WABDR (Washington Backcountry Discovery Route) 2015

Discussion in 'Pacific Northwet - Where it's green. And wet.' started by Roonie, Sep 15, 2010.

  1. ADVNCW

    ADVNCW Banned

    Joined:
    May 23, 2012
    Oddometer:
    341
    Location:
    Leavenworth, WA- in the mountains!
    Given the extent ot the still smoldering fires, the gate likely is for the remaining areas closure.

    There is snow in the area now, I rode through snow on Nahahum last week...
  2. 1911fan

    1911fan Master of the Obvious

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2007
    Oddometer:
    3,311
    Location:
    North Central Washington
    Can't do coordinates at work, but new gate is about a half-mile south of the end of pavement at the Mission Creek/Sand Creek intersection. According to the guy who answered the phone, the new gate is the new seasonal closure. He didn't know for sure, and didn't know dates, and transferred me to Bob Stoehr. Contact number is (509) 548-2550. I left voicemail.
    I'd like to have some answers. It's unconscionable to lock up the lower 4+ miles with no public input- bad enough that FR9710 has been closed at the Peavine intersection since the washout, but now that it's repaired it's gated.
    Everybody call Bob and ask why.


    1911fan
  3. ADVNCW

    ADVNCW Banned

    Joined:
    May 23, 2012
    Oddometer:
    341
    Location:
    Leavenworth, WA- in the mountains!
    Really not just to disagree or bust anyone's chops. But that sounds right to me- a seasonal closure.

    The Road is likely not rebuilt to specs, so I would think they want to protect it from rutting and erosion. Sorry, I wish USFS had money to maintain the Forest like 1985...but it does not. It took USFS YEARS to rebuild the Icicle Rd, but that freeway that they finally finished looks like a 100 year road to me!

    I know Bob and met with him for various things a few times, twice about a Road I am afraid of 'losing' for the past two years. Bob is great, he will listen and understand you. But the reality is they have hardly any money. As well, it is not just up to them, they have Laws and Regs and agreements and Forest/ Regional/ National Directives and who knows what they have to follow... The more that you learn the more you will shake your head...:huh

    The real cause is the direction and nature now of USFS, perhaps a result of pressure groups, their cause(s) eg Spotted Owl, the 1993 Forest Plan and the death of the timber industry, the resultant reduction of USFS to an impoverished agency, more pressure from advocacy, litigation, and general bs that we all complain about.

    Yes 'we' all own the Forest, but the bureaucracy does not care, it is an immovable bureaucracy and it hates everyone equally.:huh IMO
  4. 1911fan

    1911fan Master of the Obvious

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2007
    Oddometer:
    3,311
    Location:
    North Central Washington
    That might make sense if the closure was anywhere near the washout and repair. It's not. The gate is two miles below/north of Devil's Gulch trailhead, and the Peavine intersection is two miles above the trailhead, roughly. That's four miles of road that up until last week was open. As it's pretty much my backyard, I've been up it to park at the bottom of Peavine and walk the pack. I've done it since the fires were out or controlled, and that four miles was not visibly impacted by the fire or traffic. Due to a surprise health complication, I was not able to hike to the washout from the gate and get pics of the road repair, which was my plan last weekend (All better now, thanks.)
    In the winter, my friend and I run a trapline in the area and sled in. Now it's technically closed, for an unknown reason, with little or no public input. If the Forest Circus is so concerned about erosion and damage, there are lots of places that should be seasonally gated to keep out the 4WD truck idiots that think it's cool to destroy roads by 'mudding' them into rutted hell. There's one near my house that is further destroyed every spring, and it's never gated.
    I'm just against land and road closures by bureaucratic fiat.


    1911fan
  5. Apple Jam

    Apple Jam Forest Flyer

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2007
    Oddometer:
    6,735
    Location:
    Mt Hood mud flow
    The Forest Service doesn't have any money because they're all sitting at a computer, posting on Facebook, instead of in the forest, leaning on a shovel.
    And, when they DO go to the forest, each person drives their own V-8 full-size Dodge/Ram/Ford/Chevy PU, after filling it up with lots of fuel, and stopping by McDonalds or Starbucks on their way up to the forest.

    My favorite Road is 20 miles away from me: Mill Creek Ridge Rd.
    It's actually the short cut by 12 miles towards the NE, to the house where I grew up in outide The Dalles. The only pavement go-around is 43 miles.

    ....well, it received three brand new green gates (at how much $ apiece$$??) two years ago.

    This road was already on the seasonal closure list,
    the gates just set that rule in........concrete.
    The gates have always been open otherwise :whew
  6. ADVNCW

    ADVNCW Banned

    Joined:
    May 23, 2012
    Oddometer:
    341
    Location:
    Leavenworth, WA- in the mountains!
    Sorry, man. They are messing with your special area, that stinks. I had it figured out for 10 years where to go in solitude with my family, no FS around or aware of the areas. All burned now....

    The more you see and then the more you know about the Forest...the worse it gets!:puke1
  7. wbedient

    wbedient MoTard

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2010
    Oddometer:
    1,315
    Location:
    North Central Washington
    :deal


    The FS isn't ALL bad, and its problems are mostly due to what ADVNCW had to say (see above). The ologists who are on the computer are on there because of federally mandated paperwork, namely EA's (NEPA).

    Our local district just got a new long bed 2500 HD Chevy... what do they need that for? They didn't ask for it, they don't have a choice what rig they get sent. Bureaucracy at its finest!

