War time hacks

Discussion in 'Hacks' started by fyr, Oct 17, 2011.

  1. MotoJ

    MotoJ Mobtown Hacker

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    Thanks for the corrections! None of those items definitely indicate a military model- my mistake. They are features more prevalent on military models, though. As you pointed out, IMZ did make the M72 for both military and private use, but KMZ M72 production was mostly military. The wheel hubs are KMZ. If this is a 50s bike, then IMZ had switched to the bottlecap type by then. With the overarm sidecar frame, wheel stand, and Dnepr hubs, it's a better than average chance the bike is a military model, which means better metalurgy and quality control. There's lots of drab painted M72Ms out there but not many true military models, especially in the US. The star stamps would tell. If the owner really did bring it back in the fifties that makes a better chance it's authentic military too.
    I'd like to see pics of the tub if it's there, too. Mounts for guns, ammo boxes, etc. on the tub would be a giveaway.

    My point was that this pile would be worth the time to get back on it's feet. I suppose there's no way to tell for sure the provenance.

    I'd like to know what that "air cleaner" feature is- some kind of vented gas cap? It looks like it was engineered to fit there for some reason.

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    #81
  2. fyr

    fyr iRoast Coffee

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    Ive googled it but-
    Are there any specific forums dedicated to military out fits (or bikes for that matter)?
    #82
  3. bmwhacker

    bmwhacker Still on 3 wheels

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    The "air cleaner" on top of the tank is actually an old tin bowl covering the hole for the missing gas cap.
    I'm sure a person could obtain the old hulk in its' entirety but the owner said he was offered $2000.00 for it last year and turned it down.
    He refuses to piece any of it out.
    I'd really have to want it bad to pay that amount....money talks, so a guy might get it cheaper.
    #83
  4. GreatWhiteNorth

    GreatWhiteNorth Long timer

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    I met a fellow here in Winnipeg that approached me when I was out & about with my rig back in January (freaky warm weather we had for a few weeks). He said his grandfather in Germany had passed away recently, and that he'd inherited his complete & good condition BMW WWII sidecar rig. It was still in storage in Germany, and he was asking if it was worth it for him having it shipped to Canada! I told him of course... and that even if it cost him a few thousand to ship it, it was very much worth it. I told him as well, that he might be quite surprised what it would fetch if sold. From what he'd said it had been in good running order when put away last (no idea if that's a few years or 20+ we're talking about). I can just imagine how collectible something like this would be... if it's the real deal - anyone see rigs like that ever get advertised/sold and remember what they fetched for a price?
    #84
  5. oppozit

    oppozit Banned

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    The wheel hubs are the same as used by BMW on the R71, all four M-72 manufacturers and the Chinese on almost all CJ bikes until the present. The bottlecap wheel commenced with the prototype M-72M in 1955. The M72 and M-72M production lines ran concurrently in 1956 and the M-72 line was transferred to the Chinese in 1957, For a period in the late 1950's, early 1960's IMZ bikes also used alloy hubs of a similar design to those used by KMZ up to it's end. They alloy hubs were used on The M-52 and at least some M-61 and posiibly some M-72M,

    Star stamps mean very little as lots of normal quality stamps ar star-shaped, Also the different quality of civilian and military production is more of a 1970's, 1980's concern. Lot's of myths floating around about military bikes and few facts.

    Also would anyone really believe that in the 1950's, someone actually managed to smuggle a military outfit out the USSR? It's as believable as Arbalet's infamous 1939 KMZ M-72. If you want I can supply you with the M-72 Stalin had made expressly for Winston Churchill with it's LH sidecar - only $30,000!
    #85
  6. bmwhacker

