VW Side-Bike hack

Discussion in 'Hacks' started by ThreeNose, Aug 3, 2008.

  1. ThreeNose

    ThreeNose Adventure Rider

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    I know that trike conversions from VWs are doable and pretty popular. Has anyone taken a VW and set it up to look like a bike and sidecar - like the Zeus Side-Bike?

    Is this a good idea or a dumb one?
    #1
  2. Uncle Ernie

    Uncle Ernie Long timer

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    The roads around here are about impassable in some areas from all the trikes that look like VW's slowing down to wave at each other.

    So- you want to put a Bug body on a 3-wheeled 2-track vehicle?

    Accoding to an ancient text I keep on the desk here, the most efficacious way to get rid of ideas like this is by driving a "spike" into the subjects head at a specified location which I won't reveal until I get there.
    Get comfortable while I figure out what a good spike might be...
    #2
  3. ThreeNose

    ThreeNose Adventure Rider

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    #3
  4. TEXASYETI

    TEXASYETI Call me "thread killer!"

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    Nice wheelie bar!
    #4
  5. bk brkr baker

    bk brkr baker Long timer

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    To get the sidecar ant not off-set three wheeler effect you need to have the side car wheel lead the rear wheel by 8-10 inches. So that complicates things considerably.

    Also I don't think a cut down V-W pan is the best way forward. Some thing with muti tubes is and not likely to include the word cheap in the final product.
    #5
  6. ThreeNose

    ThreeNose Adventure Rider

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    So how important is it to offset the to rear wheels? I believe that I have seen sidecars with the sidecar wheel and rear wheel in-line together.

    It would make sense that there is more stability with the sidecar wheel offset forward a bit. But does it matter with the track as wide as a VW bug?

    I can weld a bit and figgured the most difficult part would be figuring out the front streering. Maybe I can weld a long diagonal support out of rectangular steel, like on many VW trike designs - but offest to the driver's side.

    The advantages as I see it are:

    1) Cheap parts - entire running car for 500 US dollars
    2) Rear and sidecar wheel come aligned
    3) Two wheel drive vw one wheel drive
    4) Easy to find engine parts
    5) Car tires and wheels in the rear
    6) Easy to work on drivetrain
    7) Lots of aftermarket support
    8) Power vs motorcycle engine
    9) Unique hack


    From:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
    #6
  7. bk brkr baker

    bk brkr baker Long timer

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    The unit in the pic has the chair wheel leading the rear. It will be harder to turn to the right with no lead.
    #7
  8. GreaseMonkey

    GreaseMonkey Preshrunk & Cottony

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    You got that right, he can't even keep it in his lane! <LOL Snort...>
    [​IMG]

    To answer the original question reminds of the saying "The problem with most good ideas is they just boil down to a lot of hard work"
    #8
  9. ThreeNose

    ThreeNose Adventure Rider

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    So the turning issues sounds pretty imporant and after some reading, it seems that if I did my origional conversion with the chair and rear wheel without any lead, I'll lift the rear tire on turns on the chair side.

    Damn.

    Plus I found this image
    [​IMG]

    It's a diesel Ford Escort. Not exactly what I had in mind - but not really interested in driving that around as much as the Side-Bike. Perhapse going cheap on this project is going to be disappointing.

    The wheels are still turning.
    #9
  10. BeemerChef

    BeemerChef Wandering Homeless

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    Hi Uncle Ernie! Long time no see... on my part anyhow...
    Hope is well with you.
    (sorry for the intrusion...)
    Be well... Ara & Spirit
    #10
  11. RedMenace

    RedMenace Adventure Sidecar

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    it sounds like you might have little or no actual experience with sidecars? You might consider finding a cheap, used sidecar already put together and taking a sidecar class(not necessarily in that order) to get a little seat time before designing one on your own. It would really help you get some perspective on what is required and desirable in a sidecar rig and how they work. Book learning alone is not a good basis for design.
    #11
  12. ThreeNose

    ThreeNose Adventure Rider

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    You are probably right, but it has been difficult finding a used chair and I figured that I would just use your experience to help design a really cool setup. :wink:

