overstay on Argentina tourist import for bike?

Discussion in 'Latin America' started by bush pilot, Nov 15, 2012.

  1. bush pilot

    bush pilot Long timer

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    What are the penalties?

    Last time I managed to forge the dates on the handwritten form issued at the remote crossings. This time I got the computer generated document with the appropriate multi-colored stamps making forgery more of a challenge.

    They gave me 8 months but I'm going to need more.
    #1
  2. moto-treks

    moto-treks Back Home

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    If you are near Buenos Aires stop by Dakar Motos - They can help
    #2
  3. GastonUSAChile

    GastonUSAChile Been here awhile

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    Cross to Uruguay and back again. Careful with forgering docs once are in their system. It could be fatal.

    Dakar Motos is a private business and I doubt it they are going to get involved.
    #3
  4. Misery Goat

    Misery Goat Positating the negative Super Moderator

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    Do not go to the border on an expired import visa, your bike will most likely be confiscated. :deal

    If your passport stamp is expired deal with that first. A day trip to Colonia on one of the boat tours is an easy fix. You will be charged 300 pesos (there is no way around this charge from what I understand) and you'll get your exit stamp and you'll be back in BA that night with a fresh stamp.

    Once your passport is up to date (or if your passport stamp is still good) you can get an extension on your import visa at the aduana office (can't recall the name at the moment downtown BA. I did this, they were very nice to me and I didn't get charged a penalty. Easy Peasy.

    I'll say it again, do not show up at the border on your bike with an expired import visa, I doubt you will like the outcome.

    Contact me offline if you need more specific instructions.
    #4
  5. Javier K.

    Javier K. Adventurer

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    Is really funny how for so long you where complaining about my country and now you confess how you commit a felony forging an official permission and now you want to do it again…

    I’m copying you below what you sign in the TVIP.
    “Me comprometo a retornar al exterior con el vehículo y los elementos detallados precedentemente dentro del plazo acordado, o en su defecto a pagar los derechos y gravámenes que correspondan. Me obligo a cumplir las instrucciones que figuran al dorso y me doy por notificado que la salida fuera de termino constituye una infracción penada por la legislación Argentina con una multa cuya valor será de 1 a 5 veces el importe de los tributos que gravan la importación para consumo y que no podrá ser inferior al 30% del valor en aduana del vehículo, aun cuando no estuviese gravado (Ley nº 22415 Art.970)”

    I compromised myself to return the vehicle and the elements detailed above outside the country and within the agreed period, or failing to pay duties and taxes that apply. I agree to comply with the instructions given overleaf and I give notice that the out of term constitutes an infringement punishable by Argentina which fine value is 1 to 5 times the amount of taxes levied on imports for consumption and which may not be less than 30% of customs value of the vehicle, even if it were not taxed (Art.970 Law No. 22415)
    Also the law says that plus the fine the bike can be confiscate.
    “Art 970 punto 2. Si la importación para consumo o la exportación para consumo, según el caso, de la mercadería en infracción se encontrare prohibida se aplicará además su decomiso.”
    Art 970 paragraph 2. If the import or export, of the merchandise in violation is finds prohibited it applies also the confiscation.

    I must let you know that the taxes for the import of a used vehicle (only allowed under very special conditions and mostly forbidden for not Argentinean people) could be up to around 80% of the vehicle value for customs. This mean the value is not what you declare on your TVIP or what you think is the value in your country, is what customs officers decide it cost.

    All this means that, in the best scenery, you will pay 80 % of what you say that your bike cost. In the worst scenery you will pay 5 time 80% of what custom decide your bike cost. And in both sceneries your bike also can be confiscate before you pay the fine.
    I hope this give you an Idea why the best option for you is to don’t overstay your temporal import. Or store your bike in a different country maybe somewhere where they like people like you who love to talk shit about Argentina while breaking our laws.
    #5
  6. Javier K.

    Javier K. Adventurer

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    Gaston
    WTF are you to say what we are????
    From long time I’m reading how you usufruct the ADV for your own benefit, even lying to people about Argentina and many other things, breaking the forums rules about vendors and spammers, and a lot more even making parabolic reference about us that usually I ignore…
    At least pay a domain and a server and get your own website.
    This time you are very brave or very stupid to mention us.
    (en mi barrio dirían que metas tu nariz en tus propios asuntos)
    For your information, DakarMotos, Sandra & me are a lot more than just a private business
    Just for this time I will keep calm but I will watch you closer…

    Si crees en Dios, pídele que nunca nos crucemos…
    #6
  7. bananaman

    bananaman transcontimental

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    :clap:clap:clap:clap:clap:clap:clap:clap:clap
    #7
  8. bananaman

    bananaman transcontimental

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    Here's what I like about Javier: you don't want to fuck with Javier!

