The OSET Thread - Will it Roll?

Discussion in 'Trials' started by K_N_Fodder, Dec 8, 2012.

  1. Brewtus

    Brewtus Buffoonery, Inc.

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    Bummer that Tim.....er, I mean Jim looped the new scoot. I can hardly wait to try it! :lol3 I can attest on how much fun Sparky was to ride, the 20" sounds like a blast!

    Welcome to the asylum, MooMoo.....er, I mean BetaRambo. :thumb
    #41
  2. NMTrailboss

    NMTrailboss Team Dead End

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    You're stuttering a lot today brewtus...what up? :dunno
    #42
  3. Brewtus

    Brewtus Buffoonery, Inc.

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    Too many names.....
    #43
  4. rotorhead511

    rotorhead511 Live and let live.

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    Can I use a 36v twist grip on a 24v set up? My 24v has a crack in it and I got a 36v setup with the bike

    Thanks
    #44
  5. BetaRambo

    BetaRambo n00b

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    I think a 36V throttle will work. The battery charge indicators will definitely not work (it will show a dead battery). I have not tried it myself. I have gone the other way and run a 24V throttle at 36V. I think the hall sensor part of the throttle (the part that tells the controller the throttle position) is likely to be identical. I expect that the only difference is some resistor values in the circuit to light up the LEDs.

    One way to make sure that the throttle is the problem is to put the bike up on a stand so the rear wheel is free to spin and then pull the throttle connector. There will be five wires and the colors vary by year. One is positive from the battery and one is ground. The remaining three are the three hall sensor phases. With the bike on, shorting some combinations on these three should make the wheel spin like full throttle. If this happens then the throttle is indeed the problem. Note that you need to take your time with this and make sure that you have really shorted the wires. I mislead myself into a wasted hour or so of troubleshooting when I wasn't really making contact.

    The throttle is the most likely cause of "won't run" issues on these bikes followed by the relay so a simpler way is to just throw a throttle on there and try it. As long as I am here:

    My personal Oset troubleshooting steps for "won't run" (I like to do them in order of easy and likely):

    1. Make sure batteries are charged. To totally eliminate this as an issue I check it with the charger on.
    2. Make sure I hear the click when the key is switched on (if not then it is likely to be the relay or relay wiring).
    3. Double check that the potentiomter is open enough. The pots can fail so disconnecting it and shorting the wires will eliminate this.
    4. Check the throttle with the shorting test above.
    5. If none of the above get you there then you might have one of the rare complicated issues. You can troubleshoot the wiring if you have the skill or contact your dealer if you don't.

    Way more answer than you asked for, but I thought I should write it down for others.
    #45
  6. Jammer97

    Jammer97 n00b

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    #46
  7. K_N_Fodder

    K_N_Fodder Long timer

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    Wow what an excellent first post! Welcome and thanks a bunch for the contribution. I've been neglecting this thread, we had an unusually cold December and first half of January so the Oset spent a bunch of time as a hanger queen. We need to get it out today I think. I'll troll through and catch up on the rest of the thread. BetaRambo I'd be very interested in your experience setting up as a dealer. Were you already in the motorsports biz?

    Justin

    Edit: Endless-sphere looks very cool as well...
    #47
  8. K_N_Fodder

    K_N_Fodder Long timer

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    #48
  9. K_N_Fodder

    K_N_Fodder Long timer

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    Bob - I'm all ears if you've had any feedback on this. The rear shock is pretty poor. I've heard of guys retrofitting MTB stuff, just haven't done any homework on it. Ridenm indicates that there are accessory shocks and springs available from Oset. I'd be curious if they actually have any rebound damping, etc.
    #49
  10. rotorhead511

    rotorhead511 Live and let live.

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    Anyone have a good fork upgrade? I just put hydraulic brakes on and think the fork should be next.

    Thanks
    #50
  11. snowhawk jockey

    snowhawk jockey Slack Jaw Gaper

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    Hey Oset bikers!
    Just got to spend a few minutes on a 20" while at the BC bike show and really got the bug...
    Curious to hear about all the batty conversions and voltage considerations that have been done for tech upgrades. My kids have no idea how much trouble I am about to get in, but the Mrs is gonna scream when she sees the box arrive. I should prolly get the 16" that Jammer is selling at a good deal, and let the kids have some fun. Too bad I am thinking of Papi(myself) and the bigger one...

    It will be a sure sight cheaper than the Zero I have on my favorites:deal
    #51
  12. BetaRambo

    BetaRambo n00b

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    I am not really in the motorsports biz per se. I did run a trials dealership for a few years with some friends, but like most trials dealerships it was a hobby business and not something to really make money at. My Oset dealership, Sparky Bikes, is also a hobby business.

    I started it in order to make a little money to offset some of the costs of my family's riding but also to get some new riders into our club. It turns out that demoing Osets is a great way to get new people. Once their kids start riding trials then the adults tend to follow. I leave it to the other dealers to sell bikes to the parents.

    I think Oset is a lot more interested in setting up with "real" dealers these days, which makes sense. They want to move bikes through stores rather than the normal trials model of moving bikes through trailers. They did work with me really nicely. I think the key was that I proved my passion by building that one custom bike and I guess they figured that it would make me pretty useful for support.
    #52
  13. BetaRambo

    BetaRambo n00b

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    The biggest upgrade I ever did on the rear suspension was to loosen the swingarm bolts. It turns out the first generation bikes got too much torque on them at the factory which pretty well made them hardtails for lightwieght kids.

