The rehabilitation of Sir Gustave Sabastian (‘Gus’)

Discussion in 'New Zealand' started by Box'a'bits, Aug 22, 2010.

  1. Box'a'bits

    Box'a'bits In need of repair

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    No I haven't. It is an area that I am starting to look at.

    BTW, I didn't in the end buy from Motorworks, so didn't get that breather cap for you. Sorry. Motobins didn't appear to stock it.

    Got all the bits for the gearbox I had ordered from Motobins today, aside from the input bearing. :D
  2. Box'a'bits

    Box'a'bits In need of repair

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    Daylight savings is all very well, but trying to kick start two reluctant heroines into getting ready within a reasonable time was the challenge of the day. One had been out partying; the other just doesn’t do mornings. I’ll allow you to guess which one is which.

    The ride was due to start at J’ville Community Centre. Given we were the closest to the destination, obviously we were going to be the last to arrive. There was a small delay for deferred bike maintenance, then a magical mystery tour of J’ville backroads.

    The Ohariu Farm is a conference venue, which only opens once a month for Brunch. Very nice I must say. I now recall that we had a function there about 5 years ago. Here's the brunch menu

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    After obligatory coffees (or mochachinos, hot chocolates or whatever...) -

    • I had the crispy bacon, & potato & herb hash brown stack, with Portobello mushrooms & haloumi & hollandaise sauce;
    • Katherine the Eggs Montréal, with salmon, &
    • Mandy had the safe option of poached eggs on sourdough bread.
    • Bryce & Marion-Louise had the big breakfast free range eggs, smoked bacon, chorizo sausage, slow roast tomato , mushrooms, & hash brown with sourdough;
    • Steve had poached eggs, & poached other stuff from Marion-Louise's plate.

    After brunch we took a tour to Makara, had a chat on the beach, and then rode to Karori. I took a couple of photos part way up the big hill, & along toddled Michael Dodson on his Bopper, on his way to the ‘Distinguished Gentlemens’ ride.

    Sorry I didn’t end up taking photos guys. That was why I originally stopped on the Karori Hill, but I got distracted. I got one blurry short of Mandy, & an okay shot of Michael.

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    For what was supposed to be a rainy day, it was a surprising nice (sunny) day.

    The continuing gearbox rebuild is on the agenda for this arvo. I find I do not have the enthusiasm for work today.
  3. msmckeon

    msmckeon Just ahead of the sweeps

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    Which is where I went today, on my anodyne and out of place GS. Should have taken the RD. It would have fit right in but is unwarranted and unregistered (which would probably also have helped it fit in even more).
    Very relaxed ride, 2 hours to make our way from Oriental Bay to the Southern Cross, via the south coast.
    Michael
  4. Box'a'bits

    Box'a'bits In need of repair

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    Notes on gearbox while I remember.

    I didn’t disassemble the input shaft – I didn’t have anyway of relieving the spring pressure on the circlip. Maybe next time. As a result, I haven’t replaced the input shaft roller bearing & bush. The bush has some marks from the prior seal. The bearing has quite a bit less movement than the corresponding bearing that came out of the RS. Next time maybe.

    The little input shaft pushrod seal is a truly trying little piece of German engineering. I needed to pull the input shaft output side bush off the shaft to allow me to punch this through & out of the back of the bush. Then I reassembled the seal into the bush from the rear, pushed it through to the front, & then pressed the bush back onto the shaft. The corresponding bearing got a nice new baffle on the input side, given I’d munted that getting the old bearing off.

    The layshaft bearings were replaced. I used the bearing splitter on one as there was not clearance between the bearing & the nearest gear.

    As much as I would have liked a lower 1st, I was too cheap to buy this & the shaft would have required a big press to remove & replace this. Likewise the higher fifth (though this was less attractive for me).

    I heated the bearings in hot oil, & froze the shafts. I still needed to ‘persuade’ the bearings to go on.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I put a spring clip under the circlip, to allow for the radius in the input side output shaft bearing. Nice & tight. Hopefully won't move.

    [​IMG]

    Parts diagram courtesy of Max BMW. I had to reassemble the output shaft twice. I put a washer in the wrong place, noted some slop on the middle gear (11 above). I realized my mistake, & had to pull the output side bearing again to correct this.

    I haven't replaced the selector forks, or the bronze bush (14 above) that was showing some marking.

