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Discussion in 'Northeast - Greater Flugistan and home of the carp' started by aicram22, Dec 24, 2015.
do you have a specific question?
I can post some instructions.
by Blais »
Below is an updated version of “how to stud your dirt bike tire procedure”, starting with Tony procedures with inputs found on the web, Jim’s cleaning steps, talking with Rick and my own learning curve. Kevin's Cycle also has a good Studding 101 write up at http://kevinscycle.blogspot.com/2010/11 ... l?spref=fb Fred.
If club members are thinking about doing some riding this winter, keep in mind that the club owns a stud gun that can be used by any member in good standing.
1.0 Pre-Studding Set-up
How to get the gun: See the sticky threads at the top of this forum.
How to buy studs: Call up the good folks at http://www.brunowessel.com 914-909-5282 (POC: Marion Nicholson, Office Manager or Garry Wessel, President) and tell them you're with the Pathfinders dirtbike club. They'll give you a good deal. On past purchases we've received 25% off of list prices. For car studs, they come 1,000 per box and cost about $55. For rally studs, they come 500 per box and cost about $135 Count the knobs on your tire to find out how many you'll need...typically 200-250 per tire.
What studs to buy: Our gun is a 9mm model, so all studs have to be that width to work. Our gun can shoot car studs and rally studs. For car studs, I've found 9x12mm to shoot well. For the rear you can go a little longer, 9x15mm. For rally studs I'd recommend 9x16mm front and maybe 9x18 rear. Much taller than that and I find they are tough to get seated deeply enough.
Other equipment: air compressor, cordless drill, Gorilla Glue, spray bottle with water, disposable gloves (change often), solvent to prevent gun from jamming & post studding clean-up (acetone, paint thinner, other).
2.0 Studding Procedure
Never Operate Tire Studding or other Equipment without proper Safety Equipment. Safety Glasses and work gloves should always be used for your own protection.
Tire Location: (Off Rim-recommended) If working in winter conditions, pre-warm the tires for 24 hours inside. Use an open vice and slipped the tire (no rim) over the outer jaw or on wood blocks clamped in the vise. A curved piece of 2x12 screwed to a leg made out of 4x4, clamped to a table will also work. (On Bike) Put tire pressure up to about 30-40 psig before drilling & studding. Downside- drilling through to tube, no inspection of potential inside damage to tire, knocking the bike off of a stand when studding, working in cramped area. Upside - Quick, No need to mount studded tire.
Pre-drilling your tires: In the box with the stud gun you'll find a special bit and stop. I've found that you have to drill down about 2-3mm deeper than the stud you're shooting. Plunge the bit into the knob and let it spin there for a second before pulling it out. If you're working on a tire with bigger knobs in the center, you can do two studs per bigger knob. NOTES: (1) Test drill one knob and shoot a stud to check drill bit depth setting. (2) Re-check drill bit depth setting has not changed as you go. (3) You may find it easier to drill 8-10 holes, shoot studs in those holes and repeat.
Connect the gun to an air compressor running about 100-110psi. Don't go any higher than that, you don't need more pressure anyway.
Most of the time you will want to use a glue to help hold the studs in...this also helps lubricate the gun's fingers when you insert them. Put a small drop of Gorilla glue on each hole in a section about 10 inches long at a time. Then, spray the whole section with water from a spray bottle to activate the Gorilla glue.
Load the gun with 8-10 studs through the tube on the back of the gun. The stud goes into the gun flat-side first with the point of the stud facing out.
Insert the fingers of the gun in the hole until they bottom out. You will have to use downward force and rotation of the gun at this point. Squeeze the trigger while continuing to push down. Release the trigger and pull out.
The top of the body of a car stud should be flush with the top of the knob with the nipple of the stud sticking up above that. For rally studs, the flange that is below the pointed part of the stud should be just slightly buried.
IMPORTANT: Before re-inserting the fingers into the next whole, check to make sure they are aligned into a point - if not just move them.
ALSO IMPORTANT: If you're using glue, you need to keep the gun's fingers from being glued together. About once every 5 minutes you need to dip the nose of the gun into acetone (or other solvent for your glue). I use a soup can about 3/4 full. Dip the nose in for a few seconds, then dry-fire the gun so that the internal fingers stick out and dip those.
It will probably take you about 1 hour per tire.
When studding is completed, immediately perform the stud gun cleaning procedure or the glue will jam the gun for the next user.
3.0 Stud Gun Cleaning Procedure
The steel head assembly of the stud gun is spring loaded, use extreme caution when disassembling
Remove the spring o-ring, three stainless outmost fingers, then the three black inner fingers and let them soak in the coffee can, place the nose of the gun in the can, the entire black nose should be submerged in solvent.
Remove the steel head assemble to access the 3 internal insertion fingers.
Remove the 3 internal insertion fingers and use a razor blade to clean them.
