Sachs Madass 125 or Sym Wolf Classic 150

Discussion in 'Battle Scooters' started by iMav, Jun 23, 2013.

  1. iMav

    iMav keyboard geek

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    Couldn't find an appropriate forum for this question... Given the relatively small displacement of these bikes, this might be a good fit.

    Anyways...my main bike is a BMW R1200RT. It handles all my riding "heavy lifting". What I am looking for is something small, nimble, and fun for around town.

    I am leaning a bit towards something like the Wolf Classic, simply because I love the classic styling and the ability to, at least, get me to highway speeds if I need to dash over to the next town.

    My choices aren't absolutely narrowed down to these two...but I do fancy them. ;)

    Thoughts??
    #1
  2. tortoise2

    tortoise2 Been here awhile

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  3. klaviator

    klaviator Long timer

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    The first time i saw a Sym Wolf Classic I started drooling. It looks like a fun little ride. However, if you want something fun AND practical for running errands, getting groceries, etc, I would recommend a small scooter. I was looking for an around town bike 3 years ago. After over 30 years of riding motorcycles I got my first scooter, a Kymco Super 8 150. This is the most fun around town bike I have ever owned. After nearly 3 years and almost 12,000 miles, this thing still puts a smile on my face every time I ride it and I ride it nearly every day, usually several times. I ride it so often because it is so practical and pretty much replaces my cage.

    Why a scooter? It's effortless to use and they are much better at carrying stuff than most motorcycles. There is storage under the seat. It's easy to mount a tail trunk and many have flat floorboard which can be used to carry a lot of stuff.

    I love my Super 8 but if you plan on riding on the highway you may want something a little bit bigger like a Sym HD200.

    Anyway a couple of pics.

    Practical:

    [​IMG]

    Fun:

    [​IMG]
    #3
  4. soupamoto

    soupamoto Singletrack Jedi

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    I vote for the Sachs MadAss 125, but I'm biased, as I have one, and it is for sale. My wife and I love the MadAss, it's just a hoot to ride. Wish we had more opportunity to ride it.

    [​IMG]
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  5. JerryH

    JerryH Banned

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    If you love the styling on the Wolf, then nothing else is going to make you happy, assuming you intend to stay with a small motorcycle rather than a scooter. I'm a bit big for either of these bikes, but came very close to buying a Wolf Classic on looks alone, plus it has a centerstand and kickstarter.

    I personally have no interest in the MadAss. If you like the look that's fine. But I would be unable to ride it due to it's ergos. And that seat is not much better that those tiny little bump stops they put on road bicycles. Yes, some people love those. I have a large cruiser style seat on my bicycle, but then I actually sit on it.

    They are 2 totally different bikes. I guess it depends on which one you like. If you haven't, I would at least sit on them both, and get a feel for the riding position. I personally found the Wolf much more comfortable and pleasing to look at.
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  6. 24LeMons

    24LeMons Adventurer

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    I'll second Klaviator's recommendation for a scooter as an around-town ride. Storage is just such a huge asset for running everyday errands. My Vespa GTS250--which has decent but not amazing storage--carries my sunglasses, a small collapsible shopping bag, a bungee net for the rear cargo rack, gloves, a small flashlight, a light jacket, and an extender for the helmet hook. Minor stuff, but where would you put all of that on a Wolf or MadAss? (Plus, in the case of the GTS and other 250CC+ scooters, you'll leave the Wolf and MadAss in the dust. Not to mention that the MadAss 125 isn't freeway legal in many states.)

    Sometimes scooters are like minivans--the tool you actually need for the job, but you just don't want to be seen driving one! Go with your heart--a scooter may not float your boat--but you've already got a "real" motorcycle and a scoot would be the perfect companion.
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  7. fullmetalscooter

    fullmetalscooter Let me take this duck off

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    Done some reading around about Sym Wolf Classic and on the sym forum they kind of say no up to SYM normal quality . For what it is a honda clone it's ok but the issues seem to by quality with people saying stuff about china built etc. Just repeating the shit I ve read. So read up on them on the sym forum first. I would got was madass . More fun , better built and a company that goes back 50 years is its the same Sachs of that made 50cc mop etc.
    #7
  8. Birdmove

    Birdmove Long timer

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    I think the Wolf is made in Taiwan like the SYM scooters. SYM gives a 2 year warranty. Our SYM HD200 has been an awesome scooter. We have a cargo box on the back. Between that box, the under seat storage, and the grocery bag hook, you wouldn't believe the groceries I can carry. It'll do 65 mph and get low to high 80's mpg doing it.
    Between the Madass and the Wolf, I'd go for the wolf. SYM makes quality stuff. They all have ceramic coated cylinders too. The Madass is straight from China. If you don't think Taiwan can make good stuff, SYM, Kymco, and Genuine/PGO are all made there. So, why are these three bike makers the ONLY ones that give a 2 year warranty? We also have a Kymco People 150, and it is a fine scooter.
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  9. JerryH

