TIME-SERT® on GSPD head bolt

Discussion in 'Airheads' started by CurlyMike, Mar 15, 2011.

  1. supershaft

    supershaft because I can

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    Coil inserts have two issues that are often walked right into: Too short of an insert overloads what little threads there are. Too long of an insert exposes the beginning and end of the insert to start pulling out. Each end needs to be adequately within the insert's threads or they are likely to pull out. Unfortunately, the length should be just so.
    #21
  2. Beemerboff

    Beemerboff Long timer

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    If you have a wire insert in the top front of a GS which is stripped what size of Timesert, or Bigsert do you need, and is it possible to use the Cycleworks jigs to install the larger Timesert- they are half the cost of the Timesert outfit.
    #22
  3. Big John Sny

    Big John Sny Been here awhile

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    Several of the repairs required kits specifically for the application. Like Gen 3 head bolts. The threads for the bolt don't start untill you are a couple of inches down into the hole (the depths change for differnt bolts on thew block as well as different year models).
    http://www.timesert.com/html/gen3HEADBOLTinstructions.pdf

    Time-sert offers the kit to do this directly now. If I am remembering right, we had to source this through Kent Moore at the time. Looks like they offer manufacturer kits for different companies including BMW, but looks only like BMW automotive.
    #23
  4. bgoodsoil

    bgoodsoil Dare to be Stupid

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    :lurk

    Sorry to hear it, man. Thanks for starting the thread. I'm sure I'll run in to this on mine some day and now I've got something to refer to.
    #24
  5. Beemerguru

    Beemerguru Beemerguru...G/S guy

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    Yep, 2 are longer and go in either the 2 left or right side forward holes..not in front of an engine right now so someone please verify which.

    But for ALL studs, the case-to-stud end distance is the same.



    #25
  6. supershaft

    supershaft because I can

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    BJS, it sure is nice talking about inserts with you since we kind of disagree but we are still talking about inserts and not each other in a negative way! I think it helps that we are both making sense!

    Anyway, I wanted to mention costs. Coil inserts are standardized. They are not the proprietary property of Helicoil. You can save a LOT of money getting other brand inserts, taps, and whatnot from other sources besides Helicoil!
    #26
  7. Beemerboff

    Beemerboff Long timer

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    Answering my own question, but if you have a stripped helicoil already which needs replacing Cycleworks can supply you with the correct Timesert and a jig to suit - you just have to ask -----.

    t
    #27
  8. supershaft

    supershaft because I can

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    How do the stud o-rings work with a Timesert large enough to repair a striped coil insert?
    #28
  9. Stagehand

    Stagehand Imperfectionist

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    AS long as the out diameter of the time sert hole doesnt go outside the dimensions of the o-ring recess in the cylinder it should still hold oil, right? The o-ring compresses against the OD of the recess, and against the case, so it seems like it would work unless the TImesert bore is unseemingly large.
    #29
  10. supershaft

    supershaft because I can

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    Unless the Timesert bore was unseemingly large? To repair a stripped out coil cert? That IS an unseemingly large bore.
    #30
  11. Stagehand

    Stagehand Imperfectionist

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    Thats why I think it would work just fine, but I dont have any real confirmation.
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  12. supershaft

    supershaft because I can

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    You are now saying two different things at once. It would work UNLESS it is large and it WILL work because it is large. Which is it?
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  13. Stagehand

    Stagehand Imperfectionist

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    Sorry, I'm saying the same thing in my head, just not getting it out properly. I meant I dont personally know how big you have to overbore to sink a Timesert. I know a helicoil will have no trouble with the o-rings, but maybe the Time-serts require a bigger hole, or dont sit flush with the case, I just dont know.

    Oh- youre saying that the overbore IS usually large with a time sert. There needs to be away to place accents on written words :/ I was saying that as long as the hole isnt bigger than the o-ring inner diameter it should probably be fine, would you agree?
    #33
  14. supershaft

    supershaft because I can

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    Yes, now we are on the same page but I was asking about the beforehand mentioned Timesert that is made to repair a pulled out coil insert. THAT has to be one big OD Timesert. I don't see how it could work very well.
    #34
  15. Bill Harris

    Bill Harris Confirmed Curmudgeon

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    This is a photo of a BigSert repair on an R60/5 cylinder stud (upper left stud, left cylinder). Repaired a pulled earlier "helicoil" repair on that stud.

    The 10x1.5 BigSert has an OD of 0.545" and needs a hole tapped for M12x1.5 .

    The /5 uses aluminum base gaskets and sealant, so this was not an oil flow/leak issue. I disremember what the later model o-rings sizes are.

    [​IMG]
    #35
  16. Beemerboff

    Beemerboff Long timer

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    I was thinking of using the special base gasket which James Sherlock sell, with Locktite Master Gasket flange sealant - from that photograph looks like I wont have a lot of choice-----.
    #36
  17. supershaft

    supershaft because I can

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    Great photo and thanks again Bill!

    I was thinking about the same thing Beemerboff. I didn't know for sure but it looks about like what I thought it was going to look like. Not good!
    #37
  18. dfc

    dfc Reluctant Cannonball

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    I'm a little late on this thread, Just for more info, I did a TimeSert repair on my '92 GS this past year. Upper left stud pulled and I found out it was due to a poor Helicoil repair by the PO. I repaired using the regular TimeSert vs the BigSert. I felt like I had good threads when I tapped it out for the TimeSert. I cleaned the hole out well and used high temp red loctite on install. When I had it all snugged down the timesert did clear the oil hole mostly, I used a die grinder to improve the access, but only slightly.

    That picture of Bills shows the install well, if you note that the insert does block a bit of the hole, thats where I opened it up a bit. Before startup I did do the covers off/check for oil test and it was flowing well, we will see how it goes this year, if it ever stops snowing here.
    #38
  19. supershaft

    supershaft because I can

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    Wow! That's a regular Timesert? I would hate to see what a Bigsert looks like. Maybe the photo makes it look bigger than it really is? The first thing I would have done is hold a stud o-ring up there and see how it fits now. That doesn't look good IMO. If that is as big as it looks, that is another reason to use a coil insert IMO. For the original repair that is! Good luck!
    #39
  20. Stagehand

    Stagehand Imperfectionist

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    Says its a Bigsert. Will the O-ring cover an M12 hole? is the question. It obviously will do an M10, original bolt size.
    #40