    I've seen a few car/chair hybrids on the web, and it's starting to look like the squeeze just might not be worth the juice. But the thought of throwing together a my very own easy to do setup with power disc brakes, car wheels, car tires, running gear that is easy to find parts for, possible two wheel drive and wheel standing power (not that I need or really want that) for less than the price of a Ural - is pretty appealing. The easy to do and less than the price of Ural is starting to look unlikely.
    #12
  13. HogWild

    HogWild Scott Whitney

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    #13
  14. claude

    claude Sidecar Jockey

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    If you think about it almost any front wheel drive car , engine and tranny, could be used to make a rear engine hack. Left front car wheel becomes the rear bike wheel and right front car wheel gets moved forward and is turned by a chain or gilmer belt. Rigid suspenion on th ehack sure woudl make it easy.
    The sidecar wheel on the yellow rig is run by a gilmer toothed belt.
    One could also possibly lock the differential and use an unpowered sidecar wheel.
    If we look at how much power some of the youngsters are getting out of these 'tuner cars' today this whole concept can get pretty exciting. Twin turbos, intercoolers etc etc...yow.
    I better shut up now...LOL.
    #14
  15. ThreeNose

    ThreeNose Adventure Rider

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    #15
  16. ThreeNose

    ThreeNose Adventure Rider

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    Using a chain or belt to offset a front wheel drive engine/trany, locking the trany, using an unpowered wheel and even posittioning the transaxle diagonally with cv joints all crossed my mind. Hmm.:ricky

    Wheels are still turning.

    With truck axles, you can weld the spider gears to spool th axles together. So if you removed one, the other would work just fine. What happens if you remove an axle from a transaxle?

    Will I need a spool? Can I weld spider gears?
    [​IMG]
    #16
  17. oppozit

    oppozit Banned

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    You can even explore the possibility of a completely asymmetric three-wheeler with three tracks. (A Scott sociable taken to the extreme.) Some interesting possibilities there.
    #17
  18. ThreeNose

    ThreeNose Adventure Rider

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    An asymmetrical three-wheeler is an interesting idea.

    Honda GL1800 and this
    [​IMG][​IMG]

    http://www.sakuma-engineering.co.jp/index03/index03.htm
    BossHoss SIDE TRIKE
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Their is also what appears to be a datona 2+2 sidecar on a Honda side-trike at http://www.sakuma-engineering.co.jp/index03/trikesidecar.htm
    [​IMG]


    The Hannigan Tri-Car is 80 inch wide with a 77inch Wheel Base.
    A VW Bug is about 60.6 inches wide with a 94.5 Wheel Base.

    That's a big difference!

    With the offset asymetric front wheel concept, I can use a VW rear, offset the bike to the side and build a sidecar for gal/gear and to hide the engine. I'd get my rear car tires, real breaks and running gear with easy to find and cheap parts. All I need to do is mate a bike to a stripped frame, fabricate a sidecar and dress it up.

    This would also put me more in my lane since my handlebar won't be hanging out in the next lane. My sidecar won't be as large, unless I push the rear wheels out with wheel spacers or use wheels with less backspacking.

    How do you think this would turn if the chair and rear wheels were in-line?

    The big question - would the wheel track for the VW would nee to be widened to make it stable? and is this width acceptable.

    Anyone want to experiment on the first prototype?
    #18
  19. ThreeNose

    ThreeNose Adventure Rider

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    Here are some Japanese pages on three wheel bike/trike/hack types:

    Hacks:
    http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%82%B5%E3%82%A4%E3%83%89%E3%82%AB%E3%83%BC

    Trikes:
    http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%83%88%E3%83%A9%E3%82%A4%E3%82%AF

    The both have this images:
    [​IMG]
    &#12488;&#12521;&#12452;&#12463;&#12539;&#12469;&#12452;&#12489;&#12459;&#12540;&#31561;&#12398;&#20813;&#35377;&#21306;&#20998;&#22259;&#35500;