    I like Javier. Sandra is the best, too. A trip to Dakar Motos is worth the trip to Buenos Aires.
    #8
  9. GastonUSAChile

    GastonUSAChile Been here awhile

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    I think you should read well what I said. I am totally against forge documents and I advice Bushpilot NOT DOING IT. I don't know if BP has expired or not his TP but I only said , going to Uruguay and return to Argentina to get more months.
    Also you should read what I said about Dakar Motos. I know that you are a hostel and help riders and others to export their bikes. Good for that. I recommended another inmate here not to use your business to resolve expired TPs or trying to forger computerized documents. Nobody , not you, not me would do such help.
    If Argentina is using a network system to control entries and exits, I assume the risk of overstaying with an expired TPIV es even riskier.

    Don't over react for comments that I did not do. Then comes Banana with his usual type of statements like saying 'don't fuck with Javier'. It is clear that he also misinterpreted my comment. He always do, doesn't matter what is the issue.


    Nunca he trabajado con DAKAR motos y tampoco en Argentina. Al contrario cada vez que me piden algo en USA en relacion a Argentina los he recomendado, asi no los conozca.
    Creo que me interpretastes las palabras mal en mi primer comentario en este thread. Y es injusto que hagas tales comentarios.
    Hasta donde me compete , pueden hacer y ayudar a quien quieran. Lo unico que acosejo a todos es no extralimitarse y hacer cosas no debidas , que ellos mismos no las harian en sus propios paises. Me refiero a los turistas.

    En relacion a tener mi propia pagina, la misma va a salir pronto, pero por por ello no dejo de tener mucho trabajo. Y en cuanto a las palabras usadas, spammer, o tus criticas de mis opiniones , 'lyer' about Argentina, etc..etc.. creo que Bananaman fue el que te dio la pauta para escribir tales acusaciones.
    Nunca escribo nada de Argentina , excepto a aquellos que les recomiendo usar carreteras Argentinas cuando es atractivo. Otro como los problemas que tienen hoy con el mercado del dolar y que no tiene nada de mentira, porque asi como sureno, leo las leyes y periodicos de nuestros paises.

    Te repito, no tengo nada contra Uds (Dakar Motos), al contrario hasta lo he recomendado. Pero ganarse tus acusaciones por algo que interpretastes mal no lo considero justo y apropiado.

    Ahora, a Dios lo invoco por otras cosas. El decir 'no cruzarnos' es amenazante y no me gusta ese tipo de cosas, Algun dia si tuvieramos que ayudarnos mutuamente, por alguna razon por Dios y la vida, bueno a ayudarse se trata.
    Saludos
    #9
  10. GastonUSAChile

    GastonUSAChile Been here awhile

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    Argentitnian Customs regulations for 'non' resident Argentinians. (AFIP ARGENTINA)

    http://www.afip.gob.ar/aduana/circulacionVehiculos.asp

    Ingreso a la Argentina de vehículos de viajeros residentes en los demás países (vehicles of 'non' residents entering Argentina)

    Documentación a Presentar a la entrada (docs require on entry):

    <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="4" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td align="center" width="2%"><table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td align="center" height="14">[​IMG]</td> </tr> </tbody></table></td> <td width="98%"> Título de Propiedad a su nombre emitido por autoridad competente del exterior o, en caso de no ser el propietario, poder suficiente para conducir el vehículo otorgado por el propietario mediante instrumento público. (Title with owner's name)
    </td> </tr> <tr> <td align="center">[​IMG]</td> <td> Licencia para conducir, con validez en la República Argentina (Driver License)
    </td> </tr> <tr> <td align="center" width="2%"><table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td align="center" height="14">[​IMG]</td> </tr> </tbody></table></td> <td width="98%"> Comprobante de Seguro a través del certificado de la póliza de seguro de responsabilidad civil por daños causados a personas y de Seguro a través del certificado de la póliza de seguro de responsabilidad civil por daños causados a personas y objetos no transportados en el vehículo a favor del propietario o conductor del vehículo con cobertura en la república Argentina. (Insurance for the vehicle)
    </td> </tr> </tbody></table>

