The butterfly warrior wagon

Discussion in 'Hacks' started by 1Bonehead, Feb 14, 2012.

  1. 1Bonehead

    1Bonehead Fearless of Falling

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    OK- here it goes.:evil

    I am now going to build my own leaning side car set-up and mount it on a sub frame to a XR650L. This is going to be rather fun.

    It will be a father, Son(16yrold) and Daughter(9yrold) project and the main reason is for the Daughter. I seem to have made a "deal" 12 years ago with my wife:huh to not take the kids on my motorcycles until they are twelve. I do not recall this "deal" but she know the date, time and the solar alignment udring this major decision agreement.

    I picked up my tubing bender, notcher and 6' box n pan brake from my friends house and brought them home. I already have a mig and a tig setup.

    I went and got a mess of 4130 .058 and .068 wall tubing from a local distributor.

    I am using a XR600 swingarm, wheel and shock set-up.

    I have a rough plan:deal and am finalizing things a little.

    The build will comence the first week of March with hopes to be done by the end of April.

    Stay tuned and get the bandages ready
    #1
  2. AceRph

    AceRph Affluenza Free! Administrator

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    :lurk
    #2
  3. MotoJ

    MotoJ Mobtown Hacker

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    Awesome. I love build threads!

    Are you near Baltimore?
    #3
  4. ClearwaterBMW

    ClearwaterBMW The Examiner

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    this is going to be great
    good luck
    #4
  5. 1Bonehead

    1Bonehead Fearless of Falling

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    I am in New Windsor.
    #5
  6. BeeMaa

    BeeMaa Hack Pilot

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    :lurk
    #6
  7. Feedback Cycle

    Feedback Cycle Been here awhile

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    I'm betting a leading link or leading leg is in my future.
    Show me how it's done. :ear
    #7
  8. 1Bonehead

    1Bonehead Fearless of Falling

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    OKay now for a few questions

    with a bikes axle spread of 60"- what should the tie width be? Overall car?
    #8
  9. 1Bonehead

    1Bonehead Fearless of Falling

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    OK-
    I got my pipe:evil
    Got a swingarm/wheel/shock assembly
    Ordered a seat
    Got the Hime(spelling?)
    Got the sub-frame designed and material in the garage
    Got my bender
    Got my design done for the base frame:deal
    Got the layout done:deal
    I am going to start bending and tacking this week/weekend:D

    I will post pics later this week.

    I am really exicted about this project and loook forward to the entire process!!!!!!!!!!!!!111:freaky:clap:freaky:clap
    #9
  10. BMWzenrider

    BMWzenrider The Road Scholar

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    I think that you were asking what the "Track Width" should be, which is how wide the tire tracks are when you drive down the road.

    For road-going rigs you will normally find track widths in the 46"-60" range depending upon the size of the bike & sidecar and the desired stability of the rig.
    A wider track width will normally result in a rig that is more stable, especially when taking corners towards the sidecar (right-handers in the USA).

    Extending the track width pushes the "tip-over lines" farther out, and widens the base that the rig is sitting on. Pushing the sidecar farther away from the bike also moves more mass farther out, creating a bigger mass moment arm helping to keep the sidecar wheel down.

    Of course remember to dial in some toe-in when you are setting it up.

    -----

    People who intend to do quite a bit of off-roading might be well-served to find out the track width of typical 4x4 vehicles (jeeps/etc) and set their sidecar track width to match. That way when you are riding on a rutted two-track trail your rig will "fit" the path worn by the other vehicles without fighting which wheel wants to stay in the worn path and which rides the ridge.

    ----------

    Also very important is the sidecar lead; which is how far the sidecar wheel "leads" the rear wheel of the motorcycle.

    A good starting point for sidecar wheel lead is about 15% of the bike's wheelbase.
    So for a wheelbase of 60.0", the starting lead should be right around 9.0".

    If you have more lead the bike will be more stable/flat in a turn away from the sidecar (left-hander in the USA), but with more wheel scrub.

    Less lead will create less tire scrub/wear, but can allow the nose of the sidecar to dive down and catch the pavement in spirited "away from the sidecar" turns; which can be VERY bad... In extreme cases the rear wheel of the bike can come up & over on you without much warning and you will be underneath your bike before you realize what happened.

    -----

    HTH's
    #10
  11. 1Bonehead

    1Bonehead Fearless of Falling

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    Thanks for the pointers.

    I am making the wheel adjustable until I can get the distance right. I was starting at 9.5" and going from there.

    The overall width of the tires I am looking at around4' 6-8".

    BMWzenrider is there a theory for proper placement of the side car axle in reference to the overall side car length? say40% from rear? or :ear
    #11
  12. Bobmws

    Bobmws Curmudgeon At Large

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    There is a recent thread on wheel lead here plus the "Sticky" at the top of the forum page on design. Your adjustable idea sounds good, you will be able to fine tune the setup.
    #12
  13. 1Bonehead

    1Bonehead Fearless of Falling

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    I am not refering to wheel lead as much as wheel centering on the side car.
    #13
  14. Ivan Rider

    Ivan Rider Been here awhile

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    In his original post he stated he's making a "Leaning" sidecar. His track has to be wide enough for the bike to lean toward the sidecar so all the usual information may be wrong for his application.
    #14
  15. RAGBrian

    RAGBrian jonesing for a ride

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    :lurk

    In-terested in this build. I would one day like to have a leaner as well, so I'll be watching along as well.
    #15
  16. 1Bonehead

    1Bonehead Fearless of Falling

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    OK- Now I have decided to make the attachments point for the swing-arm adjustable in reference to the overall unit length. Therefore I can make future adjustments as long as I live thru the initial test drive.:D.

    I am using 1.5" od 4130 tubing so if I get a stick of 1 5/8 .058 it slip over the frame allowing me to "slide my attachment points forward and backwards after the build is complete. That should help with these issues or quicken my demise:evil.
    #16
  17. 1Bonehead

    1Bonehead Fearless of Falling

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    The madness just began tonight.

    [​IMG]
    #17
  18. Kyler

    Kyler Confused Hack Nut

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    DAMN dude - you welded up a kid and dog in one night? :clap:lol3
    #18
  19. 1Bonehead

    1Bonehead Fearless of Falling

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    New seat should be here in a day or two.

    [​IMG]
    #19
  20. oldmonkeybut

    oldmonkeybut Digital Emigrant

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    Glad to see you have the ball rollin'. I am very interested in seeing your subframe ideas. There is a growing pile of parts in my shop that sounds a lot like yours. I too am going to hack my spare 650L. No leaner here, more of a fixed Dualsport/Offroad style. My wife wants a better suspended dualsporter than my URAL. I'm anxiously awaiting your progress. Keep up the good work.
    #20