    All of the upgrades Oset sells (as far as I know) are just different springs. The shock is all the same.

    The 20" however, has a rebound adjustable shock. It looks pretty similar in size so it might fit, but I have not tried it. My recomendation would be to bring it to a friendly bicycle shop and see if they can help you out. Bringing the Oset in is sure to start some conversation!

    I know Rick Keffer had an air shock on his kid's bike for a while but I am not sure how it worked for him in the long term. In the short term he reported that it was really slick. I am sure it worked better than it did for Ryan Dungy the other night! :1drink
    #53
  14. BetaRambo

    BetaRambo n00b

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    I went back through your posts but could not be sure of what generation bike you have. I did see that it is a 24V 16". If you have the early generation (motorcycle style forks with the tubes going all the way up) then a decent and striaght forward upgrade is to go with the RST forks they changed the 16" to. These are the ones where the tubes stop before the triple clamp. They generally have better action, allow tighter turns thanks to the tubes being out of the way, and are supposed to be stronger. They still don't have much adjustment (I think) but it is an upgrade.

    At the risk of sounding like a broken record, find a bicycle shop with a friendly mechanic and they can take you through the options. Just about any bicycle fork in 16" should work.

    The 20" uses "dirt jump" forks which are pretty darn strong for bicycle stuff. They even handle 180 degree nose wheelies with my substantial bulk on it!
    #54
  15. NMTrailboss

    NMTrailboss Team Dead End

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    :lol3
    #55
  16. BetaRambo

    BetaRambo n00b

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    Yesterday was my kid's first trials on the 20". She was riding novice for the first time and the sections got set a lot harder than a normal novice trial. She got through it but it was pretty rough.

    She made it through 8 sections, three loops on one set of batteries, but it was close. I had it loaded with 4 batteries, each a 6 cell with 5 aH. I put them 2 series and then 2 paralell to get 12s2p 10 aH.

    I wired up my Cycle Analyst from her old bike which is a computer for electric vehicles. It has a remote shunt that lets me measure how many aHs we have used without running heavy gauge wire up to the bars. It reported that we had only used 4 aH but the cell voltages were down around 3.8V. This means that either I setup the computer wrong or my batteries are getting old and weak. Either way, one set of 4 batteries got us through the entire day.

    The power of this thing is incredible. She spent a lot of time stuck on her way up big rocks. She would grab a handful of throttle and the bike would litteraly jump up the rock. Most times she stayed on it when this happened. One time she didn't. Luckily she has been riding for 7 year now so she bailed off the back and landed on her feet. The bike flew up in the air upside down. I managed to catch it. Lucky me, this bike is light. A one handed grab saved it from getting all scratched up.

    I let a few adults ride it. After watching their experience I have worked out the proper script to use when letting an adult try this beast:

    1. This thing has no clutch. You don't need one to get the revs up since it has max torque at zero RPM. However, this means that when you loop it (and you will) you have no handy way to shut the power off.
    2. You will not beleive the power this thing has. Go very gentle at first while you get the feel for it.
    3. When you loop it (see item 1) put both feet down and let the bike wheelie between your legs until you get control.
    4. After you are done you can marvel at the fact that I didn't even have it turned all the way up!

    The guy who spent the most time on it said it is a "death machine". This of course means that he wants to buy one if he can scrape up the green. Another guy said he was not man enough to ride it. Everyone marvelled at how a 60 pound 9 year old could control the power.

    I suspect that I may find that a good percentage of these get sold to adults. The idea of being able to ride on campus, skate parks, and other normally off limits areas is pretty intriguing. Adults do go through the amps a lot faster than kids because of the weight they make it pull. I suspect that for adults a double load of Lipos would be the trick.

    One section had a pretty long, off camber hill climb with a few small ledges on the way. She rode it well all three times and had no problem finding traction. She was however, near looping it a few times. I think it is time to work with her on where your weight needs to be in these situations.

    I went ahead and ordered a spare rear fender as it is only a matter of time until one of us snaps it, but (knock on wood) we have had no issues with the bike yet.
    #56
  17. BetaRambo

    BetaRambo n00b

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    Am I understanding you right? You are going to buy a 20" for yourself to ride instead of a full size Beta? Awesome! Please please please keep us updated!

    For the battery upgrades you might want to go with the link I put in my first post if you want the simplicity of drop in replacements. If you want to go full on Lipo and are ok with the extra complexity then let me know and I could put together a shopping list for you.

    Too cool! :wings
    #57
  18. rotorhead511

    rotorhead511 Live and let live.

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    Thanks for the fork lead. It's an older model with the motorcycle style.

    I'm into mountain biking so will hit up my local dealer for a possible upgrade.

    Thanks again.

    #58
  19. K_N_Fodder

    K_N_Fodder Long timer

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    Man I can't wait to get him riding again. We've been having nice weather, just haven't sync'd up and been working a lot. Thanks a bunch for the info Rambo! Snowhawk we want to see pics of the 20".

    Did you guys see that Steve Deines of Oset in Denver won the freakin Expert class at Jimmy Lewis' KOM? Wow! :clap
    #59
  20. BetaRambo

    BetaRambo n00b

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    FYI Oset sells the RST fork that comes on the newer bikes for $99.95 reatil plus shipping. The old style forks sell for $45.95. If you get what you pay for then the new ones are twice as good! I figured you could use that as a price guide when you go talk to the bike shops, or you might want to keep it simple and just order the RSTs from Oset.
    #60