    <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="4" height="32" width="1"><tbody><tr><td align="center" width="2%">
    </td><td width="98%">
    </td> </tr> <tr> <td align="center">
    </td> <td>
    </td> </tr> <tr> <td align="center" width="2%">
    </td> <td width="98%">
    </td> </tr> </tbody></table>
    Plazo de Permanencia (permanency period):

    El plazo a otorgar será de hasta OCHO (8) MESES, prorrogables en la medida en que la Dirección Nacional de Migraciones, prorrogue la permanencia temporal del viajero en el país. (8 Month or 'possible extension' based only on the visa status allowed in the country at one time. You must be in Argentina and apply for an extension of you on your tourist visa and before expiration.
    Technically, If you left Argentina and came back on another time the extension after 8 month won't apply.

    Importante: Cuando se trate de ciudadanos argentinos radicados en el exterior con una antigüedad no inferior a UN (1) AÑO, además de la documentación exigida anteriormente, deberán presentar un certificado emitido por el Consulado Argentino correspondiente a la jurisdicción del domicilio en el exterior y cambio de domicilio en su documento de identidad, que acredite dicho plazo de permanencia. En tal caso, el plazo a otorgar a la permanencia del vehículo en admisión temporal será de hasta NOVENTA (90) DÍAS, en viajes ocasionales, imporrogables, y por año calendario. (Only for Argentinians living abroad and entering with a vehicle. 90 days max , no extension , on one (1) year calendar.

    Con anterioridad al vencimiento del plazo otorgado a la permanencia, el interesado deberá producir el retorno, de no ser así el interesado será pasible de ser sancionado por infracción al régimen de admisión temporaria de mercaderías, de acuerdo a lo establecido por al Art. 970 del Código Aduanero.
    (
    If your vehicle's Temporary admission expire, sanctions apply per Art.970 Custom's Code)

    Law taken from AFIP and comments by me.
    #10
  11. bush pilot

    bush pilot Long timer

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    "People like me who love to talk shit"??? You mean world travelers who ride motorcycles, who speak several languages? Kinda like the people who are like your customers?

    I never complained about your country, I made some accurate and pointed observations based my experience. If you can't handle that you have a bigger problem than I previously may of thought.
    Do you honestly think it's the "travelers" job to kiss your ass?
    Somehow I'm getting the impression you will be seeing fewer and fewer travelers.


    Anyway, I simply asked a question re. overstay penalty, to which you gave a very windy and officious answer.
    Seems to me you should know what really happens from direct experience with so many travelers, no spout off a bunch of officious nonsense.

    Yea sure I altered a number of a temp import permit and used it and to eave the country. Big deal right!.....no, no one paid any mind.
    I never implied I wished to do that again, in fact the idea behind this thread is to avoid having to do just that.

    I never solicited false accusations from you, nor for you dispense oversensitive nationalist/socialist proclivities.
    If you want to start a thread about how wonderful or not Argentina is and how you love your government pension benefits please do. I for one would love to read about it.
    #11
  12. bananaman

    bananaman transcontimental

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    We understand you fine. Nothing was misinterpreted. And I certainly have no influence over Dakar Motos! Javier is the most experienced everything-moto person I have ever met.

    When I met him, I was straight from Ushuaia, as dirty from the road as a rider can be, still caked with Tierra del Fuego ripio. I was as full of myself as I've ever been, straight from Alaska to Ushuaia and up to Buenos Aires feeling like I'd just accomplished something amazing. And Javier says, "That's nice. We're having pizza." And in the back of the shop, with pizza and beer, were a dozen other riders, everyone in the middle or the beginning or the end of something that made my little ride...

    I certainly have zero influence over Javier. Nobody influences him. He makes up his own mind about everything.

    Once upon a time in America, there was a phrase "tell it to the Marines." In the world of overland transcontimental travel, better than anything, "tell it to Javier."

    sincerely,

    Bananaman

    edit: I just looked up "tell it to the Marines" on wikipedia, and I'm sorry to say that wikipedia has it wrong, at least it's not the way it was taught to me when I was a Marine. We were told that the phrase, "tell it to the Marines," was to test what you were saying as bullshit or not, because Marines, having been everywhere and seen everything, would know if something outlandish would be true. Flying fish, for example- let's say you were telling a story about flying fish, and somebody said, "bullshit. Fish don't fly." Then you could find a Marine, and ask him, "have you ever seen flying fish?" And if the Marine said yes, then your story wasn't bullshit. But if the Marine said No, I've Never Seen Flying Fish, then your story might well be bullshit. Javier, in my example above, is the equivalent of the Marine Corps Sergeant Major, a wise old son-of-a-bitch that nobody fucks with, and he's actually a nice guy.