    To reassemble the gearbox, the layshaft, output shaft, & one gear selector needed to be repositioned in the gearbox as one assembly. The other 2 selector forks could be installed after the event because the shaft they moved on was able to be removed. I had to push the layshaft & output shaft into the gearbox three times. The first time the shaft slid in fairly nicely, but I realized too late that I hadn’t put in the one selector on the immoveable shaft. Consequently I had to reheat the gearbox case end in order to release the gear shafts again. The second time the gearbox wasn’t hot enough (I was rushing), & the bearing hung up in the case. The third time I heated the box longer & hotter (150 degrees in Mandy’s oven – but the case was spotless your honor). Perfect. I'll add more photos tomorrow. And I'll start to look at the shimming.
  5. Voltaire

    Voltaire Titanium and Ceramic Hipster

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    They had a " Distinguished Gentlemans Ride" up here too, got about 150 odd bikes and scooters, was a hoot.
    Not often I get to wear the Balstaff jacket and Mike Hailwood pudding bowl helmet these days.

    gearbox progress is good....I'm jealous as I'm busy doing house renovations....:cry
  6. Padmei

    Padmei enamoured

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    You got that bike of yours back together yet?
  7. Box'a'bits

    Box'a'bits In need of repair

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    Don't need that gearbox to do the CtC. Doing the shimming. Vernier calipers aren't really accurate enough to help with that. Doing lots of sampling to get a more accurate 'fix'.

    End float just didn't seem right, given the shims that had been in the box, so heated the gearbox end again & gave the shafts another wack. This time they settled in properly.

    [​IMG]

    Did a little spreadsheet to calculate the shims needed, copied off Joergs.. I don't think he included the gasket, & he must have included the layshaft baffle in the shims.

    Nearly forgot to put in the pressed steel oil trap.

    [​IMG]

    The output seal was a pain to get out, & later a pain to get back in.

    Heated the cover in the oven at 150 degrees again (the oven was already hot - we had pizza tonight). This time I got an earful because the cover must still have had some oil on it, so it was rather more fragrant in the kitchen than Mandy was prepared to tolerate.

    Do you put on extra gasket cement or put on the gearbox gasket dry? I assumed dry. By that I decided that laying a bead of sealant on a hot gearbox cover wasn't for me.

    Put a bit of grease on the shims & baffles to hold them in. Then retrieved the cover from the kitchen, eased it on, gave it a few wacks to settle it over the bearings, then tightened the allen bolts. So what torque setting for the cover bolts. Clymer gives 9ft lbs for 4 speeds & 24 ft lbs for 5 speeds. The 24ft lbs is plain wrong. The BMW manual says 10nm, which is 7.4 ft lbs or thereabouts. So I feel comfortable with the 9ft lbs.

    [​IMG]

    Done. Gears turn, it changes gear, & everything!
    SuperDave67 likes this.
  8. Voltaire

    Voltaire Titanium and Ceramic Hipster

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    awesome work, I must get on to mine....:cry
  9. Padmei

    Padmei enamoured

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    Good stuff Nutso. I left mine up to the mechanic to refit so i don't know what he did.

    Oh yeah you know that high pitched whining my bike was making? I worked out a hundred metres from returning home last nite that it is only in 4th gear :shog

    I will make sure next ride.
  10. Micawberism

    Micawberism Been here awhile

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    Motul Gearbox 80W - 90. Its got moly(insert big word here)shit in it and it made my gearbox sound better and change more smoothly.:clap
    In a nutshell, it did what it said it would do :deal
    Bugger me hope that doesnt catch on :wink:
  11. Box'a'bits

    Box'a'bits In need of repair

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    Here's a lesson to all you aspiring BMW mechanics. You block the crank to stop the crankshaft moving forward when you are changing the flywheel or replacing the main or oil pump seals. This stops you having to do a crank up rebuild when the thrust washer comes off its peg.

    Conversely, it's generally a good idea to remove the object you have blocked the crank with before you start the bike. Otherwise there is this horrific squealing, then a big bang, & you discover that this has happened...

    [​IMG]

    .:becca and you get to spend some more money at Motorworks. Btw Padmei, I think I can get that breather cap for you now..:D

    Maybe next time I'll write myself a note...
  12. Padmei

    Padmei enamoured

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    Ouch. Bugger.
    Did you want to borrow Berlinas one till you get a new one.
    Couldn't you just ali weld it? i reckon you could get it looking good as new without too much effort.
  13. Pete-NZ

    Pete-NZ Been here awhile

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    are those bearing internal ?... should they have the seals in them?

