The Official 2013 F1 Thread. Spoilers possible!

Discussion in 'Racing' started by g®eg, Nov 27, 2012.

  1. WildAnCrazymtl

    WildAnCrazymtl Political Prisonor

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    This is so true in the real world, out of the public eye the boss can get away with shit because his mistakes are not public record. I am not sure this is true in the fantasy world of F1. IMHO Honers shortcomming lead to a bad situation that put a great young driver in a bad spot forcing him to make a tough decision for the benifit of RBR. Everyone knows Marco is in charge! :lol3
  2. tinhead

    tinhead Been here awhile

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    'Cuz I don't like Webber very much and I absolutely detest Hamilton.:1drink
  3. WildAnCrazymtl

    WildAnCrazymtl Political Prisonor

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    :y0!

    Objection your Honor! :huh The persecuter is assuming facts not entred into evidence! :lol3:lol3:lol3:lol3 :rofl
  4. WildAnCrazymtl

    WildAnCrazymtl Political Prisonor

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    What makes you so sure golden boy would not f$$k Webber up! :lol3

    Put me down for $100 on Vettel :clap:clap
  5. tinhead

    tinhead Been here awhile

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    That's what bugs me, the "if" part.
    F1, it is what it is, I accept that. Team orders happen at all levels of professional motorsport. I can't say I like the concept, but it's not enough to keep me from watching.
  6. WildAnCrazymtl

    WildAnCrazymtl Political Prisonor

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    He has never helped in the past, hanging back and letting Hamilton and others maul him from lap one.

    IMHO Marco can turn a one year deal into... Marc meet the new driver who is replacing you! Don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out! :deal
  7. overlandr

    overlandr Dystopist

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    Except his self respect. He was the guy in charge of the Drivers assoc AFAIR so carries big respect from other drivers. He's got a reputation as a clean driver. When its all over, what's left except the way you played the game. Winning clean is all that matters. Wasn't there a cyclist some time ago that was under the spotlight?!

    Look at MS's historical legacy now - blackened with his outrageous moves on the track which were motivated by a win at all cost mentality.

    History also recalls the reputation of a driver and whether he was sportsmanlike or whether he often chose the 'alternative option'.


    Quote from John Watson Ex-F1 driver.
    ""The only purposeful way to bring him to book is to say: 'You will stand out one race'," Watson told BBC Radio 4. "I know that if other drivers in other teams disobeyed a team order they would be suspended or even fired.

    "If Christian Horner doesn't reassert his authority in the team – because he has been totally subjugated by Sebastian Vettel – then his position in the team is not exactly the role it is designed to be," Watson said. "The only conclusion I can reach is that Vettel should be suspended for the next grand prix.

    "You can't take the points away from him and give them to Mark Webber – that's now history and Sebastian has the benefit of those seven additional points. You can't really fine him, it is almost irrelevant to fine him, so the only purposeful way to bring him to book is to say: 'You will stand out one race'.""
  8. g®eg

    g®eg Canadian living in exile

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    the smiling assassin

    the telling line is the last one...

    :clap
  9. g®eg

    g®eg Canadian living in exile

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  10. Paebr332

    Paebr332 Good news everyone!

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    Ferrari had nowhere near the car Red bull had last season and Romain Grosjean at Belgium played a key role in why Alonso did not win the WDC.

    So how many F1 victories and world championships do you have? I am pretty certain Alonso has you beat on both counts. In fact, I bet he has more podium finishes this season than you have in your entire "career." :huh

    Stupid argument is stupid.
  11. HarveyMushman

    HarveyMushman Tire Squarerer

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    So Vettel's latest twat move has everyone at a froth. Drama! Intrigue! Whatever will be done?! I'm just tingling with excitement!

    Of interest to no one, apparently, is the fact that the top 4 cars were coasting for the second half of the "race" and an actual on-track competition was deemed by two team managers to run counter to business considerations. How exciting.
  12. ricmachado

    ricmachado Been here awhile

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    Let's debate something better than Vettel x Webber. :norton

    How about Force India pit stop.

    Does it take that muich to change the front tire, they guys F*&$ Up both drivers race :deal
  13. g®eg

    g®eg Canadian living in exile

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    bad nuts...

    Malaysian Grand Prix: Faulty wheel nuts spoil Force India's race
    Both Paul di Resta and Adrian Sutil struggled with their pit stops before retiring on lap 24 and 29, respectively.

