New Battery but 950 still won't start when cold. Help

Discussion in 'Crazy-Awesome almost Dakar racers (950/990cc)' started by atomizer, Dec 9, 2012.

  1. atomizer

    atomizer Be here now

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    Got a new battery for my 950. Fully charged. When cold out it will not start. Press the starter and it will start to catch then just get a whirling sound and clicking. When warm, starts up fine, might get a whirl or 2 sometimes before it catches.
    Starter issues maybe. Any help would be great. About to do a trip with no access to a battery tender.:freaky
    #1
  2. Denalidirt

    Denalidirt High Plains Drifter

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    how long have you had the bike. When new my bike did the same. I had to replace a shaft on the starter.
    #2
  3. charlie264

    charlie264 Long timer

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    Check and clean connections on starter relay.
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  4. Head2Wind

    Head2Wind MotorcycleMayhem

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    first thing, what year is it?

    it is very possible that the sprag or the torque limiter is having issues. these symptoms are related to specific years.....

    if battery voltage related, then make sure that the stater solenoid terminals are clean and tight as well as the battery terminals.
    #4
  5. atomizer

    atomizer Be here now

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    It is a 06 950. 28,000 miles. Starts fine when warm. When cold it will just make a whirling noise, no clacking or bad sounds..:cry
    #5
  6. TheMuffinMan

    TheMuffinMan Forest Ranger Magnet

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    Is it cranking but won't fire?

    The 2006's should already have the starter torque limiter from the factory.

    Verify your carb heaters are plugged in, check choke cables and make sure they aren't binding. Humor me and make sure your coils are fully seated on the spark plugs. After that I'd check the starter relays, and maybe make sure it has the proper grade oil in it for your temperature. (5-40 for sub 0) 10-50 to 10-60 otherwise.
    #6
  7. Head2Wind

    Head2Wind MotorcycleMayhem

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    sprag most likely is the problem as described, however without directly experiencing it, can't be sure. A video of it happening with good audio will help

    It is possible to fix the sprag without replacing the whole flywheel assembly as shown by KTM for the LC8. You will need to source a new LC4 sprag, then disassemble the two sprags and swap the new parts from the LC4 into the LC8 unit. Seen this on two bikes so far, fixed them both by using LC4 sprag parts.
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  8. atomizer

    atomizer Be here now

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    Mostly will just whirl and then sometimes will catch and crank. If the battery does not get worn down I can usually get it started after about 10 min. Choke cable is fine. I'll check the carb heater connection and the spark plug connections. Do I need to take the darn tanks off to do that (heater carb connection)?
    Love the bike but a pain to work on especially having to take the crash bars off and tanks off every time I need to access something.....
    #8
  9. atomizer

    atomizer Be here now

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    Thanks. Why a Sprag (what the heck is that :))from LC4 vs Lc8? Cost?
    I'm leaving on a trip in a few days. Gonna be warmer where I'm going than these freezing NM temps at the moment. Hoping it will do okay till I get back and have time to properly fix it. No garage here and short on time. Plus all the shops are closed for x-mas holidays..



    #9
  10. Head2Wind

    Head2Wind MotorcycleMayhem

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    IF...big if.. KTM has the LC8 flywheel assembly in country, then its cost. I think its about $600 for the flywheel assembly with the sprag.

    the sprag is the one way clutch that allows the starter motor to rotate the engine to start it but then not spin with the engine when it is running. So, when the engine is static, the starter motor is engergized (start button), this turns a gear set and ultimately one side of the sprag which engages with the other side (that is attached to the crankshaft), the start torque is transferred to the crankshaft and rotates the engine until it fires and runs on its own, the crankshaft speed is greater than the start motor system and therefore will slip past the start motor side of the assembly, you then release the start motor button and away you go..... So.... based upon what you are describing it is the sprag, if it is a loud clacking sound then its the torque limiter
    #10
  11. Head2Wind

    Head2Wind MotorcycleMayhem

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    Year/Model: 2006,
    Component: IGNITION SYSTEM
    Item #: 20
    Part Number: 60039005100
    Description: IGNITION ROTOR 04
    Retail: $575.32
    #11
  12. atomizer

    atomizer Be here now

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    That helps a ton. Thanks for the info.
    last question, why does it start up no problem when warm vs the issues described when very cold out?


    #12
  13. ciedema

    ciedema мотоциклист

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    Having expericed a damaged sprag clutch these are the very symptoms I had. The tolerances must close up a little when the engine is hot allowing it to catch easier.

    You can get out it cheaper if buy the LC4 clutch and fit it to the existing ignition rotor. You might need to buy the gear it engages on also.

    See this thread http://www.advrider.com/forums/showpost.php?p=17804205&postcount=17 for using the LC4 parts.

    This thread describes what I was having happen http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=801192
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  14. atomizer

    atomizer Be here now

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    Thank you. Hoping it will survive my trip till I get back to work on it. Could you post the link again to your thread that describes the symptoms? The one you posted below just links back to this Thread. Thanks again...:clap


    #14
  15. gefr

    gefr Life is a trip

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    I had the sprag fail on me. I think you are endangering your trip. Replacing the sprag is not too difficult and seems it needs to be done. I suggest you go on to replace the damaged item. It will take you 3 hours work once you have the tools. Watch out the seal on the balancer shaft. Gets easily misplaced.
    Cheers.
    #15
  16. ciedema

    ciedema мотоциклист

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    Fixed http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=801192
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  17. Head2Wind

    Head2Wind MotorcycleMayhem

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    direct link to the thread with detailed instructions on making a LC8 sprag from LC4 sprag.

    http://www.advrider.com/forums/showpost.php?p=17804205&postcount=17

    You will need a big breaker bar or pneumatic impact to get the crank bolt loose, then a grub screw (to push against) and a puller (pusher bolt really) to push the flywheel off the crankshaft taper, then you can get to the sprag.... will also need 648 loctite for reassembly.

    If you dont have the parts available, in a pinch and IF you can get the flywheel off... you can tighten the perimeter spring on the sprag to put more preload on the sprag pals... but this is only work around to the probably required replacement of the pals and the spring.
    #17