The Bivouac (general rallye raid news)

Discussion in 'Racing' started by PackMule, Dec 23, 2009.

  1. skibum69

    skibum69 slave to gravity

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    I'm sure you'll have plenty of fans here:thumb
  2. doyle

    doyle RallyRaidReview-ing

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    I would think it a big PR move for the ASO to forgo the fee. To that end, how could Argentina protest without looking wildly un-neighborly? However, should it get far enough into the year, the world's quake memory will fade and the demands for payment may not look quite so heartless.

    Lastly, outside of the two weeks of the rally proper, I've always noticed dakar.com to be severly lacking in any timely updates.
  3. SafariBerg

    SafariBerg Oz Safari Addict

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    Hot off the press in ADB, Australia's top dirt bike magazine, that hit the shelves today, is an interview with Stefan Prierer CEO of KTM where he states

    " We have a 450 rally bike coming based on the LC4, and we are going for the 10th title to show that we are by far the best performers at Dakar."


    so guess that's from the horses mouth :deal
  4. CBVRacing

    CBVRacing CBVRacing

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    Mouammar Kadhafi, numéro un libyen, a appelé jeudi dernier à la guerre sainte (jihad) contre la Suisse, en raison de l'interdiction de la construction de minarets dans la confédération, alors que les relations entre la Suisse et Tripoli étaient déjà en crise.

    Cela fait plusieurs semaines que la Libye est fermée aux touristes européens, les ambassadeurs des 27 pays membres de l'UE ainsi que les experts du groupe visas des Etats associés à l'espace Schengen ont discuté de la suppression par Tripoli des visas aux citoyens de l'espace...

    La Commission européenne a déploré la semaine dernière la décision des autorités libyennes de suspendre l'octroi des visas aux ressortissants des pays membres de l'espace Schengen.

    De ce fait, le Libya Rallye qui doit se disputer du 9 au 16 mars est dans l'expectative ! Possesseurs du fameux visa, les concurrents et l'organisation tournent en rond et attendent avec optimisme le retour au calme. Mais les jours passent et l'embarquement du matériel (le 4 mars à Marseille pour les camions et le 6 mars à Gênes pour les autres) va bientôt sonné ! De son côté l'organisateur de cette seconde édition du Libya Rallye, Gert Duson, étudie la faisabilité d'un plan "B"... afin de laisser personne sur le carreau sachant qu'une annulation d'épreuve peut avoir de lourdes conséquences.
    Je me joint solidairement à Gert Duson avec qui j'ai discuté il y a une semaine au téléphone pour lui souhaiter de parvenir à débloquer la situation.

    Autres précisions et non des moindres, Etienne Lavigne, le patron du "Dakar" nous a fait savoir qu'il se trouvait actuellement en Tunisie et qu'il filait en Libye... dans le but de construire le Dakar 2011 dont le lieu, à ce jour, n'est pas encore défini. Y parviendra t'il ?
    Le "Dakar" 2011 en Afrique de l'Est par la Tunisie, la Libye et l'Egypte ou retour en Amérique du Sud ? Selon nos confrères argentins et chiliens, ils nous assurent que l'heure est toujours aux discussions : "Pour que le Dakar revienne, A.S.O. (Amaury Sport Organisation) demande à l’Argentine et au Chili d’augmenter ses budgets, les négociations avec les deux Présidents sont en cours..."
  5. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Gone a bit Baja

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    Zoot alor!

    xxx
  6. troy safari carpente

    troy safari carpente Team f5ool

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    Mouammar Kadhafi, Libyan number one, called last Thursday to the holy war (Jihad) against Switzerland, because of the ban of the construction of minarets in the confederacy, while the relations between Switzerland and Tripoli already were in crisis.

    That does several weeks that the Libya is closed to the European tourists, the ambassadors of the 27 member nations of THE E.U. as well as the group experts aimed associated States to the space Schengen discussed the suppression by Tripoli of the aimed at the citizens of l'espace..

    The European Commission deplored last week the decision of Libyan authorities to suspend the granting of the aimed at the nationals of the member nations of the space Schengen.

    Therefore, the Libya Rally that must dispute itself of the 9 to March 16 is in the expectative!

