Nutsert or Helicoil

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by team ftb, Apr 16, 2013.

  1. team ftb

    team ftb Befuddled Adventurer

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    just stripped a m6 screw that holds on my ktm muffler. I obviously need to redo the threads to enable another m6 bolt to be utilized. easiest way is a helicoil. however on the muffler that will be removed a few times per year is the helicoil reliable enough?

    another option is a nutsert. trouble is I don't own the tool. can I install these nutserts with a rivet gun?

    give me insight into what would be the best solution given my situation.

    thanks heaps. apologies for no caps and not a wealth of info but the arm is in a cast and only have one finger typing at the moment.
    #1
  2. LuciferMutt

    LuciferMutt Rides slow bike slow

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    Helicoils are fine IF THEY ARE INSTALLED CORRECTLY which is not the easiest thing to do without at least some fixturing to keep everything aligned to same axis.

    Any chance you can just go up to an M8 instead, and drill and tap the hole larger?
    #2
  3. mcma111

    mcma111 Long timer

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  4. victor441

    victor441 Long timer

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    I recently repaired some stripped threads in an aluminum casting w/ Permacoils (similar to helicoil but less $$$ and Napa carries them) successfully....a drill bit of the exact size specified on the package is also required but the special tap and a metal installation tool are included in the kit. As was said you need to be very careful to drill and tap straight...

    [​IMG]
    #4
  5. broncobowsher

    broncobowsher Long timer

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    Nutzerts are more for threading into sheet metal. Heli coil is for repairing (or reinforcing) threads in solid metal.

    So what is this metal you will be screwing into?
    #5
  6. team ftb

    team ftb Befuddled Adventurer

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    only issue is I wanted to use the existing oem spacers and such.

    [​IMG]

    parts 9-14. going to a m8 I then have to deal with the sleeved spacer part 9.

    concetns of mine with timeserts and helicoils is can I remove and reinstall the bolt multiple times using these options?
    #6
  7. team ftb

    team ftb Befuddled Adventurer

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    metal is a threaded steel bore in the frame the muffler bolts into. can the helicoil handle a bolt being removed and reinstalled a few times?

    thanks for the answers gents.
    #7
  8. mcma111

    mcma111 Long timer

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    Yes a Heli-Coil can be threaded into multiple times although a Timesert is a better repair.
    #8
  9. ericrat

    ericrat Long timer

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    I don't see any reason why not? I have removed and installed bolts into holes with Helicoils. Like everyone else said, it helps if they are installed correctly. It helps if you don't overtorque the bolt in the future.

    Worst case, you remove the bolt and all or part of the helicoil comes with it. Pull it out with a pair of pliers and or a pick and thread in a new one.
    #9
  10. Anorak

    Anorak Woolf Barnato

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    Why is a Timesert better? In commercial aviation, the engines are full of Heli-coils. I've never seen a Timesert on a commercial aircraft engine or airframe. I have seen Swadge-serts and Keen-Serts as well.
    #10
  11. mcma111

    mcma111 Long timer

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    I have used both and I prefer the Timesert.

    <TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=520 align=center><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top width=20></TD><TD class=regulartext width=290>TIME-SERT® is a solid bushing insert. This guarantees easy installation and allows for full load use of tapped hole, ensuring protection against stress and vibration.</TD><TD rowSpan=7 width=210>[​IMG]
    [​IMG] product demonstration

    </TD></TR><TR><TD width=20> </TD><TD width=290> </TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=20>
    [​IMG]
    </TD><TD class=regulartext width=290>TIME-SERT® is thin walled due to synchronized internal
    external threads. Thin cross sectional area allows for installation in areas of limited space and clearance material.</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=20> </TD><TD width=290></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=20>
    [​IMG]
    </TD><TD class=regulartext width=290>TIME-SERT® Positive Placement. Having a flange on the top of the insert will insure that the insert will have positive placement and cannot wind down into the newly repaired hole.</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=20> </TD><TD width=290> </TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=20>
    [​IMG]
    </TD><TD class=regulartext width=290>TIME-SERT® is self locking. On installation the bottom internal threads of the insert are cold rolled to expand the mating external threads into the base material locking the insert in place. Locking mechanism is at the bottom of insert.

    TIME-SERT® thread repair system the ultimate way
    to repair threads in stripped or damaged holes.

    TIME-SERT® threaded inserts are approved by leading automotive manufactures. Easily repair stripped threads in cyclinder head bolt stripped threads, spark plug thread repair as well as oil drain pan. Many thread repair kits are available for your threaded bushing application in metric and american sizes. TIME-SERT the very best in thread repair!

    </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
    #11
  12. GreaseMonkey

    GreaseMonkey Preshrunk & Cottony

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    No you can't use a pop riveter, but you can use a nut and bolt to install them- thread a nut on to a bolt, stick a washer on it, then thread it into the nutsert.

    Then just hold the bolt stationary and put a wrench on the nut and it will draw up the nutsert, easey peasey.
    #12
  13. aardschok

    aardschok Fallout Rider

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    +1 on the Timesert. Racers and manufacturers, (Porsche, BMW, Mercedes)now recommend the timeserts instead of helicoils as a more permanent repair. A nutsert is best for thin metal that needs a threaded area in it when you can't weld in a nut.
    #13
  14. Beezer

    Beezer Long timer

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    helicoils have been the standard in aviation for at least 60-70 years. they are used in new construction as well being an approved repair (on engines). properly installed they will last the life of the rest of the part
    #14
  15. gweaver

    gweaver NorCal is Best Cal!

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    FWIW, I managed to booger up the skid plate mount points on my 950. Made a complete hash of the threads where the crash bars mount as well. Ordered up a set of Timeserts, took about an hour to do all four, and all is well. The kit comes with the needed drill, tap and insertion device.
    G
    #15
  16. team ftb

    team ftb Befuddled Adventurer

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    awesome replies guys thanks for the responses. looks like it will be a timesert. now just to figure out how to to drill the hole straight with one arm and hand in a cast.
    #16
  17. villageidiot

    villageidiot Long timer

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    For a temporary/permanent fix, why not just use a longer bolt and put a nut on the backside? If you don't have the time sert kit, they can be anywhere from 40-300 dollar ( the latter a big sert kit for spark plugs)

    Good luck
    #17
  18. Plaka

    Plaka Brevis illi vita est

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    There are threaded inserts for sheetmetal that install with an ordinary pop rivit gun. They tend to be the smaller sizes. The bigger ones need The Tool---looks like a pop riviter but has a threaded pull rod. Metric would be a special item.

    Timesert kits cost a lot more than Helicoil. They have some advantages (strength) and disadvantages (you can't stack them easily). You want the Timesert drill, it does a special hole (it's counterbored)
    #18
  19. JimVonBaden

    JimVonBaden "Cool" Aid!

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    If you are drilling out a stripped hole, drilling straight is a non-issue unless you are really uncoordinated. The original hole will guide you prefectly. I have done about a hundred stripped valve cover threads on aluminum before and never used any kind of guide. The hole is the guide.

    Jim :brow
    #19
  20. JRose

    JRose Been here awhile

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    #20