    Or, in modern usage, he's like Bo, as in Bo Jackson, the great athlete featured in Nike's "Bo Knows" commercials.

    #12
  13. bananaman

    bananaman transcontimental

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    I would guess that in our small world, where riders from all over the world converge in Buenos Aires, over pizza and beer and in the middle of very serious conversations about how to do this crazy sport and live, there are more than a few who don't suffer Gaston, there are more than a few who review the pages of advrider and the HUBB and have formed their own opinions of Gaston and all the other vendor spammers.

    Not only have I actually been to Dakar Motos, but I've also heard great things about Javier and Sandra, from riders who I've actually met (and not just read online, but actually met in person). I've never met anyone (in real life) who has actually met, actually used, and is actually happy with Gaston. I have actually met a few riders who have, like me, guessed that "Gaston" is actually several people posting under one name, but we don't know who "Gaston" actually is.

    Tip for reading Javier: imagine a big teddy bear. Like a Master Sergeant turned vegetarian peacenik. He sounds all gruff and he can sound more than a little tough, but that's because he loves you, and he especially doesn't want another midnight phone-call from someone begging for him to come bail them out of jail.
    #13
  14. GastonUSAChile

    GastonUSAChile Been here awhile

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    For your infromaiton I am the only on here . GASTON and I don't have other pseudos.
    Seriously I think you have paranoid problems.
    I personally pro of Dakar business and good for them . I have mine with different solutions and 100% of my clients are happy and highly recommend me. So, what ever you want to say or add is bull shit to me .
    And no, you don't read well my statements, because your mind preconceive everything before you post.

    As I told you long time ago, and of you remember , blaspheme against a business or a person without reason is serious . A moderator had already to make you erase your post in my vendor's section. So, careful with your posts and attacks.

    Sheeting around against the law on another countries is not right and not healthy. I am the first to promote at least in my country the U.S. and Chile (2 best countries in America) with transparency and following the law.
    #14
  15. bush pilot

    bush pilot Long timer

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    Well Gaston is for real and indeed provides a service for us advriders.

    I gave Javier a couple of opportunities to make some money off me but he wasn't able to deliver.
    First I asked about tires and it took him a week to respond to an email so I considered him less than reliable. On another occasion I inquired about a sprocket for the KLR, which he claimed was impossible to get in Argentina. After wasting a bunch of time and effort trying to get the sprocket in Bangkok I ended up getting the sprocket delivered in Buenos Aires within 10 days through another local friendly advrider channel for a modest $50 fee. Seems strange to me Javier wouldn't be in the "know" about such options for getting parts.

    Now he's on his high horse about the petty bureaucratic paperwork in a country that's in deep economic doodoo.
    Argentina is about to be expelled from the IMF, which means they will default and suffer a currency devaluation. Currently the Argentine peso is trading on the black market for a 27% devaluation over the official rate.

    Another national strike has been announced for tomorrow. Which likely means more piles of garbage of the streets of Buenos Aires.

    I'm sorry Javier if you think this is "talking shit" about your country; but it is simply me observing the news and factual current event's in Argentina.
    If my observations are incorrect please enlighten me. I hate to wander around in ignorance.:ear
    #15
  16. GastonUSAChile

    GastonUSAChile Been here awhile

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    All that you have said is absolute true, I am not gonna get involve with Dakar because I 've never used their service and I don't like to throw things if have nothing to do with me. (impartial on this respect)
    Now, as for Argentina I think speak for itself. I like a lot Argentina, but not even them are happy today with the whole situation, which frankly is going to hell and careful if a new dictatorial regime is in force soon., as in the pass.
    It is a shame what is going on there, it really is a rich country , it has educated people but a lot of corruption, poverty crescendo, etc.....

    Bush, you cannot ask for any part in Argentina today. nothing . U.S. imports (bikes, parts, etc.) are forbidden in order to protect MercoSur or wash their mouse to Brazil.
    Whatever American or Japanese bike is in there, no parts are available, much worse import them.