    Possessors of the fine one aimed, the competitors and the organization turn in round and await with optimism the return to the calm. But the days pass and equipment boarding (March 4 to Marseilles for the trucks and March 6 to Bother for the others) goes soon rung! Of his side the organizer of this second edition of the Libya Rally, Gert Duson, student the feasability of a plan "B"... in order to leave person on the tile knowing that a test cancellation can have heavy consequences. I united joins myself to Gert Duson with that I discussed a week ago to the telephone for him to wish to succeed in unblock the position.

    Other precisions and not of the least, Etienne Lavigne, the employer of the "Dakar" made known us that it was located currently in Tunisia and that it spun in Libya... with the intention of to construct the Dakar 2011 of which the place, to this day, again is not defined. Will there reach you it? The "Dakar" 2011 in Africa of the East by the Tunisia, the Libya and Egypt or return in South America? According to our Argentinian and Chilean colleagues, they assure us that the hour always is to the discussions: "For that the Dakar returns, A.S.O. (Amaury Sport Organization) asks the Argentina and to the Chile to increase its budgets, the negotiations with the two Presidents are in course. ..”
  7. Tome

    Tome Been here awhile

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    Rally related but not really to the whole convo atm.
    Recently speaking to the UK importer for Husky and they said Husky have been seriously talkin about putting a bigger factory effort into rally racing, not just the enduro/mx/sm they do at the moment.
    Will be good to hopefully see another manufacturer out there with a 450 bike!
  8. skibum69

    skibum69 slave to gravity

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    how many viable brands would that bring us up to?
  9. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Gone a bit Baja

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    Viable? - erm, two... KTM and Yamaha x
  10. Beez

    Beez Given to fly

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    TOLD YOU SO!! :lol3

    That's what I've speculated KTM would do since the 450 rules were announced.
  11. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Gone a bit Baja

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    It will be interesting though... they were able to get round the (power to weight) disadvantage this year by going up to 730cc... but next year, I can't see how a 450cc engine is going to be making anything like the power required to make the existing [690]RR bike chassis competitive against the likes of the Aprilia and the Sherco...?

    It also doesn't reflect well on their XC4 range of engines? Although (admittedly) they will say those were only ever designed for enduro events, not rally raid...

    I reckon KTM cannot possibly be as dominant in stage wins as they have been in the past, even if their logistics mean they do end up with the overall prize? It's sure going to be fun to watch next year!

    J xx
  12. wrk2surf

    wrk2surf on the gas or brakes

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    smaller cylindered 690... lighter components (frame too) ... ????
  13. fetid_swamp

    fetid_swamp Been here awhile

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    <link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5Cbq%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:punctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <w:DontGrowAutofit/> </w:Compatibility> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:LatentStyles DefLockedState="false" LatentStyleCount="156"> </w:LatentStyles> </xml><![endif]--><style> <!-- /* Font Definitions */ @font-face {font-family:Calibri; panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4; mso-font-charset:0; mso-generic-font-family:swiss; mso-font-pitch:variable; mso-font-signature:-1610611985 1073750139 0 0 159 0;} /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {mso-style-parent:""; margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";} span.EmailStyle15 {mso-style-type:personal; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-ansi-font-size:11.0pt; mso-bidi-font-size:11.0pt; font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; color:windowtext; font-weight:normal; font-style:normal; text-decoration:none; text-underline:none; text-decoration:none; text-line-through:none;} @page Section1 {size:8.5in 11.0in; margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in; mso-header-margin:.5in; mso-footer-margin:.5in; mso-paper-source:0;} div.Section1 {page:Section1;} --> </style><!--[if gte mso 10]> <style> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-ansi-language:#0400; mso-fareast-language:#0400; mso-bidi-language:#0400;} </style> <![endif]--> Why would they put a new 450 lc4 sort of donk in a big chassis designed for up to 730, esp when their compeditors will be running smaller and lighter chassised machines (eg, sherco, ape, Yamaha).
    Couldn’t they just adapt the 450/530 chaassis they already have?

    Could this be the holy grail about to arrive. A not as highly strung (designed reliable), med-hi po 450 class bike, 6 speed in a highly competent chassis and susp setup suitable for riding, riding and riding. As opposed to riding, maint, riding.

