Noise from transmission r100gs

Discussion in 'Airheads' started by villageidiot, Dec 27, 2011.

  1. villageidiot

    villageidiot Long timer

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2010
    Oddometer:
    3,707
    Location:
    Orange County, CA
    riding home today, i heard a noise i had not heard before,

    bike is 92 r100gs just under 30k miles, in good shape.

    in gears 2 or higher, i get a sort of whirring/gear lash/bad bearing noise while in decell, or while riding, but not under throttle. I've only had this bike about 200 miles. As far as i know, the circlip has not been done.

    i got the bike home, and put on center stand, and ran in gear, makes a whole bunch of racket and i can feel it in the trans case (ive searched since i came on here tonite and found that they make some noise in this situation)

    i do not get any noise rolling in neutral backwards that would lead me to think drive shaft, and i have minimal play back and forth at final drive while in gear, and i can feel the "slop" as being internal to the trans and not the forward u joint.

    what do you guys think,

    first step, pull back boots, look at drive shaft,

    or just dive the fuck in, and get the trans to an expert?

    im a mechanic for a living, so i ain't scared, but i do not do transmission internals. and would just assume have someone that knows what they're doing take care of it once.
    #1
  2. bmwrench

    bmwrench Long timer

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2006
    Oddometer:
    3,448
    The R100GS was BMW's practice bike for "clean" (sealed) bearings. There's one at the rear of the output shaft and it is common for them to fail early. Take the gearbox apart-or to your favorite BMW gearbox guy.
    #2
  3. Beater

    Beater The Bavarian Butcher

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2009
    Oddometer:
    3,701
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA, USA
    Change the oil. When draining look for more than the usual crap on the magnet. Once it's drained (really good) shake it. If you can hear pieces loose in it ... open the fill hole and look in with a flashlight . ...

    You need some special pullers to get into one of those transmissions. But if you are mechanically inclined, I've been told it isn't that bad. It's the shimming at the end that requires the neurosis. But ... if it were me, I'd send it to a professional. (Anton?)

    "I just ride 'em. I don't know what makes 'em work." -Odd Ball, Kelly's Heroes.
    #3
  4. villageidiot

    villageidiot Long timer

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2010
    Oddometer:
    3,707
    Location:
    Orange County, CA
    so, obviously the trans has to be out to shake right? so i should remove it drain it, and give it a good shake?
    #4
  5. Beater

    Beater The Bavarian Butcher

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2009
    Oddometer:
    3,701
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA, USA
    Yes ... I would. I think that Mr. Wrench is right though ... If you check your drain plug I think you are going to have some of those bearing spacers on it ... if not, they will be the rattle when you shake it. :cry

    If you need a rebuild, put in the lower first!
    #5
  6. villageidiot

    villageidiot Long timer

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2010
    Oddometer:
    3,707
    Location:
    Orange County, CA
    what do i need with a lower first? I'm 99% on street with everything i drive, i dont really NEED a GS, id rather have an ST, or r100r but the price of this bike was right and it was local.

    i can barely touch the ground, im a big dude at 6'2, but i only have a 26-27" inseam. gotta say this thing rides like a damn dream and i am glad i chose this bike.
    #6
  7. Beater

    Beater The Bavarian Butcher

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2009
    Oddometer:
    3,701
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA, USA
    The lower first was a surprise to me. I bought a 'new to me' '91 GS ... and it has some serious internal farkling. One of the 'improvements' is a lower first. When the bike is idling in first, it is moving at a 'fast walking' pace ... like 3.5-4 mph.. If I plan properly, I can slow to idle at a stop light (100 feet) behind a car, and never have to touch the ground with my feet before the light changes. I never put in the clutch! It's GREAT.

    Now ... for off road, I can literally crawl over stuff. And if you thought that the 1000cc didn't really have torque ... you can crawl up a wall with it in first now.

    Just personal perspective of course, but it is a huge upgrade. Surprising as well.
    #7
  8. squish

    squish Out of the office.

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2003
    Oddometer:
    7,141
    Location:
    Where the Ghetto meets the sea.
    I've not taken my GS off road much since the rebuilt tranny,
    And I'm a heavyish dude,

    If I had it to do over I would really look at the taller 5th especially for faster road work.
    But I really wish that I had enough cash to have done both the 1st and the 5th gears.

    Ted Porter did my tranny and I was ok with his work. He was a little slower then I expected but his quote was higher then the work he did.