    Sepang: [​IMG]The 2013 Formula 1 Malaysian Grand Prix turned out to be a forgettable experience for Sahara Force India whose drivers had to retire mid-way through the race Sunday owing to faulty wheel nuts.

    The eventful 58 laps saw Red Bull's Sebastian Vettel defy team orders to win his first race of the season ahead of teammate Mark Webber. Mercedes' Lewis Hamilton and Nico Rosberg were also involved in an intra-team battle which ended with the former McLaren driver holding on to the third spot.

    For Force India, Sunday marked the end to a weekend when they failed to capitalise on the promise shown during the practice sessions and qualifying.

    Both Paul di Resta and Adrian Sutil struggled with their pit stops before retiring on lap 24 and 29, respectively.

    The trouble started when di Resta and Sutil were called simultaneously for the first pit stop as the Scot waited for his turn. The problem with the wheel nuts persisted for the their next two stops before the team decided call the cars back in the garage.

    ""An early end to a race that promised so much for us. Both cars had the same problem with the wheel nuts and it cost us a lot of time in the pits. We're not sure exactly what happened yet so the team stopped the cars to make sure we understand the issue," said Sutil.

    Di Resta said: "We saw an issue at Adrian's first pit stop when I was sat behind him, which cost me about 15 seconds, and then I had the same issue with the wheel nut at my second pit stop. As a precaution the team chose to retire the car. We will go away, take this on the chin, and come back fighting in China."

    A double retirement was the first one for Force India since Japan 2010.

    The Silverstone-based team made their best ever start to a season in Australia where Sutil and di Resta finished seventh and eighth.

    They remain in fifth in the team standings with 10 points.
  14. O.C.F.RIDER

    O.C.F.RIDER Loose nut behind h/bars

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    Except for the fact that Seb may, just may, be a better driver.
    Oh, I guess he cheated his way to the 3-in-a-row previous WDC's.
    And let's count Whubbah's WDC's.
    :ear:ear:ear:ear:ear:ear

    Vettel for 4-in-a-row!!!!!!!!!!!:clap:clap:clap
    I'd be quite happy with Alonso throwing a wrench in the 4-in-a-row thing though.

    Chris

  15. RedRocket

    RedRocket Yeah! I want Cheesy Poofs

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    Another good article

    http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2013/03/f1-report-smells-like-team-spirit/


    Rubens Barrichello’s daughter once asked him why he looked so sad on the podium; to make his children as well as the tifosi feel better about Ferrari’s relentless approach to team orders, he decided to make sure he always smiled from then on. The contrast between the crinkled mouth and unsmiling eyes he displayed in the podiums after that makes for an interesting study in human dynamics. How can a man feel so conflicted about standing on the most important podium in the racing world, week in and week out?

    At the end of the Malaysian Grand Prix yesterday, however, there were no smiling faces at all.


    It was a day of team decisions and team orders. Fernando Alonso bashed his front wing in at the start and should have headed directly in for another, but with a drying track and the unlovable prospect of two pitstops within a few laps, he decided to stay out. Or perhaps the team decided. Ferrari’s pit crew were reportedly out and ready with a new nose when Alonso went by. Was that simple insurance? Or did the man himself decide to chance another lap? Ferrari’s official statement assigns responsibility for the decision to the team, but they would say that, wouldn’t they? Surely Alonso will miss these points later on in the season.

    With Fernando off-track and Massa looking unlikely to challenge for the podium, it became a tale of two teams. First, the Mercedes team of Lewis Hamilton and Nico Rosberg. Few people have been paid as much to accomplish as little as Mr. Rosberg has in Formula One; during his years with Michael Schumacher he usually outqualified the old man but he could also be counted on to fall back during the start while the seven-time world champion pushed forward. He also frequently yielded to his brasher, braver former GP2 competitor Lewis Hamilton on-track in a fashion that can best be described as “wince-inducing”.

    With Hamilton as his teammate, however, Rosberg appears to be slightly less meek about the whole thing. Near the end of the race, he and Hamilton raced for position and when Ross Brawn, the team principal, ordered them into line to finish the race, Rosberg complained over the radio in a manner that was clearly meant to be heard around the world — and was. “I could go so much faster,” he whined, “if he would get out of the way.”

