Vstrom + Oil Slick = Vstrom Down

Discussion in 'Face Plant' started by TravellingStrom, Feb 28, 2013.

  1. NCK

    NCK Been here awhile

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    I couldn't agree more that there are two different perspectives here and I don't have one of them to speak from, but when I'm speaking from my very limited experience (which I "wear on my sleeve", in my signature) and softly and kindly offer my perspective, and to have you aggressively come after me by say I'm lecturing him, that's awful shitty of you and just completely unnecessary.

    I said nothing against him. I never said I thought he should do it another way or he's wrong. I said I saw both sides of it. And I just gave my perspective, based on my experience.

    We all have got to treat each other better on here, this is just not necessary.
    #81
  2. Pecha72

    Pecha72 Long timer

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    ok, it wasn´t actually you, who was lecturing the guy. I´m sorry, that I offended you.

    I still find it funny though, that there´s a short video clip showing, how shit sometimes happens in that traffic, and the OP even admits that he made a mistake (so easy to see that, when you´ve got the luxury of hindsight at your disposal), but you still get all sorts of armchair experts boasting here, how much above all this they would be, even though they´ve never ridden there.

    So, how different could it be from home..... :lol3

    [​IMG]
    #82
  3. feldjäger

    feldjäger Been here awhile

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    that oil slick looked nasty, his riding set aside, think that was a setup for failure at some point, and for someone.
    #83
  4. tommyvdv

    tommyvdv Been here awhile

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    don't know if it's still relevant but…
    Your jacket looks like an IXS "montevideo" and the pants that go with it are "caracas"

    http://static.rad.be/media/media791269094.pdf

    Oh and…
    Glad you survived.
    #84
  5. TravellingStrom

    TravellingStrom Been here awhile

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    Hi and of course it is still relevant and thanks for the thought on my survival :) I bought them in a foreign country and I have looked but cannot find any labels or tags on them that say "I am this model such and such" But, maybe I need to be pointed in the right direction?

    If you reckon they are that, I will go with that :) As I cannot understand the PDF file due to my woeful lack of German/Swiss/Austrian I cannot say what I bought :)

    Cheers
    TS
    #85
  6. Pecha72

    Pecha72 Long timer

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    Asked a Suzuki mechanic about the tip-over sensor thing. It's like a 'pendulum', and while cornering won't activate it, under certain circumstances a real sudden swerve maneuver might (and cutting off right that second could be dangerous) so actually there is a time delay. I thought mine have always gone off immediately after a spill, though.
    #86
  7. tommyvdv

    tommyvdv Been here awhile

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    if they look The part and are not goretex lined those are the models you have.

    a friend of mine has the same and is pretty happy with how well ventilated/warm they are.

    the brand name is ixs.

    he'll be happy to know how we'll they've performed in the protection and wear departments :)
    #87
  8. TravellingStrom

    TravellingStrom Been here awhile

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    Yes, the sensor swings on an arc and it has a two second delay. For some reason mine did not shut off, but it is still working now?? I have replaced it of course, but not sure why it failed. It might have gotten jammed when the bike slammed down, but that is what they are designed for, to move under load, so I don;t know :(

    Cheers
    TS
    #88
  9. TravellingStrom

    TravellingStrom Been here awhile

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    Mine had removable goretex liners which work :)
    #89
  10. chazbird

    chazbird Long timer

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    Thailand/Laos/Cambodia/Vietnam/Malaysia/Nepal/Pakistan/India/Indonesia. I've ridden all over those places and lived (and rode) in the latter two. So here I am - I am going to lecture the OP AKA "you". I understand when you have to be "smart" and do something that looks aggressive but in reality its just positioning yourself but that was a class A jackass move between those two trucks. Yep waiting for the gap to lengthen would have made it far less potentially fatal. (and in this case you'd have been in the other lane avoiding the oil while waiting for the gap) You're so lucky you didn't decapitate yourself on some rusty road sign, or were run over by the truck or something else horrific. I only looked at the pot-hole & trucks video from the compilation, was that you too? Whoever it was that also was Jackass and pointless riding. Basically in SE Asia 40-80 kph is about all you should do - sure, speed up to get a clear area, but still, it's not about threading the gap all the time and racing ahead. Besides, there aren't any medivac helicopters in Cambodia, etc. And in some of those places when (if) you get to the hospital you'll be even more afraid. Simply put; its not worth it to ride like that. Isn't one supposed to be visiting another country and culture? I always felt that 60 - 200 km's a day is plenty. What's the rush? By the way, if you ride like that in Malaysia you'll likely be pulled over and ticketed. They'll certainly tick the Jackass box and fine you big time.
    #90
  11. aspad

    aspad Been here awhile

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    Congratulations on surviving a big one + having the stones to do what you are doing on the trip + posting up your accident for us so we can all tell you what you did wrong:D (What I really mean is so we can learn from it) + ATTGATT + not getting offended with all the flack you are getting. Fair play to you.