    Be a bit careful with moly and other friction reduceing additives where
    rollor bearings are used.. A ball race requires fricton to work..
    friction is what makes the balls roll... reduce friction and the balls
    start to skid around the races.. For sliding componts it good stuff..
    You have some bearings with big balls in there"LOL"..they are the worst...
    As the inner & outer race lenghts are so diffrent
    the ball can't roll on both at the same time anyway..
    IE.. the ball may require 100 revalutions to roll around the outer race but the smaller
    inner race it requires only 80 revalutions..yer get the idea..





    .
  14. Eddieb

    Eddieb www.AdventureRidingNZ.co.nz

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    Really thats only keeping the majority of crap off whats in there, it's not waterproof or holding oil or anything so you could run it as is.
  15. Box'a'bits

    Box'a'bits In need of repair

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    I think that replacement will be cheaper in the medium term. I am going to see if Kane has a spare he can sell me. I have a spare one I can borrow here.
    Hi Pete, thanks for your comments. The bearings only have seals on the exterior side, not the internal side. The seals are there because both of those bearing can be potentially exposed to crap/water coming in through the output shaft seal & clutch pushrod seal. Some put them in, some don't.
    If I needed to I could seal it with quick metal of similar. I don't think its worthwhile repairing

    I basically put the photo up so you could laugh at my stupidity. I blame being a bit punch drunk after a long day. :lol3
  16. Left Testicle

    Left Testicle Been here awhile

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    or you could ask does anyone have one spare and I could answer yes and am about 450kms north of you. make me a sensible offer and its yours. LT

    my ones been sprayed blabk. have pics I can email you but don't have your email address.
  17. Kokopelli

    Kokopelli Yeah, right!

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    I am sure he'd give you his right testicle for that. :evil :lol3
  18. Kokopelli

    Kokopelli Yeah, right!

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    Man, that's something that I could have done. I hope there was no other damage. You cold probably fix that and then paint it. Your bike is not show pony, it has to work for a living.
  19. Box'a'bits

    Box'a'bits In need of repair

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    Thanks but I'm good for the minute. The major worry was making sure I had a cover for the CtC labour weekend
    Couldn't. Lost that to cancer a while back. TMI? :wink:
    Yup that's how I view it.

    When putting Gus back together I noted the following:
    • The 150 ftlb torque you need to apply to the output shaft nut is a heap. I bent the holder, & even with Katherine attempting to hold down the gearbox we weren't successful at achieving that figure.

      [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • The neutral switch wiring got caught when I was putting the gearbox back in, cutting the insulation on one of the wires. I have taped a repair;
    • The swingarm bearings have always been odd. The right side has the BMW sealed bearing. The left side has a taper roller bearing. The cup is now showing brindling, & the bearing will need to be replaced at some point. I've cleaned the bearing, regreased it, & put it back in for the interim. There is no adverse movement in the swingarm, so looks like I have a little time;

      [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • I pulled the driveshaft out, & this is still rolling freely. The damper is out of phase with the U joint, but has been ever since i got Gus. The driveshaft settled into its spline in almost the first go. This isn’t usually the case for me;

      [​IMG]
    • I suspect that the paralever pivot bearings may need replacement again. They felt notched when I moved the cases. No side to side movement though;
    • The swingarm / gearbox rubber boot is far easier to put on when the swingarm is parallel to the ground, & the battery box is removed. It slipped on fairly easily. The battery box needs a paint;
    • The rear brake cable is starting to become stiff, & needs replacement.
    The bike definitely revs faster now, & has a different sound when the starter engages.

    I still need to re-time it & set up the carbs.

    The front brake pads need replacement before the CtC.

    I have borrowed the timing cover from Igor’s spare bike – hopefully he is okay with this for a bit.

    I had a look at his T63 front for the CtC. Not sure I want to use that. I have a new MT21 front waiting to go on but don’t want to kill this on the CtC. I may just run the worn E09 & MT21 combination.
  20. msmckeon

    msmckeon Just ahead of the sweeps

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    As repair will be every bit as functional as new, my vote is for repair. In no particular order of importance:

    patina and originality
    permanent reminder
    re-use, re-task and re-cycle
    reduced "parts air miles"
    the money gets spent here in NZ

    Michael