    “Lewis is also under control,” Brawn replied. In other words: Stop kidding yourself. Hamilton’s conserving fuel and in a straight fight he’d pull your panties off the same way he’s been doing it for over half a decade now. Mr. Hamilton, meanwhile, provided a moment of amusement when he inadvertently pitted at the McLaren garage for tires. The Woking crew, perhaps still feeling a little bitter about the way Hamilton has left the team for more money after being basically a charity project for Ron Dennis in his youth, waved him out and over to his new home. Still, Lewis looked sad on the podium, and in the after-race press statement indicated that Rosberg deserved the position. Gracious, but unnecessary. Only a blind man without access to Braille reports of the past five seasons could possibly think Rosberg will seriously contend against his teammate in 2013 for anything other than endorsement contracts. As much as I despise Lewis Hamilton as a human being, his talent exceeds Nico’s by an order of magnitude.

    Two steps up the podium from Hamilton stood the triple world champion himself, young Sebastian Vettel. Your humble author had the pleasure of watching Vettel’s F1 debut at the USGP years ago and was impressed then and now. Yes, Sebastian has usually had the best car; no, it hasn’t been easy to put that best car on top three years running. At an age where most young men are incapable of completing college homework assignments on time or getting their Civics cleaned up in time for an import-drag-race event, Sebastian has driven at the highest level possible with astounding consistency. And if you think the car wins races by itself, an examination of Mark Webber’s record shows that it doesn’t.

    That was surely on Vettel’s mind as the team orders came through to him at the final round of pitstops. Dial back the engines, conserve fuel, “multi21″ (which apparently means that the #2 driver may stay in front of the #1 driver). Your humble author does not pretend to have a sliver of Vettel’s talent, but as someone who possesses a hotter-than-average racing temperament I would be more than happy to suggest the German’s interior monologue:

    Seven points. Seven points. They want me to hold station and give this idiot seven points. The championship is often won and lost on less, and they want me to circle around behind this half-ass, this indifferent starter, this whiner, this never-was. Oh, fuck that twice.

    DRIVE’s Leo Parente, no stranger to competing at the sharp end of an open-wheel series himself, has said, “If you hate Seb for this, you hate a real racer.” I’m inclined to agree. Nominally speaking, it would have been the reasonable, team-oriented, responsible thing to do to follow Webber home. As a racer myself, I have to agree with Vettel. Mr. Webber will never win the world championship. He’s incapable of driving at the level required on a consistent basis. His starts are pathetic. He is difficult to pass, but he’s not a great passer. Most importantly, he fails again and again at the fundamental F1 skill of driving to plan with metronomic perfection for an entire stint. I’d love to ride some mountain bikes with Mark Webber, I admire him as an individual, I think that of the entire grid he’s probably one of the so-called best blokes out there, but he cannot and will not get the job done and in that situation TAKE THE SEVEN POINTS AWAY FROM HIM NOW.

    The failing wasn’t Sebastian’s, it was Christian Horner’s for not moving the guy who cannot win the championship out of the way of the guy who can. That’s the bottom line. Teamwork wins championships, and there was a deficiency of teamwork at the Red Bull garage. Ross Brawn kept Rosberg behind Hamilton because Rosberg isn’t a winner and Hamilton is. Mr. Horner should learn from his elders in this case. Luckily for him and for the possibilities of a fourth world championship, Sebastian Vettel did what was necessary.
  16. g®eg

    g®eg Canadian living in exile

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    very good.

    I still say that Vettel should have manned up. Instead of saying "gee sorry I fucked up" which was a bald-faced lie as he clearly did as he intended, he should have said "I came to race, I want to win a fourth championship, and I disagree w/ my team principal". end of story.
  17. doyle

    doyle RallyRaidReview-ing

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    But time heals all wounds and seldom do stats reflect upon the social aspects of the driver.

    As far as Watson goes, he must be dreaming. He's not incorrect that Horner needs to reassert his leadership, but why jeopardize a constructor's championship to penalize your driver for winning the race. Clearly no fill in driver will perform like Vettel. Having your drivers battling over 1st and 2nd place is a problem 10 other teams wish they were dealing with right now.
  18. g®eg

    g®eg Canadian living in exile

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    anyone who thinks Vettel will be sat down or otherwise publicly reprimanded is living in cloud-cuckoo land...
    it's all about the constructors championship full stop.

    It's a shame for Mark, but that's the way it goes. He must have known, in his heart of hearts, that this would happen.
    Nice guys finish on the podium, just not the first step.
  19. Paebr332

    Paebr332 Good news everyone!

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    If Webber gets pissed off enough he can cost them the constructor's title.
  20. mdubya

    mdubya Right Brigade

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    If he does anything like that, his car will have electrical gremlins and he will soon be out of a ride.