    Part of the reason they don't have money to maintain roads is because they don't cut enough volume to pay for road maintenance because all their money gets used up in bureaucratic paperwork, litigation and (IMHO) over addressing environmental concerns.
  8. michaelyogi

    michaelyogi Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Oddometer:
    282
    Location:
    Eastslope North Casacdes, WA
    You forgot to add an overage of "overfed"... A GS10 (or greater) doesn't go into the field... well, they might go "into the field" but they don't work there. It's the working crews that bear the brunt of the budgetary hit... if a GS12 is no longer funded in his/her position... the Fed just finds another non-filled position to put that GS12 in... The GS6? The unemployment line is over there...
    I worked trail crew in the 90's (when there were trail crews)... now days most trail crews are a mere ghost of what they used to be... go figure.
  9. 1911fan

    1911fan Master of the Obvious

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2007
    Oddometer:
    3,311
    Location:
    North Central Washington
    Blame treehuggers. Our once thriving timber industry is dead. Areas that need to be thinned are held up in court by these morons, and as far as actually cutting down trees! well for gosh sakes the spotted tree salamander might live somewhere nearby! The Fisher Canyon fire across the highway from Cashmere, several years ago, was actually slated for thinning but held up in court for at least two years by ecofreaks. As a result, the fire was worse than it needed to be, and the same green idiots held up the salvage cutting until the wood was no good, on the grounds that logging would create runoff that might silt up the streams. And 16,000 acres of burnt ground doesn't? Hello?
    I hope that a lot of the burnt timber can be salvaged. Timber revenue goes into the school fund, and dead burnt trees provide habitat for the northern pine beetle, which is a scourge best prevented.

    On the bright side,the new low gate on FR9712 is temporary. Click on the link in my post above for an update.


    1911fan
  10. wbedient

    wbedient MoTard

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2010
    Oddometer:
    1,315
    Location:
    North Central Washington
    If I had to bet: DNR managed lands will have salvage sales done on them (they fund schools). I'd guess the FS will be too slow to get anything set up and salvage timber (USFS doesn't fun schools).

    Glad to hear that gate is temporary, we're going to try a south to north run next year. We went north to south in early july and couldn't make it due to snow.
  11. 1911fan

    1911fan Master of the Obvious

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2007
    Oddometer:
    3,311
    Location:
    North Central Washington
  12. 1911fan

    1911fan Master of the Obvious

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2007
    Oddometer:
    3,311
    Location:
    North Central Washington
    And, according to the Wenatchee World, the gated section is open to motos still. I'm off for four days and plan to ride it, just to see what they're up to.

    1911fan
  13. wbedient

    wbedient MoTard

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2010
    Oddometer:
    1,315
    Location:
    North Central Washington
    Report back to us!

    Happy Turkey Day!!
  14. roostar

    roostar Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2007
    Oddometer:
    156
    Location:
    SW Washington
    Haven't tuned into this thread in awhile but...is anyone entertaining the idea of a group for 2013 ?
  15. Hangar14

    Hangar14 FKA: BendEuroMoto

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2011
    Oddometer:
    117
    Location:
    Chelan Falls WA (the Ghetto of Lake Chelan)
    I live in Chelan. Lots of roads and trails here, as well as a few green gates. Some of them seem like they are placed in really silly places. Twice now I have been stuck on the wrong side of one, as in, I am done riding or Jeeping and need to get home, but now I am locked in the woods. Last year I had to Jeep through the x country ski trails, with skiers because someone decided to lock a gate two weeks before the published date it was susposed to be locked. No way I was going to turn around and return on the trail I took to get there since it was a very difficult Jeep trail that would take me about 4 hours and it was almost dark. Turned out the people who manage the ski trails requested the gate be locked since they had 2 inches of snow on the ground and wanted to mess up their skis on the rocks.

    When I lived in Bend, there was a few places where I would disreguard the green gates. Since I had spent much of my childhood and a good chunk of adulthood in those woods, I felt somewhat entitled to be able to ride where I wanted when I wanted. I was never caught, hardley have ever even seen anyone out there.

    How about you guys? What happens when you go where you are going to go and some Circus Asshat comes after you?

    D.
  16. tod701

    tod701 Long timer

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2011
    Oddometer:
    1,059
    Location:
    Stanwood
    Timber sale revunue on DNR managed land goes into about a dozen different trusts.
    Each piece of land is assigned to a specific trust.
    Those trusts include colleges, voc tech and normal schools, but also include countie roads and prisons.
    Who gets the money depends on the specific piece of land harvested.

    25% of the timber harvest revunue on USFS managed land is supposed to go to roads and schools in that county.
    The USFS gives the money to the State and them it is up the State to distribute it as they see fit.
  17. Craig McCurdy

    Craig McCurdy BIGMAC

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2009
    Oddometer:
    1,467
    Location:
    Hood River, Oregon
    And we wonder why we have green gates! It's a new world out there and in order to deal with the green gates I think we all need to unite and have one strong voice. A good way to look at this is like D30 armor (USFS), hit it with a hammer and it turns hard but poke at it slowly and you get though. I know it's not what it used to be out there but at the same time we are our own worst enemies sometimes! :gerg
  18. DeFens

    DeFens Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    Oddometer:
    503
    Location:
    Monroe, WA
    I aborted the route last year with a broken rib or two, and my wife was not interested in continuing. I want to try it again (or at least a significant portion of it - say Sections 2 through 5 - next summer, probably as soon as the snow melts out in late July. Last time I took my heavily burdened R1200GS - next time I'll either be on a lightly-loaded F650 Dakar, or an even more lightly-loaded Husaberg FE390, anticipating much more fun with either than with the pig.

    None of my friends or family will be interested in going this time, so it would be great to get a group together.
  19. hayshaker

    hayshaker Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2007
    Oddometer:
    392
    I'm thinking Utah BDR 2013, anyone else? :clap

    TONY
  20. Sapling

    Sapling Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2010
    Oddometer:
    413
    Location:
    Sammamish WA
    Yep....