So, I was wondering...

Discussion in 'Crazy-Awesome almost Dakar racers (950/990cc)' started by ElRod, Oct 23, 2012.

  1. ElRod

    ElRod Been here awhile

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    To try and battle this I bought a fuel tester here.

    http://www.fueltestkit.com/index.html

    Really nothing more than a graduated test tube and some water wouldn't do, but the kit is very handy. Went around my area and tested premiums from Exxon, Chevron, Shell, and Valero. All of these pumps had a shared hose and handle for regular, mid, and premium which means I had to run a gallon first to get a good premium sample. All had ethanol content from 8 to 10 percent. Most disturbing was that two samples had a cloudy appearance right out of the pump indicating early phase separation if I have that correct.

    The good news is I found a station that sells pure gas 15 miles from where I work.
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    Would have hoped for 93 octane but I'll take it over the 10 percent.

    BTW for whatever good it may do speak out here http://www.fueltestkit.com/fuel_choice_petition.html
    #21
  2. AdvGa

    AdvGa Long timer

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    Thanks for sharing your findings... I was hoping for less Ethanol in the High Test Fuel. Each State is different on how they manage the Fuel Stations usually by the Dept. Of Agriculture and the EPA.

    At least you can get, fairly easily, some Fuel without Ethanol.

    Keep in mind, the Cloudiness you mentioned in the Fuel, may Not be Ethanol but some Residues from the Fiberglass Fuel Tanks driven by the Solvent/Corrosive affects from Ethanol .

    So with this info, it is best for sure to get Fuel from busy Gas Stations that have better Fuel Turnover to keep from getting aged Fuel and its risks associated with it.
    #22
  3. ElRod

    ElRod Been here awhile

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    One other thing I did on the advice of an engineer pal of mine (he rides a BMW but I'll let that slide) was to add a tap to the tanks crossover / equalization hose to be able to drain off a small amount of fuel from the bottom of the tanks where water would accumulate. Great idea whenever I have to use E10 again, especially if the bike sits for any length of time I can simply drop the skid plate and drain as needed.

    Got the brass tee and the valve from McMaster Carr and installed it this evening. I had some spring hose clamps leftover from doing the canisterectomy / SAS removal and thought they were the size needed but are too small and had to use the zip ties for now. I'll get some clamps the right size ASAP.

    To make access quick and easy I had to make the quick disconnects myself as the ones offered by KTM Twins would have been too short to use with the Weld 86 skid plate I have. Got the idea here.....
    http://www.ktmtwins.com/ktm-950-990-adventure-skid-plate-quick-disconnect-kit


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    #23
  4. HeatXfer

    HeatXfer Bad knees

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    ElRod

    Brilliant, thank you. :clap
    #24
  5. ciedema

    ciedema мотоциклист

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    I hate running E10 - in Aus straight fuel is available almost everywhere. Riding around the US it is as rare as hens teeth.
    #25
  6. grinns

    grinns Semper Fi

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    This is exactly what happened to mine too. Make sure you clean in the intakes really well because it will cover the map holes completely too.
    #26
  7. ElRod

    ElRod Been here awhile

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    Of course I'm biased now after all that but for anyone that has a poorly running bike with shitty fuel mileage these are the first thing I'd look at. Cleaning these WILL become part of my regular maintenance. Should be in the manual.
    #27
  8. HeatXfer

    HeatXfer Bad knees

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    ElRod

    I talked to a retired friend of mine who was a chemical engineer for Dow (an avid MXr who used to ride with Dick Mann back in the day). I asked him about E10 and showed him the pics of your throttle bodies; he said that ethanol is a solvent and by itself wouldn't leave those deposits. He said that crap looks like old gas varnish from the fuel system (tank, gas lines & fuel pump) that was dissolved by the ethanol and got deposited on the butterflies where it accumulated and hardened.

    I asked about the corrosive effects on aluminum engine parts and damaging the brass injectors, he said aluminum would be affected if it came in direct contact with ethanol, but at the 10% to possible 15% found in gas it would be negligible. He said it would have an even lesser affect on brass. He said it will eventually dissolve most if not all rubber gaskets, and it will dissolve the resins in fiberglass and epoxy.

    I know ethanol BTUs are lower than gasoline, so performance is definitely an issue, but after talking to him I get the feeling that understanding how to cope with ethanol is the answer. He said ethanol additives simply bond to the ethanol molecules to help mitigate water absorption, so that is a line of defense, but he said that might adversely affect fuel economy too.

    I don't think we're going back to ethanol-free gas anytime soon (in Calif). I still think your fuel cross-over drain is good idea, especially for ADV riders who attempt water crossings.:wink: Although he and I both agree utilizing food grains to produce fuel is probably not in the public's best interest (but a money maker for someone).

    Anyway, my 2¢
    #28
  9. ElRod

    ElRod Been here awhile

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    I have to agree with that to some extent. After I got all that cleaned up I went into a local independent cycle shop here that I get my supplies from for a can of chain lube and started talking to an older gentleman there. One thing led to another and I told the story and showed him those photos. Immediately he says it's not the ethanol leaving the deposits but rather the emulsification being made by the fuel conditioner used. I had been using Lucas Ethanol Fuel Treatment at the time. Regardless, it's still a problem one way or another.

    Thanks for that input, it goes to give credit to his thoughts.
    #29
  10. MCCOYBOY

    MCCOYBOY Adventurer

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    I bought one of these http://www.launchtechusa.com/assets/products/xsonicbt.pdf

    Works like a charm.
    #30
  11. ElRod

    ElRod Been here awhile

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    Just an update on this.

    Over a year now and 3,500 miles later a quick inspection with a flashlight and mirror revealed what I was hoping to find.....no further contamination and as clean as the day it was re-assembled. For the most part using pure gas with the occasional fill ups with E-10 on the road when pure gas cannot be found and always with a shot of SeaFoam.

    I'd have to fully agree with HeatXfer now that the contamination originally found was due to the ethanol fuel treatment I was using at the time causing the emulsification and subsequent build up of that "gunk".
    #31