Odyssey PC545, a work in progress (pics)

Discussion in 'Crazy-Awesome almost Dakar racers (950/990cc)' started by uk_mouse, Feb 4, 2007.

  1. uk_mouse

    uk_mouse Aquatic adventurer

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    My bike's let me down a couple of times due to a flat battery. I hink one problem is that mud gets into the plug that takes the jiuce from the reg/rect to the battery, so it doesn't charge. But another problem is that the old OEM battery seems to have very little capacity left.

    Having bodged an Odyssey battery into my beemer when I had it, I know they deserve their reputation. I also know they only come in "awkward" sizes :D

    Here's the OEM battery next to an Odyssey PC545. I picked the 545 as it was closest to the height of the original, the 535 is narrower but taller, as I recall.

    The PC545 came with a "metal jacket", but I've removed that. It came in handy though.

    [​IMG]

    Here's the space on the bike you have to work with. I've removed the original plastic battery box and all the associated brackets that the reg/rect, solenoid and fuel pump are mounted onto. (A free Mars Bar to the first person who can say what that heap of scrap metal in the background to this photo is!)

    [​IMG]

    I cut some sheet metal (1.5mm mild steel) and welded some extra plate onto the sides of the Odyssey "metal jacket". Welded a strip across the bottom for strength, and added a bracket at the font to hold the reg/rect, and prongs on the right side to hold the solenoid.

    I welded captive nuts onto the reg/regt bracket and the mountings at the sides.

    That makes it all sound very easy, but it has taken me literally days to get this new box to fit into the space available. One problem is that of course you have to leave room for the bash plate to screw into place. I'm using the original four mounting bolts to hold the new box in, but at first, in an effort to raise the battery to avoid conflict with the bash plate, I made the bolt holes in it too low, and when I assembled it all with the battery in place, the battery fouled the bolts. Hence the extra welded sections at the top :)

    I've only recently learned how to weld, hence the rather rough workmanship here :) It's a working prototype though, at some point in the future I'll probably make one properly using these dimensions.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    This shows how it all goes together, obviously the wires need tidying up a bit. I had to flatten out the terminals on the ends of the wires to the battery, as the original design had them bent at 90 degrees. The terminals on the Odyssey battery are in a differnt place, but the original wires were long enough.

    [​IMG]

    A view from the right showing the solenoid in position.

    [​IMG]

    And with the metal "lid" of the battery void in position. The astute among you will notice I haven't mounted the fuel pump yet. I think there's room for it on the left side of the new battery box, I shall find out during the week when I have time to work on this again :)

    I think I'll have to trim the fuel pipes going to the pump and mount it vertically, sort of how it is in this next picture but attached to the battery box.

    [​IMG]

    Another task yet to finish is to reroute the fuel tank balance pipe, I think probably just shorten it and take it straight across the underside of the metal "lid".

    I'll post pics of the finished job when it's done :)
    #1
  2. cpmodem

    cpmodem Orange Caveman

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    Awsome dude! Nice farkel.
    -cp
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  3. SlipChip

    SlipChip Adventure Commuter

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    Good effort UK! As a pointer, you will find it much easier to get a clean weld if you clean up the metal first. Sand off the paint or worse yet, galvanizing, to bare metal first and it will all be much easier, stronger and better looking.
    #3
  4. petesonhisway

    petesonhisway Been here awhile

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    Nice work! Is there much weight difference between the batteries?

    Cheers,

    Pete
    #4
  5. Burton Briggs

    Burton Briggs Been here awhile

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    That hunk of metal in the background looks like a front bumper with brush guards and a hitch receiver. (?)
    #5
  6. uk_mouse

    uk_mouse Aquatic adventurer

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    I haven't weighed them but the Odyssey is probably double the weight of the original. Time will tell whether this is going to be a problem.I was thinking, if I add a thin layer of closed cell foam to the inside of the bash plate, due to the size of the new battery, it will actually be partially supported by the foam (it's that tight), which might reduce stress in the mounts at the top.
    #6
  7. Lorretto

    Lorretto City Dweller Crushperado

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    Mouse

    I've had the same problem with a flat battery. My bike will start fine above 40 F; below that I have to be lucky or have it on a tender. I knew the BMW guys swore by the Odyssey battery so I looked at doing what you are doing with a new battery box and refit. I stopped when I went to a motorcycle show and found the CCA ratings to compare the Odyssey with the Yuasa. I think The 545 Odyssey was 185 CCAs and the Yuasa was 220 CCAs. I know nothing about batteries and whether the CCA ratings are the real deal for a baseline measurement.

