double overdrive and usable above 50. The R1200RT is sort of set up this way except the jump from 5th to 6th is big (at least it used to be). My car turns 2200 RPM at 70 MPH; my K1200GT turns 3400. My car is 3400 lbs and has a 2.0L engine...my bike weighs 560 lbs and has a 1.2L.

    Now on the engine size thing there is a benefit to larger displacements and it actually is following the car industry with about a 40 year time lag. It does not need to be just because of a power race though. Low end torque is the major benefit. The Goldwing has been criticized for having low 'power' but it is a torque monster capable of hauling any butt anywhere it wants to go and all the stuff one thinks they need along for the ride. What do you need it for? There are people that travel extensively on their bikes spending weeks at a time or longer. That means carrying a lot of gear, higher electrical loads, passengers and all their stuff. Some pull trailers to carry it all.

    One year I visited Olympic National Park with the family and sitting outside the diner were two matching Goldwings pulling trailers with dog cages in the pillion seats. Turns out it was a retired couple with his and her scoots travelling the country. I asked where they had been and for how long they were on the road and they had a map of the States and Provinces they had been to stuck on the back of the trailers and proudly announced they were in their second year on the trip. Living off the bikes for going on 2 years. For this sort of thing you kinda do need a 2-wheel RV.

    It all turns out to be just a matter of perspective....
    WDG, whiskeygut, Rick G and 1 other person like this.
  11. bobw

    bobw Harden the phuck up

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    This type of stuff can become an oil thread, but I agree it is perspective and if a person is happy with their choice I am happy for them. In another life I worked in a great motorcycle shop and helped put one of the first Gold Wings together (and one of the first 750s for my Dad and then 4 Gold Wings over the years) cool times and we are seeing the same kind of "revelation" in the Industry now, but more focused on electronics for benefits as the returns on better riding comes from their abilities rather what their huge girth and weight gains offers. I remember when finding a way to shave weight was the cheapest way to better performance rather adding to these half ton 2 wheel pickups, I mean motorcycles we are now seeing as the "norm" to expect?

    Anyway, ARiderX mirrors sentiments close to mine and Scooterdoodler sums up a big portion of my current attitude too. I can afford to ride just about any motorcycle I want and all I ask for is decent quality control, a competent dealer with good Corporate support to be there for maintaining competent training, parts availability and expert trouble shooting. Pricing is what the buyer is willing to pay and sadly more Corporate money is spent on seductive advertisement than a better balance that supports my short list above.

    That said, I will continue to buy many more motorcycles and hopefully ride well into my 70s-80s, but I am less excited than I should be as the perpetual kid in the candy store with money in his pocket. I believe we've seen the Trend of great, but "traditional" shops going by the wayside as more Corporate Coffee Bars and "destination" based attitude is expanding. It may be what is needed for a shifting demographic, but the burdens in mandated overhead are tremendous and not all markets are big enough to make a reasonable ROI as is. After losing a couple of local Honda Dealers (as well as several other OEMs) over the last few years there is a new Super Honda Dealer being advertised as coming soon, be interesting to see how it fares.


    Cheers
  12. wannaklr

    wannaklr Long timer

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    So no ABS for the F6 (GL1800B), strange.
  13. slipknot

    slipknot Long timer

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    Unless you move to Australia.
  14. DRconvertible

    DRconvertible Lurking in SoCal

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    I thought the current Burgman 650s did have cruise control. Anyone know for sure?

    I agree and thought the same thing.
  15. Dismount

    Dismount Boring bastard

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    I'd like to see them make a throwback edition. The 1800 in a naked gl1000 type frame. A standard type seating position as opposed to the Valkyries, which to me are cruisers. Analog dials. no widgets.

    I mean that in addition to the normal plasti-barge, gps, dvd, blu-ray, 7zip, ALF, hi-fi, laserdisc gps, hiv, pdq models. I love those and the idea of them too. I'm young ish and in IT. Gadgets are sort of my stock in trade.
  16. Scooterdoodler

    Scooterdoodler Been here awhile

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    I'm about 99 percent certain the big Burgman doesn't have cruise.

    Suzuki has done a terrible job of promoting the bike, never achieving it's potential, and the market for the big scooters is in the tank. The geezers that were supposed to filter down to them are buying $35,000 trikes instead.
  17. old scoot

    old scoot Been here awhile

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    It's going to be interesting to see if they can regain there position in the touring market. There is no question that they have ignored the wing for a few years and aren't on top anymore. I agree with some of the other inmates that have said that they would like to see a more basic machine. Cruise and ABS is about all the electronic gizmos I need, all that other stuff is just more things to go wrong.
  18. Drop_Center

    Drop_Center Long timer

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  19. Drop_Center

    Drop_Center Long timer

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    This argument is so irritating to me it makes my hair stand up. The only way to get smooth, accessible, relaxing, low-end power while climbing a 10,000ft pass with your ladyfriend on the back is with lots of displacement. So buy yourself a 650 have have fun wringing it out and "using all of it's potential" the rest of us like the type of power I described.
    FR700 and larryboy like this.
  20. fecundity

    fecundity Been here awhile

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    Honda loves to put technology into their machines. While the original Wing seems stone simple by today's standards back in the 70's it was high tech. So it goes, time moves on. The cool thing about honda is they still make stone simple bikes so if the wing is to much get one of these........

    2017_XR650L_2000x1275_Red_634E2F.jpg