    I'd have him do it again, but I would make sure we had a clear understanding of timing.
    #8
  9. gsd4me

    gsd4me 90% bluff

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2005
    Oddometer:
    7,930
    Location:
    Brisbane, Australia



    Good call; dribbling along in slow traffic, riding the clutch can kill it quick smart. The least amount of handling the lever you do, the longer things will last.

    Personally, I`d go the higher top gear as well.
    #9
  10. Wirespokes

    Wirespokes Beemerholics Anonymous

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2002
    Oddometer:
    8,697
    Location:
    Jackson's Bottom Oregon
    From those symptoms, I can't give you any good advice, except - don't ride that sucker till you get it sorted out!!!!!!!!!

    And it is excellent advice to drain the trans oil and get back to us with what you find on the magnet. Oh, just be sure not to drain the engine sump - the transmission drain is the next one up. :lol3
    #10
  11. wirewrkr

    wirewrkr the thread-killer

    Joined:
    May 23, 2008
    Oddometer:
    4,295
    Location:
    HIGH desert
    If you opt for sending it out for a going through, i would also consider BMWRENCH's shop,
    http://thenickwackettgarage.com/bmw/
    He's a factory mastertech BMW guy, been wrenching on these at a dealer since he was a teenager.That's a looong time ago.
    (his dad owned a dealership in the olden days.)
    He's one of 4 guys that I would trust with my gearbox.
    #11
  12. bereahorn

    bereahorn Long timer

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2002
    Oddometer:
    1,071
    Location:
    N.E. Ohio
    :lurk
    #12
  13. villageidiot

    villageidiot Long timer

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2010
    Oddometer:
    3,707
    Location:
    Orange County, CA
    looks like i am going to take it to angel city cycle, in culver city, guy comes pretty reccomended, and after talking to him on the phone he seems to know whats going on, and hes reasonably priced.

    planning to take him the whole bike and just pick it up when finished, as my work week doesnt usually allow much night time wrenching, and i don't think its worth my time for the 3 hr R&R charge
    #13
  14. Rob Farmer

    Rob Farmer Long timer

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Oddometer:
    6,731
    Location:
    Loughborough, Leicestershire. England
    Pulled mine yesterday and finished stripping it this morning. Similar symptoms to yours. Turned out my input end output shaft bearing is toast. Unfortunately it's taken 5th gear out, which has also worn the intermediate shaft helical gear.

    Crappy Iphone photo but you can see the metal particles swirling in the oil

    [​IMG]
    #14
  15. wirewrkr

    wirewrkr the thread-killer

    Joined:
    May 23, 2008
    Oddometer:
    4,295
    Location:
    HIGH desert

    Yikes!, it's the "soup du jour"!
    #15
  16. supershaft

    supershaft because I can

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2010
    Oddometer:
    9,116
    Location:
    San Francisco Bay area
    That's the bearing that usually fails. Even with a C clip.

    I believe Motobins has intermediate shaft fifth gears. Probably from Seibenrock but I don't know for sure. I have only done it two times but man they were on tight. Bang and the gear only moved the tiniest bit. Same story over and over again until it was off. I highly suspect a good straight pushing press is a big help.
    #16
  17. Rob Farmer

    Rob Farmer Long timer

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Oddometer:
    6,731
    Location:
    Loughborough, Leicestershire. England
    I've pressed them off before with a 10 tonne press. They start to move around 2 tonnes, they come off easily once you get them moving and keep the pressure on. I wouldn't fancy doing it without a press though.

    I knew the gearbox wasn't right but hung on until I got a chance to pull it apart over the winter. Expensive mistake. I've found another 17° fifth gear and a early output shaft with a circlip groove in my stash so it isn't going to be as expensive to sort out as I originally thought.

    I think the intermediate gears may be made in the UK. There's a company in Northampton that makes trick gearboxes for airheads for high power engines. They change gear as slick as Jap bikes apparently.
    #17
  18. supershaft

    supershaft because I can

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2010
    Oddometer:
    9,116
    Location:
    San Francisco Bay area
    Both of mine were way tighter than you are describing.

    I try to tell people all the time. Don't keep riding your F'ed up bike. Pull over. Stop. Get a truck. It will save you a lot of money. When your airplane starts knocking and loosing power, you add power in the hope of finding a safe place to land. When your bike starts making weird noises and/or loosing power, just get off it and get a truck.
    #18
  19. wirewrkr

    wirewrkr the thread-killer

    Joined:
    May 23, 2008
    Oddometer:
    4,295
    Location:
    HIGH desert

    AWESOME!!! :lol3
    #19
  20. bmwrench

    bmwrench Long timer

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2006
    Oddometer:
    3,448
    Or is that le soup du mort?
    #20