This can't be good.

Discussion in 'GS Boxers' started by bemiiten, Nov 26, 2006.

  1. bemiiten

    bemiiten League of Adventures

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    I've since read hear that the 1150s trans uses whats known as 'clean bearings'. They are indeed lubricated by the gear lube through tiny slots in the seal that act as a filter. As a result of the filtering , they are supposed to outlast the unsealed type. If that is all accurate, dunno, Maybe someone can confirm.
    #81
  2. NumberOne

    NumberOne Adventurer

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    Hi bemiiten and thank you for your experiece! I write from Italy, sorry for my english!!
    I'll have to do your own work and the biggest problem will be shimming the shafts.
    The first question is:
    yor plan for shimming has been successful over time :D?
    Thanks

    Antonello

    PS: my ADV :yum: http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=793394
    #82
  3. bemiiten

    bemiiten League of Adventures

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    I've put over 30,000 miles on the bike since the rebuild with no problems. As far as I can tell the end play dimension is .000-.002. and getting a accurate enough measurement seemed daunting. Because the bearing went close to 50,000 miles before a failure, I was willing to roll the dice on the factory setup as opposed to basing my shimming on possible inaccurate measurements.
    If the failure repeated or happened at a low mileage, I would disassemble the transmission. Confirm the old bearings are fully pressed on the shafts and then reassemble using plastiguage and go from their. Once I was satisfied the end play was in spec, measure the assembled length of each shaft and then re check the measurement once the new bearings are in place. ​
    Another way is to measure from the edge of the case to the bottom of each bearing bore and add the two halves together and then compare to the assembled shaft length. ​
    #83
  4. vintagerider

    vintagerider Long timer

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    Great thread. Many thanks to Bemiiten for his photos and contribution. Particularly appreciated are the photos of the bearings with covers removed and the brief discussion on mode of failure.

    Bemiiten's bearings show no evidence of coagulated muck from "bad syns". Coagulation and resultant oil starvation is one failure mode alluded to by Getrag/ZWN development engineers in Kari Prager's translation of the coffe chat reprinted on Anton's pages. Regarding additives and presumably certain syns which are not miscible with yak grease, they say:
    ["We therefore rigorously recommend against their use"].

    "Clean bearings" are not common in gear boxes and the refiners of most syn GL5's do not formulate for compatibility with yak grease. Nor is there any labeling convention that aids consumers in selection of a miscible lube.

    I postulate that the grease is only there for initial lubrication. It must wash out fairly quickly with miscible hot oil. On the other hand, you'll likely encounter coagulation followed by bearing lubrication starvation if one of the cheap syn GL5's are used, even briefly. Once you have the coagulation I doubt that you can ever be rid of it w/o new bearings.
    #84
  5. NumberOne

    NumberOne Adventurer

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    mm??

    Sorry, what for plastiguage?



    Then, I'd like to know this: before measure the assembled length of each shaft, you have measured the backlash of each gear? From the manual 1° gear 0,1 - 0,33mm, 2° gear 0,1 - 0,33mm, 3° & 4° gear 0,1 0,67mm. It's right?
    Thanks
    #85
  6. NumberOne

    NumberOne Adventurer

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    Hey Bemiiten, abaut yor opinion, the gauge (difference) between cases and shafts, it will exactly zero or few (or one) tenths of a millimeter? My actualy gauge it's 0,108mm for center shaft, 0,133mm for output shaft, and 0,036mm for drive shaft (input shaft).

    Thanks

    Antonello
    #86
  7. capnfranko123

    capnfranko123 Adventurer

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    pulled apart and the same bearing completely failed and chewed the end of the intermediate shaft. A friend/small bike shop owner had the shaft welded and ground like a crank and put 6 new bearings in. 116000 terrible noise and then the tranny seized. Now I need to replace. Aaarrg. living in an apartment too so I have to get a storage unit to do the work. I figured this would be a long process so I bought another 04 Adventure with only 48000 miles to ride while I work on my first one!!
    #87
  8. DualDawg

    DualDawg Been Lurking

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    Resurrecting this decade old, but GREAT thread! Bemitten, AntonLargiater, johnjen..... Specific questions....

    I'm swapping the internals from my low mileage r1150gs into a new case. Mine broke at the left side foot peg mount. Trans is already pulled.

    Bemitten: What was the Penny Tech Style tool/procedure you came up with to install the seals? I was just figuring on using sockets of the appropriate size.
    AntonLargiater: I understand your measuring instructions, total shaft assembled lengths, depth of both case and cover, but what is the difference that I am attempting to shim to on final assembly? What should the assembled end play be?
    johnjen: Reading your post about measuring all parts "Hot and cold", are you also including the case and cover in the "Hot and cold" measurements? Again, also looking for the final measurement I'm looking for to shim to and exactly how to get there.

    Input from all is welcome! Thanks for a great thread. Been lurking and using gained knowledge from ADV RIDER to work on my bikes. I've also purchased parts from some of the vendors on here. Thank You!
    #88
  9. johnjen

    johnjen I've Been Resigned

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    Yes an assmebled Xmission.
    However there is a 'trick' in that we used an old cover plate that had been machined such that we could access the shafts free play without removing the cover plate.

    JJ
    #89
  10. AntonLargiader

    AntonLargiader Long timer

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    On that transmission the shafts are already shimmed; the factory assumes that the cases are all the same. If you want to measure them you can (and I do) but if you simply swap cases you will meet the spec.
    #90