    On the other side, best thing to do (if your TP is overdue) go to Customs, tell them that your bike had a mechanical issue. Get a written statement from a mechanic in Argentina an go to talk with Customs. They understand and this factor is part of the law for an extension. I know a case in Argentina and they got rid of any penalty on further extension.


    We'll see what happen. The government is tighten the cords and worried of a massive $$ exodus. Total control as possible.
    #16
  17. Javier K.

    Javier K. Adventurer

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    No Alex, I mean exactly what I have says, I talk about people who blablabla not travellers, I’m a traveller who rides a motorcycle also and speak two languages at least (???) Kinda I have a lot of customers but I don’t sell my soul or my beliefs because of money… I’m first a human being, second a biker, then a traveller, then many other things and down there after all the important I’m a guy who have a way for pay the bills, working honestly with what I love, bikes and travels
    I mean people, not travellers, people who post things like the ones here: http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=806161&page=3
    And as in many other threads that I don’t will try to find it now and read it again, you know better than me… but maybe you are right and I can’t with that so I promise that this will be my last intervention on those subjects I will try to enlighten you but as I presume will be futile I will give up and don’t reply you or somebody else again anymore after this time. So here are some facts (at least for me, I don’t expect you are agree):
    No, I don’t honestly think it's the "travellers" job to kiss my ass, never was my plan till now but you never know, maybe in a future I swap my sexual preferences and who know… Anyway, if it happens, I will try to keep it in private…
    You were asking which are the penalties and I give you the exact letter from the law about that penalties, and not a windy answer, maybe I should tell you to take the risk and get many possibilities to win a place in the next “Banged up Abroad” TV Show on NatGeo
    You have a Double Moral, you don’t like and complain about some situations in Argentina, is your option to don’t come back anymore. But instead of that you insist and want to keep overstaying your bike here... at same time you contribute with the corruption committing a felony but looks than that it’s okay if you are a gringo and the rules and laws doesn’t fit you... you can call that in the way you like if make you fill better...
    I never give you false accusations, you confess it. ¿dispense oversensitive nationalist/socialist proclivities? Hahaha!!! No, my friend, nothing farthest from there…

    Ok then you says you gave me a couple of opportunities to make some money off you but I wasn't able to deliver. First asking about tires and that took me a week to respond to an email so you considered me less than reliable. Well that’s another falsehood, luckily I have copy of all the emails I received and I sent. Your first contact were on Jan 4th at 5:51PM, well I reply you exactly next morning Jan 5th at 10:26AM and your reply saying you got tires in Rio Gallegos comes though the Jan 6th at 5:39PM (of course with a complain that was “Expensive but worth it.”) So where are that week and where was the unreliability if you chose to buy the tires there? Then on the Feb 9th at 6:18PM you ask for something and we reply you on the 10th at 11:17AM, at 11:40 AM you respond telling that what we offer you doesn’t fit you, and we understood that, it’s okay... On the Friday July 6th at 7:10 PM an email with your sprockets require arrived even been in holidays we reply you on the 10th telling you that “we didn’t have sprockets or filter for KLRs at that moment.” Recommending you as you were coming from Thailand where the JT Sprockets are made to bring it from there and maybe the filter as well (Hiflow are not made too??). Sorry but we never told you that all that were impossible to find it in Argentina, only that was complicate at that moment. Only that we didn’t have in stock and been in holidays wasn’t easy to get that for you.. Sorry if was a misunderstanding but at least this was useful for you to complain that even parts isn’t possible to get in Argentina (just check the link above)
    Man, my only one high horse is my beloved Africa Twin sick and in intensive care for waste my time replying stupid thing like this, all my fault...
    About the petty bureaucratic paperwork in a country that's in deep economic doodoo and about to be expelled from the IMF, which means will default and suffer a currency devaluation.
    About national strikes which likely means more piles of garbage of the streets of BA maybe you can enlighten us how to solve all of this. We are lost, maybe we have to kiss some gringo asses?, maybe we have to fallow the IMF recipes?, or maybe do what the masters of the capitalism says? Ohhh my god Adam Smith where are you now when we need you??? Heyyyyyy WAIT.... we already have done all of that during a century...and to where that takes us??? Mmm same that Spain, Greece, Portugal, well maybe more of Europe, and the USA they didn’t have a devaluation of the dollar there even to the Euro that is going down also there?, people doesn’t leave in the streets of NYC? Isn’t garbage on the streets there or in many other places? Where is Africa with all this good guys from the IMF??
    Well maybe better if this time we try to find a different way, maybe will take another century, provably I will not see it, for sure will not be this government, maybe we can’t but we will try or at least is what I try to teach to my two sons.. And we are who will suffer the consequences, don’t worry...
    I'm sorry Alex if I can enlighten your ignorance. The only advice I can give you now is to respect the places, the rules and peoples mind of places you visit, keep your arrogance very deep in your panniers or maybe better make it disappear. Are you who come to visit my land talking bad about it in a non constructive way and not as opposite...
    As I was telling you at the begin of this very long reply this will be last time I get involve in debates like these, I think all of this is pointless and doesn’t change anything, you will still have your pre-concepts and I will do the same, so I don’t will waste anymore my scarce time, better to invest it on fix my bikes and ride it... good bye!!!

