The Bivouac (general rallye raid news)

Discussion in 'Racing' started by PackMule, Dec 23, 2009.

  1. Aussie66

    Aussie66 Been here awhile

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    Great promo video, many will still call the stills crap! But with the video I am even more convinced they are true..
  2. B-Rod

    B-Rod RubberNecker

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    Doubt it. Coma wasn't doing any giant airs anything close to the stills.
  3. Bluebull2007

    Bluebull2007 Adventurer

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    Deadly, I have to postpone my Dakar another year (2013 is now the year) because I finally got a decent job and I need to get the mine working and everything, so its very unlikley I will have the time for training. :cry

    At least now I will be able to afford it. :evil

    Also I guess I can enter a couple more rallies now before I do it. Im pretty bummed about this development but I guess that is the way thngs go.
  4. JayBo1

    JayBo1 Long timer

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    Well, I'm not at all bummed about it mate. We can both make 2013 our Dakar debut then:deal. With your Peru sand-riding experience behind you, maybe you should come over to Australia for the Safari in September to do some long riding days. Not too many other Rallys around have 600-900km days and the marathon days with no service assistance allowed.
    Cheers
    JayBo
  5. Bluebull2007

    Bluebull2007 Adventurer

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    I must say it sounds bloody attractive, John. When is the closing date for that?
  6. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Gone a bit Baja

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    Exactly... ironically, the first still with the midget Coma jumping over the FMX rider is the opposite of the actual film (1:54) where the FMX rider is jumping in the background of Coma on the dune?

    Seriously, just LOOK at the photos -

    1) Coma is about 4/5th the size he should be in this picture - there is also no way he got the bike at that sort of angle off the terrain in the picture...
    [​IMG]

    2)Again, where exactly did he take off from here? There is also no shadow below him (despite the dust kicked up from the bike below)...
    [​IMG]

    3) This get's the award for 'trying [i]way to hard[/i] to be convincing...' yes they put shadows in (badly)... but both of these riders are going to have an almighty accident the moment they land in the face of that dune...
    [IMG]http://static.blogo.it/motoblog/marc-coma-e-ronnie-renner/big_coma_02.jpg

    4) Total joke... yes they tried to put some tyre tracks in the face of this dune - but there is no breaking of the crust on the top, no dust in the air, and also the feathering around the tyres in this picture gives it away...
    [​IMG]

    5)I'm getting really bored now... no shadow, no point of take off in this terrain, the perspective is all wrong... and this shot particularly (like all of them) shows the the dunes and the mountains in the 'background' are not even in the same place...
    [​IMG]

    I can't believe KTM had anything to do with these stills - it's pathetic...

    Mind you, they've been dressing up LC4s for years as 'Rally Replicas' and selling them 'ready to race'... ahem.

    Jx
  7. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Gone a bit Baja

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    Exactly - this is more convincing, and probably took Hayduke a couple of minutes...

    Jx
  8. F650Dakar_Norway

    F650Dakar_Norway What off-season?

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    Neither do I, but as a PR stunt the link to KTM Racing with certain "photo-jumps" are quite revealing about to which length they're going:
    http://ktm.com/100087.0.html?nodeID=113135&cHash=dd14096c74

    Correct. They'll do races "out-of-the-box" all right, but my "Joe Doe" 654ccm, 72hp 690RR won't be a true contender - even with Marc Coma piloting. You get a decent start-package and that's about it. You'll certainly have to fine-tune suspension, make it 700ccm - 85hp+ and safety-wire all relevant bolts and parts additionally. Like Pal Anders & Thomas Berglund did last year with their 690RR's to race for top 10.

    Not to mention arm-wrestle a lot with KTM Racing to get your spare engines and mortgage your house to get some spares.:evil
  9. beaney

    beaney rally racer

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  10. Frgich

    Frgich Been here awhile

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    No air at all beaney :eek1 , you got to be kidding me :D
  11. skibum69

    skibum69 slave to gravity

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    nice one beaney, I can do that with a good puddle:lol3
  12. forest

    forest Adventurer

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    How does it work? What can and can you not do? How do officials keep track of in and out? Is there a time limit on how long you can stay in the neutralization zone and how long is it? I am thinking about suggesting a rule change for snowmobile racing because I think it is a great idea to have some time to eat, rehydrate, dehydrate and not be paranoid about how slow refueling is.
  13. Seth S