    Sort of like a modern drz but with power, handling, suspension and light weight, 90% setup from the factory… (now I mention it its not much like a drz at all. Ha)

    Waiting with baited breath.
  14. Aussie66

    Aussie66 Been here awhile

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    Viable Options other than KTM

    Yamaha, accessible to normal public without massive cost
    Honda, idem
    Sherco, not sure of cost

    GasGas, not yet proven
    Husqvarna, incidental entry
    Husaberg, not yet proven


    I cannot believe the KTM 450 will be in a "standard 690 frame". The Yamaha's and Honda's can go the distance provided you dont tune the shit out of them i.e higer cam profiles, racing pistons etc. One of my bikes is a Husky which is as low maintanance as my Honda's. I reckon the modern bikes are great options but the factory bikes will always be lighter and faster.
  15. wrk2surf

    wrk2surf on the gas or brakes

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    no body has been bringing up the 450x ... it is a highly popular bike in us desert racing now.. In fact thats probably the next bike for me. JCR racing uses them instead of the R even on small races.. must say something..
  16. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Gone a bit Baja

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    I agree (that would be my 'other' choice) - however, US desert races don't tend to last two weeks, over 9000 kms? For shorter Rallies I'm sure the Honda is a contender, but for the Dakar, I fear unless you really keep on top of it, it might get worn out pretty quickly (the ikkle biddy oil capacity and titanium valves...) over such a long and continuous event?

    That said, two guys finished Heroes-Legend last year on rally-prepped 450X's (which was a similar distance - 8000kms) - on the same engine and with just regular maintenance as far as I know...

    It would be interesting to see some statistics of how many CRF450s started the Dakar this year, and how many finished? As Aussie66 says, as long as you don't tune them to highly, I expect the 450X would be a good (and affordable) choice too?

    J x
  17. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Gone a bit Baja

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    Hee hee - the "450 Adventure" the Americans (particularly) have been crying out for here on ADVrider... be a nice thought huh?

    As I said above, it is interesting and indeed telling that KTM don't seem to be building something around their existing EXC bikes/engine? And strange - since a lot of privateers finnish the Dakar perfectly well on modified (Meca'system etc) EXCs...?

    But then of course the factory boys couldn't be seen to be riding something so 'everyman' now could they? Especially if it means their performance would be closer to what everyone else is riding...

    Lets' hope the can sell a few RC8s and X-bows to help finance this new project eh?

    J xx
  18. wrk2surf

    wrk2surf on the gas or brakes

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    I wonder when they are going to scrap that open wheel money pit...
  19. Bluebull2007

    Bluebull2007 Adventurer

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    I think KTM is going for a new range over the 450 EXC for sales purposes nothing else. Im speculating it wont be too different from the EXC´s just with a different name and look so they can bank on a major sales boost.

    To change the subject: I´m curious why you have said nothing about the WR 450 for the Dakar? Dont you like the Yamaha or its it the attraction of the kTM/BMW that is motivating you?
  20. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Gone a bit Baja

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    Ah, that's cos I'm playing my cards close to my chest... x

    Actually, I thought I had mentioned the WR (I know others have) - and my quip a few posts back about the viable options 'only' being KTM or Yamaha I thought would have given the game away... lets just say, I won't be buying Orange anytime soon x

    But yes, the WR450 is currently my number one choice - not only is is reliable and affordable (in that order I might add - it doesn't matter how cheap it is if it isn't going to get me to the finish!), but it's popularity and longevity means there are plenty of parts/spares available, and of course a number of rally kits have already been developed. I'm thinking of going for this kit (by JVO):

    [​IMG]

    ... initially the 'lite' version with just the front tanks and fairing, and perhaps a 5 litre left hand rear tank if I need the range during the NPO series... then fitting the rear seat/tank kit for Dakar...

    That said, I love my Hondas I really do, and if the CRF450X was EFi this year, I really think I'd have chanced my luck with that... Likewise, I'm really tempted by this new Suzuki RMX450Z (which is EFi) and by all accounts ought to be very reliable too...

    Neither of those bikes would need any real suspension or engine modifications to make them competitive at the back of the field where I'll be riding, and they are still individual enough to really appeal to my bloody-mindedness! However, there just isn't the range of rally kit available for them, and I don't want to be running a prototype (again) this season...

    Whereas the WR is such a proven machine - great power, great suspension, strong chassis etc etc etc, even though there is no EFi, I think that is the most sensible choice for this year?

    It took me a long time to come round to what people like Patsy Quick and Si Pavey have been saying all along - if you are going to enter the Dakar, you better make damn sure you give yourself the best chance of finishing, because a finish is all you're going to get... if you're lucky!

    J xx