    PS for Gaston: Maybe you too deserve also a last reply and clarification about some facts; I will think about and maybe come back to you as soon I get some leftover time... chau
    #17
  18. bush pilot

    bush pilot Long timer

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    Well Javier thanks for the thoughtful reply.
    In hindsight I thought for sure I tried to contact you about tires prior to going to Rio Gallegos. Looks like I dropped the ball on the email., my bad. I apologize.

    But also in hindsight your reply would have been entirely unnecessary had you not jumped my shit in this thread.
    I suppose you had no way of knowing that even though JT sprockets are made in Thailand there's isn't a way to get one for a KLR which isn't used and supported there.
    It's unlikely you don't know about the Miami/Buenos Aires connection for getting parts, which sidesteps some of the ridiculous and unnecessary official steps.
    If I made an alteration to a document which had no consequence to you or anyone else, what's your beef?
    As for morality that's for humans to decide not government. You did mention that you were human first!


    As far as your "Argentina love it or leave it" attitude goes I'm at a loss for words except for saying "liberty" seems to be a lost concept with the Castro/Chavez nationalist/socialist/communist model of government, be it Argentina or the USA.
    But have no fear Javier, I have no intention to live in Argentina and become a bum and mooch off your government. Since I paid my $160 for my 10 year visa I'll continue to come and go as it suits me, thank you.

    Cheers, hopefully your business shall improve.
    #18
  19. bananaman

    bananaman transcontimental

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    Political rants are better in the basement.

    Those of you who regularly forge documents and pay bribes only make it harder for the rest of us.

    Clearly, Javier was professional with his responses to you regarding bike parts, while you acted like a spoiled child with your "I WANT IT NOW!" attitude. It's not Javier's fault if you were out of tires or needed an oil change in the middle of nowhere. Maybe, next time, do a little planning, and, maybe, like, I don't know... carry an extra oil filter. It's not hard. I carry one, sometimes two.

    After reading your rants about Argentina in the thread Javier posted, it's clear that you and Gaston are made for each other. Me- I'll stick with Javier (if he'll have me!). I loved Argentina.

    [​IMG]

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    #19
  20. bush pilot

    bush pilot Long timer

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2006
    Oddometer:
    2,526
    Location:
    Thailand
    Indeed
    That's bullshit and you know it
    Clearly Javier withheld infomation which might have been very useful for a traveler in Tierra Del Fuego. Such as tires and parts are much cheaper and easier to get in Punta Arenas.
    Also I never made any demands from Javier. I just used him as a contact, Unfortunately his logistics didn't fit with my travels.
    As far as getting parts in Buenos Aires goes, indeed it's difficult but far from impossible, and turned out to much easier that searching Bangkok for two weeks trying to find a sprocket.
    So I'm not allowed to make honest observations? It's really not my fault someone like you decides to take such observations personally.
    Again if my observations are inaccurate please illuminate me, since you seems to be such and Argentina expert. (nice pictures BTW)

    As far as you, Gaston and myself go you seems to be the one with a penchant for stirring up shit.
    I complied once to your PM request to alter a response to one of your posts with you later altered. That was in the spirit being helpful and the spirit of this forum.
    I asked a fairly simple question in this thread to which I've yet to get a simple answer.
    Instead I get these rather astonishing "by the book" moron replies.
    So you and Javier want to barbeque me over changing a 4 into a 9, which had no consequence. Well, my response doesn't bear publishing, thank you.

    Cheers, Happy Thanksgiving, we'll be bbq'ing a pig Iowa style.:clap
    #20