Clean out the bore of the gun, and apply air tool oil (or fork oil) to the bore and the piston cup seal. Use care if you removed the piston from the rod because the seal there is not going to like getting on to the piston rod shoulder without a seal protector. Clean, lubricate (fork oil) and reassemble.
If any Gorilla Glue residue to still present on the next day, it will hardened and you will have to scrape it off.
Re-assemble the gun, look at the black nose first and use a screwdriver to ensure the slots are clear, blow off with compressed air. Then clean the three black and three stainless fingers, rub the black ones, and use a razor blade on the stainless ones.
Install the three black fingers back in the thin slots so the semi-circle aligns with the spring groove in the nose of the gun. Install the three stainless fingers on and install the spring O-ring. Connect the stud gun to the air compressor and test activate the gun for proper operations
4.0 Tire and Stud Type Combinations
Front: MT-16 with 16mm Rear: MT-16 with 18.5mm and 16mm around outer most knobs. (Fred Stone)
That gun is great, I have one I use to make tires with car studs. For rally and friction spikes I have the push rod type gun. Not saying you can't use that gun for rally's but I would buy some extra inserting fingers because they tend to bend and/or break.
0.50$ for rally/ mx studs < for automotive your tires or Artrax SX1 for $100 a set
Thank you very much for the instructions. Super helpful! I'm a machinist and can figure out most things mechanical but, I didn't know you use the glue as a lubricant when shooting the stud. My thought is I can drive the cost down a little for ADV riders. $300 a tire is crazy. I can make them for $200 easy.
Thanks alot! I got a refurbished gun from BW. Really nice folks.
I thought the same thing, but once you figure in your labor costs, costs of tooling $300 a tire is about right. I use Loctite 380 as a glue for long studs,no glue necessary for automotive style. This is an epoxy that bonds metal and rubber. Have yet to loose a stud.
I borrowed a manual stud setter (converted caulking gun?) some years ago and made up a set of auto stud tires that worked very well. I think it took me two full days so $300 a tire isn't that far off, no doubt a pneumatic gun would be faster (and easier on your hands) but you still have to drill all the knobs, buy studs and a tire and get the gun so ..........
An important lesson was that a stud or two for your boots can be a good idea as stopping studded tires on ice was pretty easy but holding the bike up was not.
That's a nice collection of winter tires! We just need some good ice in southern NE. Dam Global Warming...
First time I studded a set of tires for a motorcycle was 1972. We had a hand tool that was like a bent screwdriver with a hollow tip (like the ones with changeable bits). We hand set 150-200 studs in each tire. I had a huge blister on my palm when we got finished. Spent every weekend riding that winter. Scratched the hell outta Congamond lakes. Worth the effort, but I wouldn't want to do that again. Rather borrow a gun or just buy then already set.
You might be a machinist but wait until you take that gun apart and have to put it back together.......
it gets confusing fast....... have fun....
oh and that 100.00 for studding the tires (labor) is so worth it when you realize your arm is done after 1/3 of a tire.
"Mikes Studded Tires" NETRA guy has a stand that he uses, I hear good things about his tires, not sure if he is still doing them.
I have made a pile of tires for myself over the years, dreaded it more and more after each set. It was more my hand than my arm that would get to me after a while until I started doing this....
Using ebay.com .
I have the same gun. All I can say is good luck. It does work, but your muscles WILL ache. After a few tires, you get decent at it. Using a quality drill is very helpful, you can forget about cordless ones.. If you don't use glue (I dont) , use soapy water in a spray bottle as lube. If you do use glue, the loctite Black Max stuff is the best. As for the studs, shorter is better in my opinion. They stay in better and ride better on trails that are half covered with snow. I wouldnt even suggest trying to ride if the snow is deeper than 6"' , but that's another thing you will find out for yourself. Again, good luck.
Just had these puppies made from ORC in Portland PA.....I brought in the fresh knobs....went with the maxxis desert for the rear...figured the stiffer sidewall would be an asset if by chance a flat occurred....stiffer sidewall would help the limp back to the truck. $0.40 a stud....+/-300 per tire. Looking for ICE
Studded my 1st set today. 300 studs in the front, 250 in the rear. The gun works great! I made a stand to hold the tire so, I could get some good downward pressure on the gun.
I tried the black max 380 in the hole before putting the stud in. Too much of a mess and the glue just fouls the gun up. I ended up adding a drop of glue to each stud after all the studs were in. I think it's better for a stud to pull out rather than chunk a knob. Just replace the stud that pulls out.
wow, I guess you are standing on the stand when you do it or are really strong.
I just found a studded tire on ebay for 160.00, snapped it up.....
The tire and studs alone would cost that so it's a not brainer.
see you at the snow run in (Netra Enduro / No Timekeeping)
ADV Inmate special: $200 front and $200 rear. Quality tires (Pirelli and IRC), drilled, glued, and 18 mm Rally studs