    &#12513;&#12460;&#12476;&#12454;&#12473; - Mega Zeus
    &#22411; - type
    &#12469;&#12452;&#12489;&#12459;&#12540; - sidecar
    &#12469;&#12452;&#12489;&#12488;&#12521;&#12452;&#12463; - Side trike
    &#12489;&#12491;&#12456;&#12503;&#12523; - Dnieper
    &#12454;&#12521;&#12523; - Ural
    &#12521;&#12452;&#12463;&#12459;&#12540;Trike car
    &#24460;&#36650;1&#36650;&#39366;&#21205;&#12391; - With rear wheel 1 wheel drive
    &#12473;&#12486;&#12450;&#12522;&#12531;&#12464;&#12495;&#12531;&#12489;&#12523;&#12479;&#12452;&#12503; - Steering handle type


    If you number the images 1-8 with the top row 1-4 and the bottom row 5-8 you have:

    Top Row-
    1) Regular hack
    2) 2wd hack with offset side car wheel (&#12454;&#12521;&#12523; - Ural)
    3) 2wd hack with rear wheels lined up (BMW R75, &#12489;&#12491;&#12456;&#12503;&#12523; - Dnieper)
    4) 2wd hack with rear wheels lined up and front wheel offset towards midline (&#12469;&#12452;&#12489;&#12488;&#12521;&#12452;&#12463; - Side trike)

    Bottom Row-
    5) Japanese unibody hack
    6) Trike
    7) 2wd rear engined hack with rear wheels lined up (&#12513;&#12460;&#12476;&#12454;&#12473;&#22411;&#12469;&#12452;&#12489;&#12459;&#12540; - Mega Zeus type sidecar)
    8) Reverse Trike (&#12521;&#12452;&#12463;&#12459;&#12540;Trike car )


    I'm still thinking about ways to make the type 7 hack out of a VW Bug. What are people's thoughts out there?


    Here is some more Japanese images with pics
    [​IMG]
    &#12469;&#12452;&#12489;&#12459;&#12540; &#65288;&#35201;&#20108;&#36650;&#20813;&#35377;&#65289;

    [​IMG]
    &#12488;&#12521;&#12452;&#12463; &#65288;&#35201;&#22235;&#36650;&#20813;&#35377;&#65289;

    [​IMG]
    &#12469;&#12452;&#12489;&#12488;&#12521;&#12452;&#12463;&#65288;&#35201;&#22235;&#36650;&#20813;&#35377;&#65289;

    [​IMG]
    Fuoco 500ie &#65288;&#35201;&#22235;&#36650;&#20813;&#35377;&#65289;

    Plus this site:
    http://www.sakuma-engineering.co.jp/index03/index03.htm
    [​IMG]
    &#20596;&#36554;&#36650;&#12434;&#39366;&#21205;&#12375;&#12289;
    &#24460;&#36650;&#12364;&#12458;&#12501;&#12475;&#12483;&#12488;&#12373;&#12428;&#12383;&#12469;&#12452;&#12489;&#12488;&#12521;&#12452;&#12463;
    &#8251;&#26222;&#36890;&#20813;&#35377;

    &#12488;&#12521;&#12452;&#12463;&#22411;&#12469;&#12452;&#12489;&#12459;&#12540;

    Translator at http://www2.worldlingo.com/en/products_services/worldlingo_translator.html



    SideTriker http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5l5jxMNGbQ

    <OBJECT height=344 width=425>
    <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/m5l5jxMNGbQ&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></OBJECT>

    http://autos.yahoo.co.jp/bike/nubike/detail.html?maker=11&bike=1010139&stcbid=8500050B30080209001&image=0

    Ideas?
    #19
  20. Sidecarjohn

    Sidecarjohn SidecarJohn

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    Funny how this car engined topic crops up over the years. I've seen some variations over the years, but the latest is for me the best, combining sound engineering, more than acceptable looks, and from my frugal economic point of view.

    It took eight months of spare time to build and has only been on the road since the beginning of April.

    Check it out on http://www.sidecar.freeuk.com/gallerybaker.htm
    #20