    I gotta disagree with a lot of the posters on here who are advocating excessive caution at all time. First, your explanation about riding to the prevailing country norms and conditions makes a lot of sense to me. Even riding in France last year I was initially suprised by the number of bikers putting what seemed like close overtaking moves (by Oz standards) on me - after a while I just got used to it and adapted. That is what they do - no offense - quite the reverse, a friendly wave of the foot. After a while I adapted, fitted in and adjusted my riding to suit.

    Second, isn't this the ADV site? FFS most of us go out of our way to ride dangerous roads to out of the way places. That's the whole point - putting your skills to the test against the conditions + riding the road less travelled. Does't mean riding recklessly. Quite the reverse but the potential for hazards is always lurking and offs really are part of the game. Not advocating riding like an idiot or recklessness but risk is part of our game and why we are in it.

    Third even though I consider myself a fairly cautious rider in traffic and on main roads, I will admit that I have often undertaken slower moving vehicles in manner close to what you did in the vid. Even in Oz where the traffic is calmer and the rules more generally followed, it is very common for idiots (usually cars not trucks) to hog the overtaking lane(s) creating a rolling road block (it is technically illegal but completely unenforced). I consider it dangerous to be closely surrounded on all sides in fast moving traffic so I usually try to find 'holes' and if this means a fast undertake then so be it (the faster the undertake, within reason, the less time you are in the danger zone).

    What really brought you unstuck was the oil/diesel or whatever it was (duh). You could have been riding alone and in a straight line and still gone down on that - UNLESS YOU HAD SEEN IT FIRST and avoided it. And this is where maybe you (we) could learn to do something different next time. I learned (painfully in the worst off I have ever had) some time ago to never ride what I can't see. It is truism but very profound - duh blindingly obvious - but a very good principle to remind yourself about regularly, because it is an easy one to fudge... especially when you are 'on it' and everything seems so effortless. You just push too hard into a tightening apex - where you don't have a clear view of the exit; or not stop to wipe the dust off your goggles when you should - because your mate is up your arse and its hard to stop anyway; or assume that the next causeway on this fast dirt road will be dry because the last 5 were. I've done all of those things and a few more besides and all were in violation of the basic obvious principle.

    In the video the slick is quite visible. Obviously you did not see it or smell it - your attention was probably taken up calculating the gap between the trucks and the road ahead was probably only in your peripheral vision. But I wonder if you had given yourself another second before diving up the inside you would have become aware of the slick.

    Maybe food for thought.
    Otherwise thanks for sharing, enjoy the rest of your ride and come home safe.:clap
    #91
  12. crofrog

    crofrog Long timer

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    I think you think the demographic of this site is allot more adventurous than it is. Not to many diesel spill over taking semi's on thia roads on the way your your local starbucks...
    #92
  13. TravellingStrom

    TravellingStrom Been here awhile

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    My response as ever is unless you have been here and done it, then it is hard for you to comment fairly about what I did or did not do correctly.

    The other point is, we all ride differently so one mans caution is another mans recklessness

    I ride like I do because that is the way I am. I reckon I will leave a bit more of a gap before doing the above again but I will still do what I did

    I did get off lightly, personally, but it cost me a few grand to rebuild the motor

    I am now back hime in Oz and it has been very hard to restrain my natural urges to under and overtake slow moving vehicles. The natural flow of traffic here is so restricted with the millions of signs and traffic control devices that I wish to be back where motorbikes are understood by other traffic
    #93
  14. aspad

    aspad Been here awhile

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    I agree with you. Ride your own ride. :thumb
    And correct about the state of traffic. e.g. So many good biking roads round here now with painfully low speed limits + heavy policing.
    #94
  15. The Haymaker

    The Haymaker Been here awhile

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    He doesn't seem to realize that for one, "doing the speed limit" is not the same as "going with the flow" and that if he understood the rules of the road as well as he claims he does..... this thread wouldn't have started with a soil sample.
    #95
  16. fractalsource

    fractalsource Adventurer

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    [QUOTE I am now back home in Oz and it has been very hard to restrain my natural urges to under and overtake slow moving vehicles. The natural flow of traffic here is so restricted with the millions of signs and traffic control devices that I wish to be back where motorbikes are understood by other traffic. [/QUOTE]

    Thanks for posting the video. I enjoy watching other bikers. Learning from their experiences.
    I live in Idaho. (USA)
    An example of what it is like here:
    I passed a stopped car on the right, to be first at the light.