    Seth S Will _____ for _____

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    sanity?
    They have snipers hiding where you cannot see them. if you step out of line they take you down. This keeps everyone honest and the cheaters get removed from the competition. Everyone wins really. :evil
  14. troy safari carpente

    troy safari carpente Team f5ool

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    See... they've already got a nutralization zone "control crew" kitted up for you...
    [​IMG]
  15. troy safari carpente

    troy safari carpente Team f5ool

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    With regards your question about "refuelling" at the snowmobile races, and how the "15 min nutralisation" (time out) control functions on the Dakar... here is the rule governing;

    3) Refuelling during a Special Stage
    The competitor alone is responsible for refuelling.
    Refuelling must be done with the engine cut.
    A 15 minute neutralisation will be put in place each time refuelling is carried out during a special stage.
    Each refuelling will be preceded by a CP. After having given in their time card, each competitor must take their machine to the refuelling truck. Fuel will be distributed in order of arrival at the CP.
    After having refuelled, competitors must present themselves to the neutralisation control, where they will recover their time card. A new start will be given at the end of the neutralisation.
    All external assistance on a machine is forbidden during refuelling on pain of penalties at the discretion of the International Jury. Only competitors are allowed to help other competitors.​
  16. forest

    forest Adventurer

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    Thanks. Wow the FIM / FIA actually explained something concisely in the rule book! I didnt think it was possible. Huh, same number of workers just instead of fueling they are working the control. I think I will leave off the bit about the competitor being responsible for fueling 15 min to drink and eat sounds nice. We already carry time cards they just don't get used for much.
  17. JayBo1

    JayBo1 Long timer

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    So, JMo, Beano et al, have you watched the full video of the 450RR desert playing in Dubai? I think all the "stills" that have been dragged through the "fake!" and "photo-shopped!" claims are available by freezing the full video at the relevant points. The cactus that has been claimed as not existing in the Dubai desert is clear in the video. The 450RR flying above the dirt bike is clear. The full jump from dune to dune, ie without a "ramp", is clear. It's entirely possible that the riders have swapped bikes, but the jumps look pretty real to me and lose nothing in their spectacular-nous just because "maybe" the riders weren't actually the ones we are led to believe.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SixrqpEAt6o&feature=uploademail

    It's sad when "reality" can be so incredible that we discredit it as technology playing with us and thereby miss out on something special. I remember seeing (photo-shopped) pictures of dirt bikes flying upside-down many years ago ... and then Travis did the back-flip!:clap

    Is the video a fake? Is that why it took so long to appear, it took a long time to piece it together with "video-shop"?:lol3
  18. F650Dakar_Norway

    F650Dakar_Norway What off-season?

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    Heheee, nice video! There's no doubt a professional rider at Marc Coma/Cyril Despres level can do big jumps, but I was also sceptical about him doing true freestyle jumps by just oogling the pictures. The video shows things in better perspective - the jumps were done at relatively moderate heights.

    Reckon it took a few practice jumps under the FMX-dude's scrutiny, but quite frankly those pictures looked too polished and idealistic to be real for me too. It was simply too much out of a rally rider's character to do those stunts. As Coma said they like to keep the wheels as much as possible in ground contact to maintain speed. But, hey; this was freestyling - a different animal altogether.

    I'd like more videos like that, please! Excellent stuff! :clap
  19. Beez

    Beez Given to fly

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    Nice find JayBo! :thumb

    Jimmy's logo in the upper right of this picture is based on a photo of him jumping his R900RR practice bike at the finish line table-top at Glen Helen Raceway in San Bernadino, CA.
    [​IMG]

    I've been looking on the internet and through my archive CDs for the photo but I can't find it. :bluduh I think I have it somewhere though. My point is that racers at Lewis' and Coma's level can do insane things even on rally bikes.

    I was able to find a couple of photos of big jumps but nothing like the "no footer" at Glen Helen or Coma/Renner's jumps.

    [​IMG]
    bivouac somewhere in 2000 Dakar

    [​IMG]
    Not sure where but that looks like the next gen R900RR.

    [​IMG]


    <iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/SixrqpEAt6o" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="390" width="640"></iframe>
  20. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Gone a bit Baja

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    I watched the original video (which didn't show those particular jumps) but have to admit the version in the link above does have the scenes that the stills seem to be taken from (albeit from a slightly different perspective as I imagine it was a different [stills] photographer) - I also had an email from a chap who owns the copyright who said they weren't faked...

    Personally I never doubted that Marc Coma couldn't jump a bike like that (although I have to say the flick-flack is not his style), rather the images looked manipulated, and indeed some of the perspectives looked wrong - but that could have just been the angle they were taken from...

    I'm prepared to concede they are legitimate, even if ironically they look like they were fabricated!

    Jx