    JerryH Banned

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    I read the same thing. I also saw some of those issues on a new Wolf Classic I looked at. Already had some rust, and cracked rubber. Paint was blotchy. Definitely not the same quality as say an HD200. But I noticed the same issues on the Symba. I believe these bikes are not built in the same place as SYM scooters are. I also doubt the 2 year warranty covers things like rust, paint problems, or rotted rubber.

    Sachs USED to be a German company, but it is now 100% Chinese. I used to own a Sachs moped (pedal type) Talk about quality. I think they even had Puch beat. But just like with Schwinn, a Chinese company bought the name. The old Sachs company is long gone.
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  10. soboy

    soboy Long timer

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    I think the Madass is one of the the coolest small bikes I have ever seen. However, it just isn't as practical as a small scooter. I use my Agility 125 as an errand runner and the combination of its agility (it is well named), CVT and large lockable storage makes it insanely useful.
    #10
  11. wolf kid

    wolf kid n00b

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    Hi guys I am selling my almost brand new 2012 sym wolf classic 150 has only about 89 miles on it always stored in the garage email me if you are intrested samtabulin@yahoo.com it is the red and white one
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  12. blugg1

    blugg1 Been here awhile

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    The Wolf Classic is great-looking and no doubt fun to ride. But why would you buy a 150cc motorcycle in the first place? As far as motorcycles go, it's at the bottom of the food chain. And it's not much use on open roads where you can motor along at 65-70 mph, and it's useless for freeways.

    Better off, much better off, with the SYM HD200 scooter, which will indeed cruise along at 65-70 mph. It's got great fit and finish, 16" wheels, will hold a whole lot of stuff and the engine is strong and reliable.
    #12
  13. gitsum79

    gitsum79 Adventurer

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    The SYM Wolf is a fun, reliable and economical motorcycle. It is surprisingly peppy for an air-cooled 150. Great for a commuter bike if you travel light. But for running errands and grabbing some groceries, it's not even close to a 150cc scooter with a flat floorboard.

    There are lots of quality scooters in the $1800 - $2500 price range.

    Tomos Nitro 150 (made by SYM), Lance (made by SYM) Cali Classic - PCH - Havana 150, Kymco Agility 125, Kymco Super 8 150, Kymco Like 200i.

    That being said I still miss my Wolf Classic 150...
    #13
  14. DudeClone

    DudeClone Long timer

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    so what is the attaction of the wolf, you think?

    i was at a dealer today and sat on one. even at 6'3 it was OK and everything looked good and seemed well built. i was genuinely impressed with its looks and aesthetic quality

    you had one so i can't say for sure, but seems it would make as you say, a fun little get around bike. it is cool looking which can't be said of most scooters, and you get to shift. which is a plus for many and why they DON'T buy scooters

    as i looked at one today next to an HD200 if i wanted a small engine motorcycle for city streets and congested freeways moving at 50-60mph it seems a nice little motorcycle. the HD200 parked next to it? well, looks like a big scooter. good as we all know it is

    you must miss your Wolf for a reason, gitsum? :cry
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  15. gitsum79

    gitsum79 Adventurer

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    I miss the Wolf because it was fun and it looked really nice. While it was pretty decent on civilized dirt roads, it was pretty cramped with a passenger. Too small for any useful sized saddlebags, a seat bag was the only option for any cargo duties, but then no place for a passenger and no place to stow two helmets. A bit small for touring, but doable on two lane highways.

    Once the fun and cool factor faded a bit, the lack of practicality became more noticeable. For my use a little runabout bike needs to have functional storage/cargo capability and the extra weather protection of a scooter is nice.

    On the flat floorboard I have carried a car battery, 25 pound box of kitty litter, huge bag of pet food and other large/heavy items that even a larger motorcycle would not be able to handle. You can carry groceries on the bag hook, under the seat or in the top case. You can secure two helmets out of sight and a center stand sure is handy. For extended rides having multiple positions for your feet makes a big difference in comfort. I like to shift too, but a well tuned scooter transmission works seamlessly and feels peppy.

