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Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by klxrdr, May 13, 2007.
Check the main fuse?
Main fuse is good. Again, all electrical components seem to be working fine with the exception of the electric start.
Any other ideas?
Don't panic, and go back to the basics. I'm guessing that you can't even bump start the bike, right? If not, and this is still an intermittent problem, then you likely still have a bad switch(es), connection(s) or wire(s) somewhere. IIRC, you bypassed the clutch switch, right? If not, do it now. Ditto for the sidestand switch. Based upon your description, and that of others on these forums, the problem really sounds like the sidestand switch, as that one will kill the ignition, too. You need to backtrack the wires and find out why the starter switch is not getting voltage if the saftey switches are bypassed. Use that multitester to get to the bottom of this.
Good luck, Andy
Yeah I can't even bump start it.
I bypassed the clutch safety switch. From what I understand the sidestand switch is AFTER the starter button so that would be one of the last things I would check so I didn't even think of that. I will check to see if I'm getting voltage TO the sidestand...
I think the problem is somewhere around the front headlight - a bad ground or something. It's very confusing navigating the mess of wires there.
Thanks for the help...
There's got to be a loose connection somewhere. Make sure the battery is grounded properly.. Then I would start at the positive terminal of the battery and go down the line looking at every connector.
Sidestand switch at the green/white wire is getting 1V according to my multimeter...
Any luck with a brake upgrade? Maybe a bigger rotor off a 350 or a 400?
Looks like a great setup! Got any stories?
Do you have a wiring diagram you could post? I thought you did before, but I can't find it. If I can see that maybe I can figure this out for ReT.
I can't find it. I may have it on my computer at home...I can put it up when I get home.
Thanks Klay! Maybe I will be able to point Mr. Heretik in the right direction after I study it a bit.
Thanks to the electrical diagram from Klay, and reading through the troubleshooting steps in the DR650 manual (same basic ignition/starter systems) it looks like the only components that affect both the ignition and starter circuits are the ignition switch, kill switch, and the side stand switch and relay (and their associated connectors and wiring).
The ignition switch is likely OK if the lights are working.
Check for battery voltage between the Orange/White and Black/White wires at the CDI unit. If the voltage is low or 0, the side stand switch, relay, or connections are bad; or the relay is not getting power.
It is also possible that the kill switch is not sending power to the starter switch, clutch switch and the side stand relay. Maybe you could take the switch apart and check all the connections and contacts inside.
Did you ever get the service manual? It should have a complete diagram, and simplified ones that show the start and ignition circuits, along with troubleshooting flowcharts. That may help you make some sense of what I described above.
First off - thanks Andy and Klay for your help. I would be lost without you guys.
Yeah, that's what I figured. Everything like lights and horn are working with the exception of the elctric start.
Neither the O/W nor the White wire going to the CDI is getting voltage. (This was with the ground wire of the multimeter connected to the ground battery terminal and probing each metal connector with the red probe...)
Btw, battery is reading 12V as is the large positive terminal on the starter relay/solenoid.
- The sidestand switch is getting 1V at the G/W wire.
- Both my rear turn signals are disconnected, would this affect the circuit in any way?
- I bypassed the clutch safety switch, which isn't even getting voltage.
- I've tested the starter button/kill switch assembly thoroughly and have found nothing wrong other than the fact that neither of the orange wires are even carrying voltage...
I did actually. I've been pouring over it all morning.
Another thing I just tried was replacing the diode(The 3 prong thingy, I think) because I had an extra one lying around. No difference.
Any other ideas? I think the key to this is the fact that the problem is affecting BOTH the electric start and is preventing start by any other means...
Thanks for the the help.
Did a little more testing.
- Ignition switch is definitely fine. The red wire going in is reading 12V, and when the switch is turned on, both the Orange and Green connections are reading 12V.
- The 6-Wire male connection block with primarily orange wires that goes to the Kill Switch/Start button assembly has one wire reading 12V. However, neither of the two orange wires that come out on the other end are carrying any voltage. I wonder if the connection block thingy is bad.... ? That would certainly explain it... I think?
That is certainly a problem. There is probably some corrosion in the connection block. Pull that thing apart, clean it up, and try to get the juice flowing through it. Then see what you have. You have to get 12V to that kill switch before anything else will work.
I fixed it! Yay!
The problem: A dirty ignition/sidestand relay(This is the block with 6 wires going into it under the seat). None of the wires going to it appeared to be loose, so I think it was just dirty. I sprayed it liberally with WD-40. I'm going to keep an eye on it for a while but everything is working fine.
Thanks Andy and Klay!
Unfortionately, I made a stupid mistake as I was putting everything back together. When I installed the Yamaha Raptor Petcock on the gas tank a few months ago, I bent back the lip on the bottom of the tank to permit the free movement of the valve. Since then I've wanted to try and trim it off. So today, I bend it back and forth a few times and it pops off, great, everything is good. Wrong. I had no idea this was a seam for the gas tank. Now the tank is gushing gas from the seam if I try to fill it. I drained the tank and hung it upside down so that the gas will evaporate from the tank so I can take it to a welder tomorrow morning. Tomorrow I gotta hit the yellow pages trying to find a local place that will take care of it. Ugh. I'm an idiot. As much as I like the Yamaha Petcock, I don't think it was worth all this trouble. What I SHOULD have done was just carefully grind down a small bit of the lip.
Any suggestions on what sort of places would fix this for me? All I need is someone to weld this small seam back together. I'm guessing it's like a 5 minute job or less....
Curse my stupidity . At least I fixed my electrical problem. Yay for persistance. :)
I would highly recommend a heavy duty epoxy for this repair. That way you wont have burned paint and the possibility of explosion. I had a pal that ruined a beautiful original Z1 tank, after a week of airing it out then filling with water and airing again, when he tried to weld it, whoomph! It cracked the paint all around the seams, and expanded enough that it no longer fit right.
The best thing to use is a product caled Marine-Tex, available at boat and marine supply stores. It will do the job, no worries, and you can do it yourself.
Wow, I didn't realize the risk of explosion was so great, even after taking precautionary steps.
There are no boat/marine stores near me that I am aware of(I will double check though), is there a comparable product that I might find at Home Depot or an auto parts place?
Another thought is JB Weld... seems like it might be perfect for this application... thoughts?
I'm desperate to patch this up ASAP... riding a bicycle everywhere is real pain...!