    bmwhacker Still on 3 wheels

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    I never pursued anything after looking the bike over. I have a couple other bikes that are requiring attention this winter so the old Russian bike didn't fit in.
    The bike is still right where I saw it and probably isn't going anywhere anytime soon. The owner has never actively tried to sell it. He called me on a whim to look it over. I couldn't really get him to throw a price out....other than the $2 grand he turned down from someone else when he thought it was a BMW. I let him know what I thought the bike was, and told him the value was way below that of a BMW of the same vintage. I didn't want to insult him with any low ball offer so kept my mouth shut.
    He never did have the tub for it, just the side car frame and a wheel / tire for it sitting on the porch.
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    I think the carbs had an "M something" on them. They looked like the old 50's Bings but I'm pretty sure they were not Bings....no "Bing" markings on them anyway. There were serial numbers stamped on the frame and engine. The serial numbers were very large (tall) and stamped crudely....not even in a straight line. I didn't notice any "star" type stampings anywhere.

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    #86
  7. zundappuk

    zundappuk Adventurer

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    I was searching for a Kettenkrad, lets see, must be 14 years ago now. I was working as a sales director in Telecoms and I WAS going to rich (stock options). Via friend in Austria I found an unrestored Kettenkrad in Vienna. It ran (just) and had been used by a fire brigade post war.

    Just as I was finalising plans to purchase it the Telecoms bubble burst and my dreams too. Step in a friend of mine who runs a business in Hong Kong. He bought it, and I project managed the rebuild. I look after it and he gets to ride it once or twice a year. It is registered and insured for road use, and of course I take it to shows on his behalf, and give it regular test runs........

    As found:

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    When I delivered it to the restorer

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    And as it is today in my garage:

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    #87
  8. MotoJ

    MotoJ Mobtown Hacker

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    Well, you've built some pretty cool projects! I perused your site and posts alot when I was putting my airhead outfit together. I'm having fun now with a rolling basket case M72, so I hate seeing them neglected and lonely like this one. Hopefully all the attention here will get someone interested- thanks for the posts!
    #88
  9. fyr

    fyr iRoast Coffee

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    Great looking resto! I wonder in what capacity this served the fire brigade? Woodlands, rural etc? Brute force tractor puller?
    It also looks like an interesting drive for the operator. Levers pedals and controls!
    Is that a diesel engine or petrol?

    Troop carrier looks slick as well!

    Thanks

    #89
  10. zundappuk

    zundappuk Adventurer

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    Hi Guys,

    I saw this picture today in a UK newspaper (on-line). The captured BMW R75 is still in the original paint.

    David

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    #90
  11. fyr

    fyr iRoast Coffee

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    Linky?
    #91
  12. Feeding Father

    Feeding Father From RU with love...

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    The friend of mine restored R75

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    #92
  13. fyr

    fyr iRoast Coffee

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    Nice machine with trailer.

    Any idea what the poster is taped to the nose of the chair?
    #93
  14. bmwhacker

    bmwhacker Still on 3 wheels

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    Awesome rig!
    #94
  15. zundappuk

    zundappuk Adventurer

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  16. zundappuk

    zundappuk Adventurer

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    Looks quite good, only negative are the tyres (tires).

    I had those Russian tires on my first Zundapp. They were a bu*ger to get off!

    Best

    David
    #96
  17. Feeding Father

    Feeding Father From RU with love...

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    And which would be correct? Do you have a photo? Let me know, I will spoil his mood when he will back from vocation. :D

    He also restored many others bikes and 2 Jeep Willys. Now he is working under mine Willys as well .
    #97
  18. zundappuk

    zundappuk Adventurer

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    Here is a link to one of the best. The other good one is by WESA from the Czech republic.

    http://www.oldtimerreifen24.de/shop...A_Gelaende_ProfMetzeler.html?cHash=7343f292d4
    #98
  19. fyr

    fyr iRoast Coffee

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    Thanks for the link Dave

    Some great images there. Love the detail colour brings out!
    #99
  20. zundappuk

    zundappuk Adventurer

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    A group of Dutch friends (I mentioned them in an earlier post) held their winter ride this year close to where I live. My wife and I hosted them for dinner on the friday night.

    Here is the ride report (in Dutch) follow the link for the pictures.

    http://www.legermotoren.nl/verslagen.htm#Ardennen:322012

    David