    I like all small bikes, both scooters and motorcycles and have had up to six at one time. But if I only had one, practicality beats fun on a day to day basis. In their own way, scooters are also fun and entertaining.
    #15
  16. WheelsnKeels

    WheelsnKeels Bikes n Boats

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    Heh, "bottom of the food chain"... Au contraire, friend! :)

    When I first decided I'd like to get back into riding, I thought I would have to buy a vintage bike. I specifically wanted a small 'cycle, efficient, light and nimble. Nice looks would have been a bonus. Something almost specifically for backroads, a bike like I used to ride when I was a kid, back in time before the "cc wars". I like the KISS principle and employ it throughout my life, working and traveling. I have a van which is great for the freeway, if I want to travel at high speed and am more concerned with the destination than with the journey. So I was looking for vintage, thinking it was my only alternative, when I found the Wolf.

    The fact that I could get a NEW bike which is pretty much the same as a small vintage streeter was awesome, and fit perfectly into my plans. I know I am in a minority, yet - your ride is yours, and my ride is mine. I've used it for 2 months now as a daily rider, adapted it to work with both my work and with my play. I ride solo, and with bags or a case, use it to tote my groceries, computers, and/or camping gear. I can run at 60/65+mph highway and stay with traffic or close to it, if need be. I'd rather the back way, though, with less traffic and more relaxation. The Wolf is everything I was looking for.

    I also have a Buddy 150 - great lil scoot, like has been pointed out the floorboard and built-in storage is nice - but I don't want to take it up over 45-50 for very long, those small wheels get the jitters and don't like sudden elevation changes, even if only on the scale of a pothole or speed bump. It is great for buzzing around town, if I lived in a big city it would probably be my primary, but down here in the Lowcountry of SC, the distances are greater and the roads are more motorcycle-friendly. And if you have to get off the road for a little bit to avoid a deer, dead 'coon, or cager, then the Wolf is eminently more suited to the conditions.

    Hardly the bottom of anything, instead she's just perfect. For my ride.

    See ya out there. :)

    On Edit: As always, and in Taiwan, SYM made small Honda's for Honda under contract, from 1962 on until 85-90 or thereabouts. The Wolf is basically an upgraded CB125S with a larger, ceramic-coated piston, CDI, hydraulic front disc, etc etc... The cracking rubber mentioned was on the turn signals - it's an easy fix: dismount the signal from the bike, remove the rubber part, remount signal. Or swap 'em out. Quick, cheap, easy. I haven't seen any complaints about rust or other quality issues as inferred by a couple of the comments here.
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  17. JerryH

    JerryH Banned

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    I would not buy a MadAss, just because I don't like the look, and the ergos do not look comfortable. Too lean forward for me. I would love to have a Wolf 150 if the quality matched SYM scooters. I admit it is not as useful as a small scooter, nor as easy to operate. But I am a huge fan of vintage bikes (that's why I have the Stella) and the Wolf looks just like one. It would be FUN to ride. Small, lightweight, easy to handle, and running it up through the gears at full throttle should be a blast. I use the Stella more as a toy, just to take out and ride for short distances, just for fun. The Wolf would serve the same purpose. But when I want to go somewhere, I always take one of the CVT scooters. For those who want a bike just for the fun of riding it, I don't see how a bike like the Wolf could be beat. But I fear it may suffer from the same quality issues as the Stella. At least vintage Vespa parts fit the Stella, and it is fairly easy to work on. If they quit selling the Wolf here, I don't know if parts will be available.

    Has anyone ridden the Wolf for any substantial time (say like all day) at 50 mph, without problems? Definitely not something I would try on the Stella.
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  18. blugg1

    blugg1 Been here awhile

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    gitsum had one and he rode it lots, off-road, on-road, long day trips, etc. Asl him.
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  19. Vertical C

    Vertical C Long timer

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    I had a madass, the suspension on the front was too soft and the rear too hard for offroad. Mine was starting to have issues at 14000kms so I sold it. It was a fun bike though, it handled really well.
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  20. WheelsnKeels

    WheelsnKeels Bikes n Boats

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    Hi Jerry -

    I've a bit over 1K miles in the saddle of my Wolf now, and can tell you that quality is not an issue; also, from what I've read the Wolf is made in the same factory as the scooters. I don't have a Stella, but I do have a Buddy ('09 Italia 150), and from what I've read on the Modern Buddy forums, I would say that the Wolf is of better quality and more reliable than the Stella. It is at a level of, if not better than, the quality of the Buddy.

    225 miles today @mostly 55-60+, first day of a long weekend/short vacation. "Lillie" handled it with no problems whatsoever (the whole "ran out of gas" thing was *my* fault... :shog).

    Heading another ~150 over to Bryson tomorrow, then 2-3 days of area riding including the Dragon, before the 360 mile trip back home. Will likely be ~1K miles in total by the time I get back home. Trip report coming.
    #20