Visordown Steering Damper article (merged threads)

Discussion in 'GS Boxers' started by kwh, Dec 20, 2013.

  1. oalvarez

    oalvarez Resident Raggamuffin

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    Duffs, nicely written sir. As for the damaged steering stops being the by-product of a tank slapper, they very well could have been damaged by the handlebars during the time at which the bike collided with the ground (if that were the case). No/yes? My point is, the steering stops could have been damaged by the bars after the fact, even if a tank slapper did or did not cause the incident to occur, so i think it's hard to assign cause due to such. As for the rest, i think it's tough to say what should be or shouldn't be as we're all taking risks in living our daily lives, but i do believe that accidents can happen to everyone.

    Regards,
    #81
  2. duffs

    duffs I have a beard

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    Thanks! I’ve never personally experienced a tank slapper on any bike despite doing some pretty boneheaded things in my time, as well as the occasional hooligan antic, but I have done some research on tank slappers (and viewed photos of the aftermath) which consistently shows damage to the stops on both sides, and in many cases damage/bending of other components... But in a straight forward fall, it would seem reasonable that the damage to the stops would be focussed on one side or the other (since the handlebars wouldn’t have snapped violently from side to side multiple times). Someone who specialises in accident investigation would of course be able to provide a more definitive answer.

    I know a couple other reporters wrote about ‘unprovoked’ tank slappers in seemingly innocuous circumstances but as these didn’t result in disaster there is no information about any subsequent investigation so therefore it’s impossible to know what occurred to cause this. Could be any number of reasons relating to the rider, the bike or the riding surface. But if this was a regular (or indeed, not so regular) occurrence, these forums would have lit up like a christmas tree several times over by now!

    I still remember clearly my most frightening motorbiking experience and that was on the Brussels ring road on my fully loaded F800GS. It was a very grey day with low contrast and I didn’t notice the ruts worn into the roadway from car tyres. As I was riding along a very slow right bend at the speed limit (80mph if I remember correctly) I felt the blood drain out of my face as I realised the bike was refusing to turn and I was watching myself inch closer and closer to the car in the next lane. A good hard tug on the handlebars sorted it in the end, but for a brief moment I nearly froze on the verge of panic. After years on bikes it’s remarkable that something as rudimentary as riding around a slight bend on a motorway can catch a person out.
    #82
  3. oalvarez

    oalvarez Resident Raggamuffin

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    Thank you....makes logical sense to me. It really does ultimately depend on the bike's action during and after the incident itself.

    Be well,
    #83
  4. hammick

    hammick Long timer

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    What about the fork crimp recall on the very early bikes. Any reason to think this could have been a factor in Mr. Ash's crash.
    #84
  5. EltonAvenue

    EltonAvenue Banned

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    I go with your explanation because you make sense, someone higher up the page seems to have gotten carried away with the fact that a few beemer aficionados agree with him so he got the bloody dictionary out!:deal
    I bet he has blisters on his lilly white digits!!!:lol3
    #85
  6. EltonAvenue

    EltonAvenue Banned

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    #86
  7. Gezerbike

    Gezerbike Hey Rocky...........

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    I don't think I offered up an explanation as much as I posed a question.
    #87
  8. mousitsas

    mousitsas Long timer

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    Never have seen so many defence attorneys working for free :clap
    #88
  9. popscycle

    popscycle Fahren Away

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    If I were in their shoes, adding a damper is exactly what I would have done for a very simple reason. First and foremost would be the idea of "take no chances with customer's lives" if/since an obvious cause can't/couldn't be found. With so few known instances, finding an engineering cause, if there is one, will take time and experience - something you don't have on a first year model.

    Perhaps it is more a case of Occam's razor or lex parsimoniae.
    #89
  10. pistole

    pistole Long timer

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    first thing : how many people commenting on this have actually ridden a GSW ?

    second thing : how many GSW owners have ACTUALLY suffered tankslappers ?

    third thing : how do you know that Ash suffered a tank slapper ?

    .
    #90
  11. oalvarez

    oalvarez Resident Raggamuffin

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    I have, I have not, and WE don't.
    #91
  12. popscycle

    popscycle Fahren Away

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    We (collectively as a family) have, we have not and we do not. And, although unasked, we do not believe everything we read on the internet about this incident, given that few, if anyone, actually saw how it happened.
    #92
  13. JimVonBaden

    JimVonBaden "Cool" Aid!

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    Nor whining prosecutors with no evidence but righteous indignation!:lol3

    Jim :brow
    #93
  14. hammick

    hammick Long timer

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    I haven't had any issues on my '13 GSW if 4k miles. Haven't done any offroad yet. It is the best handling BMW I have owned. Hopefully it remains rock solid.

    I had a friend go down during a high speed wobble or weave right in front of me on an ST1300. He was seriously injured. Honda denied any issues with the bikes even though they had a recall in Europe that wasn't done in the States.

    I don't keep bikes for longer than a couple years usually. If my dealer treats my '13 GSW like a red headed step child come trade time I am not going to be very happy. I went through that with my '12 K1600GT.

    If I can put 30k miles on my GSW in the next few years (without major problems) and get the type of trade values or private sale value I am used to with boxers, I will have not regrets.

    Now come on BMW and retrofit our bikes with steering dampers so everyone STFU.
    #94
  15. hammick

    hammick Long timer

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    If BMW is at all inclined to retrofit the '13 bikes I suspect it won't be done until any pending or anticipated litigation is complete.
    #95
  16. Gezerbike

    Gezerbike Hey Rocky...........

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    I seriously doubt that will happen.
    #96
  17. steelerider

    steelerider Southafricanamerican

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    It would appear the Visordown magazine is absolutely intent on pushing this as an issue. They seem to be the only publication that keeps bringing it up, and frankly all of their reporting on the apparent head shake problem is horribly biased, and suggestive. Basically, poor reporting with underlying currents that try to push the reader to a conclusion. It seems blatantly obvious every time I read a new article. I guess these days, media needs to generate conspiracy to drive clicks to their website.
    Surely, if you push any bike hard enough, you could force it into a tank slapper? I had this almost happen on a 2010 r1200gs, last year, when I went to overtake a car. Full on WOT on a loaded bike, as I let off the gas, the front forks dived down, and the bike started to weave side to side. I released my hand pressure on the bars, and it settled down.
    Bike magazine beat the hell of the new GS, trying everything they could do to get it to tank slap - conclusion? The bike is fine.
    Maybe Kevin Ash did have a tankslapper? Thant doesn't mean that it's an inherent handling flaw of the bike. Have you seen these journo's ride at a launch? It's like a GD circus. Maybe, he hit a huge pothole, or rock, or just lost control on a dirt road, fell off, and hit hard enough that it was fatal.
    My 2013 handles perfectly. Yes, it's light steering, but it like that way.
    25000 units sold, and no issues reported. Come on.
    #97
  18. EltonAvenue

    EltonAvenue Banned

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    #98
  19. Otherworld

    Otherworld Been here awhile

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    Come to think of it, I have yet to read an owner report a tank slapper. A few about wobbles between specific speeds, but this may be a Metzler problem as also many have reported the wobble fixed with a switch to Conti Trail Attacks. (Note, the press bikes showed Metzlers, and most Ive seen shipped with Michelin or the Conti's).
    #99
  20. Otherworld

    Otherworld Been here awhile

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    Nevertheless, if there is a concern by BMW, they should offer up the dampener to the '13 owners, not at the typical Break My Wallet price for their OEM parts but in line with production costs.

    Also Im curious if this revised ASC is a software update or requires different hardware.