ORGS build up

Discussion in 'Airheads' started by x3300, Mar 6, 2010.

  1. fishkens

    fishkens Long timer

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Oddometer:
    5,252
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    As with everything you've done, this is a very nice mod. This has been on the list for my GS (stock swingarm) for some time and I hope to get to it this spring.
  2. NordieBoy

    NordieBoy Armature speller

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2006
    Oddometer:
    7,158
    Location:
    Kiwiland
    You're going to need a bigger tyre than that one...
  3. x3300

    x3300 geoff

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Oddometer:
    170
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    I took the rear wheel apart to do the final build with the proper length spokes. In preparation for powder coating I scrubbed up the rim and hub with a strong detergent and steel wool followed by sand blasting and another detergent scrub and rinse.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/blasted-parts.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/blasted-parts-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/blasted-parts.jpg"></a>

    The smaller rear rim would just barely fit into the oven I have access to, but I wasn't confident I could get the rim into the oven without jarring the rim and having the loose powder come off, so I decided to use the same setup I used with the front rim to do a partial bake of the rim on the bench to stabilize the coating then I transfered the rim to the oven to do a final bake.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/heating-setup.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/heating-setup-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/heating-setup.jpg"></a>

    Here's the rim and hub after coating.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/coated-parts.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/coated-parts-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/coated-parts.jpg"></a>

    I got back in touch with Doug Richardson of The Devon Rim Co. and within a short time 20 spokes 6mm longer than stock arrived. I used the 20 that I had previously ground down shorter for the other side.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/spokes.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/spokes-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/spokes.jpg"></a>

    There was some interest in my method of building a wheel, so I'll give some more details here. I use a copper based anti-seize to lubricate the stainless spoke threads.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/anti-seize.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/anti-seize-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/anti-seize.jpg"></a>

    The first spoke is what is commonly called the 'key spoke'. It defines the relationship between the rim and hub. I set the key spoke so that the printing on the rim was at what I thought was the top of the hub.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/key-spoke.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/key-spoke-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/key-spoke.jpg"></a>

    Then comes the second spoke.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/2-spokes.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/2-spokes-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/2-spokes.jpg"></a>

    And continue until all ten are in place. I decide on a fixed number of turns, say five, to thread the nipples on so all will be some what equally engaged.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/10-spokes.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/10-spokes-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/10-spokes.jpg"></a>

    Then I do the other ten to finish one side.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/20-spokes.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/20-spokes-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/20-spokes.jpg"></a>

    Then I flip the wheel over and do the same on the other side to finish up the lacing part.

    At this point all spokes have the same number of threads engaged, but are still really loose. I go around the wheel several times turning each nipple the same amount, say five turns then two turns then one, until the spokes start to get tight.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/40-spokes.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/40-spokes-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/40-spokes.jpg"></a>

    Once the spokes start getting tight I use a 3mm screw as a depth gage to set all the nipples to have the same engagement.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/depth-gauge.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/depth-gauge-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/depth-gauge.jpg"></a>

    At this point I'm ready to start to tighten up the spokes to the final tension. I put numbers on the hub to keep track of where I am in a tightening sequence.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/nubmers.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/nubmers-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/nubmers.jpg"></a>

    I use a torque wrench and a dial indicator to set the spoke tension. The tightening needs to be done such that the hub is centered in the rim without any run-out when the tightening is finished.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/tools.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/tools-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/tools.jpg"></a>

    My objective is to get all the spokes at equal torque with minimal run-out. The BMW service manual says nipples should be at 5 Nm, but since this wheel has a 14 mm dish, one side needs to be tighter than the other. I set the left to 4.5 Nm and the right to 5.8 Nm. I start with the wrench at a low torque value and work around the wheel in a sequence that I think will get the spokes up to tension while at the same time correcting any run-out. Tightening one spoke effects others around it; crossed spokes will tighten, and parrallel spokes will loosen.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/manual.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/manual-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/manual.jpg"></a>

    At first I just used this vise-grip to get a rough check of the radial run-out.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/center-hub.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/center-hub-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/center-hub.jpg"></a>

    I slowly up the torque setting and switch to using the dial indicator as I get closer.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/axial-check.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/axial-check-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/axial-check.jpg"></a>

    Once the spokes get pretty tight I use a punch to set the spoke heads in the rim.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/punch.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/punch-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/punch.jpg"></a>

    And pre-stress the spokes to yeild any tight ones.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/stress-relief.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/stress-relief-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/stress-relief.jpg"></a>

    The BMW spec is 1.0mm run-out, and after some work I was able to get this wheel to a radial run-out of 0.2 mm and an axial run-out of 0.7 mm.

    Here's how it looks with a tire mounted.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/left.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/left-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/left.jpg"></a>

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/right.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/right-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/43-rear-wheel/right.jpg"></a>

    -x3300
  4. bikecat

    bikecat Long timer

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2006
    Oddometer:
    1,123
    Location:
    Tropical Far East
    Thanks for the write up on wheel rebuilding.

    Cheers
  5. fishkens

    fishkens Long timer

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Oddometer:
    5,252
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    Would you please train a planet of technical manual editors how it should be done? You write like you're not being paid by the word. :lol3:lol3:lol3

    Nicely done (although my bicycle wheels never seemed to go together so easily).

    Thanks.
  6. Stagehand

    Stagehand Imperfectionist

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2004
    Oddometer:
    27,368
    Location:
    Shawangunks
    Dear Sir-

    That is awesome. Bike looks great.

    Regards,

    SH
  7. Zebedee

    Zebedee Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2004
    Oddometer:
    851
    Location:
    ... I was born a ramblin' man
    I think our friend x3300 (geoff) has made many many things look deceptively simple and straightforward in this thread.