    (In San Francisco, it is an very common thing.)

    See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lane_splitting


    - But here in Idaho, it is not tolerated. I had a woman chase me for miles - honking her horn, shaking her fists at me. She was so angry, I had the nerve to cut in front of her at the light.

    I can imagine what you are saying.
    That the way people drive in foreign countries warrants a different style of riding.
    I suppose I would adapt as well as I could. I would have to go there, to really understand what you mean.

    But here. According to how I ride. I was pretty shocked at how close you were to the other vehicles. - In all your videos.
    I live out in the middle of nowhere. I do not even like riding where I'm around another person. I enjoy solitary rides in the woods.
    I can think twice now. Using your experience. - I want to stay alive.

    I noticed when I was using a camera, when I ride, I tend to go faster and take more chances, to have a good show, to slap on You Tube.
    I hope you are not getting addicted to being the guy with all the close call videos.


    Wouldn't be worth it to me. I try to keep my ego in check and enjoy pulling into the garage at the end of the night. Alive...
    Best of luck. Be safe as possible.
    Your videos send shivers up my spine. I hope you have someone who can post your videos for you. - If you ever shoot, your last one. :shog


    Lane Splitting General Guidelines:
    http://www.chp.ca.gov/programs/lanesplitguide.html
    #96
  17. TravellingStrom

    TravellingStrom Been here awhile

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    Half the time I forget the camera is there. I certainly don't ride for the video

    If something occurs I certainly do hope the camera was still recording at the time and had not run out of juice or storage space
    #97
  18. Rackemcrackem

    Rackemcrackem Unsafe at any speed

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    TravellingStrom,

    Thanks for posting your videos and for going out on a limb to take criticism (and advice) from other inmates.

    I've only had the pleasure of riding in the US and during several trips to the Philippines. From the general consensus, though, riding in the Philippines seems to mirror conditions in many other SE Asian countries. Traffic and the behavior of drivers seemed chaotic at first, but after a while, patterns and predictability emerged from what first appeared to be chaos.

    On even major roads there, one might pass typical farm animals, including water buffalo pulling sledges, loose herds of cows, goats, and the usual dogs, chickens, etc. It is fully expected to see tarps covered with drying rice covering half a lane, sometimes at blind corners.

    In addition to pedestrians, pedicabs (pedal side-car rigs) and bicycles on the roads, there are motorized vehicles of all speeds, ranging from 10 kmph tractors to 30 kmph tricycles (motorcycle side-car taxis), to slow jeepneys (local buses) making frequent stops, to large 100+ kmph buses, trucks and privately owned vehicles. There are many small scooters and motorcycles weaving through the other traffic. Vehicles often travel after dark with non-existent to very poor lighting, i.e., sometimes no headlight(s) or taillights or brakelights that flash white or blue, instead of red, etc. Also, many small motorbikes have no mirrors.

    I compare road conditions there to fish behavior underwater, where fish of all different sizes and speeds have learned to co-exist and swim together.

    Something that has particularly impressed me is how well most small motorcycle riders maintain good lane discipline. There really isn't much choice for a slower rider who is like a small fish in a big pond, but it does require an entirely different mindfulness to ride a smaller, slower bike compared to riding faster than the flow of traffic on a big bike. Riding a little faster than most vehicles is certainly preferable and usually safer, in my opinion, at least if it's done skillfully on a good bike.

    A few drivers (and some riders) pull bonehead moves but most show far greater situational awareness than the average motor vehicle operator in the US. In a country where traffic regulations are almost never enforced, most people understand that breaking the laws of physics always has consequences.

    While riding in the Philippines, I've made many passes and other maneuvers on a bike that I would never consider doing in the US. Lane splitting takes on an entirely new definition in Manila, where sidewalks can serve temporary duty as detour routes around traffic! It does require a different attitude to go with the flow there and maintaining a sense of humor is essential. I've always tried to respect the laws of physics, though, as they have definite boundaries! :lol3 In any case, it's always an individual's judgement call as how to best deal with the endless variety of interesting situations that arise on the roads.

    When in the Philippines, I do try to remember that I'm a long way from home, to always wear the best gear possible just in case, and to plan on arriving safely so I can ride again tomorrow.
    #98
  19. TravellingStrom

    TravellingStrom Been here awhile

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    Well said and thumbs up :)
    #99