    Please keep us posted as I may be right behind you on the refit.
    #7
  8. cpmodem

    cpmodem Orange Caveman

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    Lorretto, are you using a lot, or a little choke, when trying to start in 40 deg? I ask this because mine will start on the first compression stroke with 1/4 choke even down to 10 deg. I don't want to hijack this thread, just wondering why some folks are having trouble starting this (for me) very easy to start bike. Now back to your regularly scheduled programing.
    :snore
    -cp
    #8
  9. Lorretto

    Lorretto City Dweller Crushperado

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    Hey CP

    Sorry Mouse for a brief digression

    Above 40 F half choke, below I use full on choke. The bike fires immediately in cold weather with full choke and will stall in a second or two. Repeat two, three, four, five tries (one second hit on the starter) and it will hold barely at idle then will slowly jump up to the high idle, still at full choke. If the bike doesn't hold at idle by the fifth hit on the starter it's a no go. While warming up anything less than full choke, the rpms drop to 1000 or stalls.

    I've had two Yuasa batteries, first was dead from the factory. I was going to try to shoe horn the Odyssey in similar to what Mouse is doing now but went with a replacement Yuasa that is supposed to have 250 CCA. So far the old Yuasa battery has been better on cold starts.
    #9
  10. Burton Briggs

    Burton Briggs Been here awhile

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    I found that when my bike was acting like your describe, I put some injector/carb cleaner in the tank and that curred the problem. I know, there are no injectors, but there seems to be some junk that comes from the tank (leaching) that plays with the carbs and makes the starting hard. This may or may not work in your case, but just a comment from my experience.
    #10
  11. uk_mouse

    uk_mouse Aquatic adventurer

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    I think CCA is probably a useful measurement, but remember the starter motor in the KTM probably takes about 30 to 40 amps, so whether your battery can deliver 185 amps or 220 is a bit academic.

    Either the Odyssey or the Yuasa, if in good condition, would be more than suited to the task. However, in my (limited) experience, plain lead / acid batteries like the Yuasa don't stay in top condition for very long. I had a new battery (Yuasa) under warranty in my BMW after about 6 months, and admittedly I'm the 2nd owner of the KTM but its battery was weak from the day I bought it.

    What makes the Odyssey a win for me is its resilience, it doesn't need maintenance charging and it can cope with deep discharge. So they claim anyway! Time will tell on that one :)
    #11
  12. Lorretto

    Lorretto City Dweller Crushperado

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    :1drink The project looks great, by the way really nice clear photos.

    The Odyssey distributor in the US says they have asked the designers about a replacement battery for the YTZ14S but that it would be at least a year if they go forward at all.
    #12
  13. Stephen

    Stephen Long timer

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    Is not the stock Yuasa an AGM battery, like the Odyssey?
    The Odyssey is nice color though, eh? :lol3

    If it's not staying lit on full choke, I suspect the choke cable needs adjusting. Mine certainly doesn't like to drive anywhere until it'll at least barely idle off choke, but it lights up nicely even when the air is below freezing. It won't idle at 1400 even with the choke right off.
    #13
  14. cpmodem

    cpmodem Orange Caveman

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    You are correct. The OEM battery is an AGM.
    -cp
    #14
  15. Lorretto

    Lorretto City Dweller Crushperado

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    Thanks for the tips on the cold starts, I'll give each a try.
    #15
  16. uk_mouse

    uk_mouse Aquatic adventurer

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    Quick update ... I've finished the job, the bike is back together and starting very nicely thank you :)

    Here's the new battery in the new box, after a coat of paint (black Hammerite of course). I used a large cable tie as a retaining strap.

    [​IMG]

    The new location for the fuel pump breather pipe. The dirt on my bike is shocking! Bloomin hard to clean back there though.

    [​IMG]

    The new route for the fuel tank balance pipe. I made a cock up and cut the original too short, therefore this is a different bit of fuel pipewith a similar internal bore. No reasonwhy you couldn't use the original though if you measure correctly :)

    [​IMG]

    And the new location for the fuel pump. I think I may revisit this soon, and try it with the pump rotated though 180 degrees, so that the breather comes out at the back. As it is, the breather rubs slightly on the plastic part of the bash plate (you can see a mark on the pipe already).

    [​IMG]

    One disadvantage with this new set up is that to remove the battery I have to remove the box from the bike, there's not clearance to lift it out in situ. However, that's not something you need to do every day so I don't really think it'll be a problem.

    My main lingering concern is that a serious impact to the bash plate might damage something because everything is crammed in so tightly behind it. I'll just have to keep an eye on things and check it thoroughly after I go off road.

    Does anyone know if a Touratech bashplate gives you more room in the battery area? Or maybe I'll make my own - probably quicker than ordering from TT :D
    #16
  17. gefr

    gefr Life is a trip

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    Seems you managed to finish the adventure and you learned welding. Well done and thnx for the photo manual.

    P.S. You think PC310 wouldn't be up to the job?
    #17
  18. Lorretto

    Lorretto City Dweller Crushperado

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    Great blueprint, nicely done! Thanks for posting the photos it will help anybody that needs or wants to follow your lead.
    #18
  19. Kawidad

    Kawidad Long timer

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    I like it! :clap
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  20. StevenD

    StevenD Hmmmm, dirt!

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    I remember from something that this fuel pump HAS to be mounted like it is originally.
    Anyone who can confirm this?
    #20