    His explanations are always clear, concise and a pleasure to read, even if I've got no plans to actually use any of the information he's imparted.

    Keep up the good work Geoff ... :thumb

    :beer

    John
  8. igormortis

    igormortis Long timer

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    Oddometer:
    1,422
    Location:
    London
    Fantastic work, sir!
  9. Padmei

    Padmei enamoured

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2008
    Oddometer:
    3,818
    Location:
    Nelson New Zealand
    That looked so easy I'm tempted to try it myself - I won't - but am tempted:D
  10. Beater

    Beater The Bavarian Butcher

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2009
    Oddometer:
    3,633
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA, USA
    Whoa. Mad. Holy Crap ... that's beautiful.

    :drif
  11. Benjamin M

    Benjamin M Back to Mono

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2009
    Oddometer:
    56
    Location:
    Surrey, UK
    ..anything much happened in the last four months?
  12. Chadleys1

    Chadleys1 working on it

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2005
    Oddometer:
    565
    Location:
    Texas Hillcountry
    Ditto.
    This has really been a great thread.
    Thanks.
  13. Benjamin M

    Benjamin M Back to Mono

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2009
    Oddometer:
    56
    Location:
    Surrey, UK
    What happened?:huh Finish the bike! :D
  14. _anatic

    _anatic Plated

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2009
    Oddometer:
    1,179
    Location:
    trUSt, NC
  15. Benjamin M

    Benjamin M Back to Mono

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2009
    Oddometer:
    56
    Location:
    Surrey, UK
    Okay, we'll let you off then... Just checking :D
  16. Box'a'bits

    Box'a'bits In need of repair

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2008
    Oddometer:
    2,505
    Location:
    Wellington, New Zealand
    So dredging this thread back from the dead, any progress? :lurk. A man can only stomach so much popcorn....
  17. beeks76

    beeks76 Your What Hurts???

    Joined:
    May 30, 2004
    Oddometer:
    229
    Location:
    Eau Galle, WI
    My God! I just read through this entire thread with my anticipation building like a teenager on his prom night, waiting for the climax and BAM, no finished photo. I think I am going to have blue balls! :rofl At least give us an updated photo.
  18. x3300

    x3300 geoff

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Oddometer:
    170
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    The old seat pan I had made no longer works with the new subframe, plus I was not entirely satisfied with the way the old one turned out, so I decided to make up a new one. I started with a model made from thin cardboard that I thought looked good on the bike, and then transfered that pattern to some 3/32" aluminum sheet I had been saving.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/layout.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/layout-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/layout.jpg"></a>

    I used a squaring shear to trim out the blank.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/blank.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/blank-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/blank.jpg"></a>

    And used this sheet metal brake to bend the sides to the angle I had decided on with the cardboard model. To get the large radius bend from the brake I set the brake fingers back about 20 mm from the hinge joint, the setup of which can just be seen in this view.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/brake.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/brake-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/brake.jpg"></a>

    Here's the formed pan compared to my cardboard model. I rounded down the sharp corners with a file.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/bent.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/bent-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/bent.jpg"></a>

    To space the pan from the frame and to add some stiffness I cut these sections from aluminum rectangle stock. As can be seen, in preparation for welding I cleaned up the area around the stiffeners with a flapper disk on an electric angle grinder.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/stifeners.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/stifeners-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/stifeners.jpg"></a>

    I had planned to make a slip-in front mount to make it easy to access under the seat, but decided for now to simplify the mount and just have it bolt together. I'll add the slip-in mount when I make an under seat storage box. For the frame side of the mount I attached this section of aluminum angle stock to the rear seat mount and drilled a single hole in its top.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/front-frame-mount.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/front-frame-mount-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/front-frame-mount.jpg"></a>

    I found I needed to do some rework on the pan's front mount once I got it fitted on the bike. It was too wide to fit within the subframe mounting bolts. With the pan centered on the bike I drilled up through the hole in the frame mount and into the pan mount and pan.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/front-mount.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/front-mount-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/front-mount.jpg"></a>

    To hold the blind side of the front mount bolt which will be covered by the seat foam and cover I welded a tab to the head of a bolt and fixed the tab to the pan with a pop rivet. I ground the bolt head down to a lower profile.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/front-bolt.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/front-bolt-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/front-bolt.jpg"></a>

    For the rear mount I made these tabs to weld to the subframe.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/frame-tabs.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/frame-tabs-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/frame-tabs.jpg"></a>

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/tabs-welded.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/tabs-welded-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/tabs-welded.jpg"></a>

    On the seat pan I welded two tabs cut from 1" x 1/8" aluminum stock.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/pan-tabs.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/pan-tabs-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/pan-tabs.jpg"></a>

    I used these clip-on nuts for the rear mount bolts. I may weld some nuts on the bottom of the frame tabs the next time I have the subframe off, or better, make a locking quick release mechanism to work with the slip-in front mount.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/rear-bolts.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/rear-bolts-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/rear-bolts.jpg"></a>

    Here's the seat pan ready for foam and a cover. The side panels really aren't necessary, but I didn't want to just have square block of a seat there so I put on some sides with angles that looked interesting when viewed together with the tank and subframe.

    <a href="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/pan-done.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/pan-done-sm.jpg" border="0" alt="http://stuff.gotdns.org/bike/orgs-build-up/44-new-seat-pan/pan-done.jpg"></a>

    -x3300
  19. Toyanvil

    Toyanvil Adventurer

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2004
    Oddometer:
    1,713
    Location:
    Bakersfield CA
  20. Zebedee

    Zebedee Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2004
    Oddometer:
    851
    Location:
    ... I was born a ramblin' man
    +1