1. TorkeFUN

    TorkeFUN Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2016
    Oddometer:
    47
    Location:
    Grand Rapids MI
    Everything in life is a calculated risk. Want to ride trails during popular hunting season? Go for it! If you are honestly worried about being shot, or disturbing their hunt, wear hunter-orange vest (Or Pink :D) and stick to more seasonal 2-track roads instead of deep-wooded trails. Maybe don't rev the piss out of your bike, or ride a silent Zero like me ;)

    Cant we just respect everyone's space and get along? I think it's been ok thus far.
    PlowHand likes this.
  2. dougfromindy

    dougfromindy I smell premix

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
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    Location:
    Indpls, IN Lexington, MI
    What if the extension cord gets tangled up in the front wheel when you are doing 90mph? Oh...I know you flip end over end and the lithium batteries explode in a giant toxic fireball.
    Kawasakirob and Padilen like this.
  3. Padilen

    Padilen Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2014
    Oddometer:
    767
    My TW is plenty quite too. Even blowing the horn it took the guy awhile to stop.

    Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk
  4. TorkeFUN

    TorkeFUN Adventurer

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    Grand Rapids MI
    Haha, Very funny... Last time I checked Gasoline and Diesel can make an equally 'giant toxic fireball.'
  5. BlueHeart

    BlueHeart Been here awhile

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    Sep 7, 2015
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    Location:
    Traverse City, MI
    Haha! Check again, not so much on the diesel.
  6. TorkeFUN

    TorkeFUN Adventurer

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    Mar 4, 2016
    Oddometer:
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    Location:
    Grand Rapids MI
    My neighbor is a firefighter of 30+ years and has told me about multiple truck fires. He says they usually wont get near the truck until the fire reaches the diesel side tanks as they tend to explode if under half full.

    Looks pretty explosive to me!

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/huge-explosion-caught-camera-diesel-6284493

    It's also widely used as a component for industrial explosives because of the high ratio of BTU/dollar.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ANFO

    Screen Shot 2017-09-16 at 10.46.34 PM.png
  7. BlueHeart

    BlueHeart Been here awhile

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    Traverse City, MI
    Well I guess if you already have a fire going...
  8. BlueHeart

    BlueHeart Been here awhile

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    Sep 7, 2015
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    Traverse City, MI
    It's combustible not flammable.
    TorkeFUN likes this.
  9. BlueHeart

    BlueHeart Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2015
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    Location:
    Traverse City, MI
    And I've been in Fire Protection for the last 10 years.
    TorkeFUN likes this.
  10. Padilen

    Padilen Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2014
    Oddometer:
    767
    Yeah but when you see a fuel leak and Sparks you back off even if its a combustible, not a flammable.
    When I got hit on a diesel tractor, I hobbled away, as I saw Sparks and Diesel was leaking. Tractor owner was rush towards me and it. I pushed him back, saying fuel- sparks. He says it's Diesel


    Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk
    BlueHeart likes this.
  11. BlueHeart

    BlueHeart Been here awhile

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    Sep 7, 2015
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    Traverse City, MI
    Yeah, you can pour diesel onto a paper fire to put it out. It's the vapor that will get ya
    ApriliaPete likes this.
  12. TorkeFUN

    TorkeFUN Adventurer

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    Oddometer:
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    Grand Rapids MI
    Well, my only point is that Lithium batteries are not any more, or less dangerous then liquid fuels on motorcycles. In electric cars Lithium batteries and their associated safety systems have proven to be incredibly safe. If you crash a motorcycle there is no guarantee that the energy source, regardless of what it is, will or wont cause a fire / explode as there are just too many variables.

    Lithium batteries have gotten a bad rap from the Media that focus on the .0001% that have failed. Meanwhile gasoline car fires happen daily with little or no media coverage.

    And most of those Lithium battery fires are end-user abuse (i.e. Shouldn't have been charging a smartphone under a pillow when its already 120 degrees from too many selfies). Or from very poor quality of manufacturing (i.e. All the super cheap Chinese 'Hover boards' that would set ablaze)
  13. motodutch

    motodutch Adventurer

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2006
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    Location:
    The sand box
    The electricity that charges your battery is most likely generated by coal and the manufacture and eventual disposal of the battery will cause more pollution the it will save in its lifetime.
  14. Padilen

    Padilen Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2014
    Oddometer:
    767
    Kind of like "wind" energy, lots of pro and cons. But most don't know, that green isn't as advertised.
    This week is suppose to be another beautiful one. Who wants to ride.

    Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk
  15. dougfromindy

    dougfromindy I smell premix

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
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    Location:
    Indpls, IN Lexington, MI
    Yeah. Check out the tesla crash we had recently here in indpls. Pretty young woman driving with owner of tesla crashed big time. 2 dead. Explosion. A fire that could not be extinquished. It could have happened with any car. Just much worse in a tesla. High speed into tree.
    http://www.indystar.com/story/news/...r-vehicle-she-would-have-been-alive/97752674/
    If you google story and see pics I am going to say lithium batteries are highly explosive and combustible.
  16. BlueHeart

    BlueHeart Been here awhile

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    Traverse City, MI
    You had me at "media".
    I realize you're a fan of electric vehicles and I find nothing wrong with that. In fact, I have intentions of making my own "runabout". Possibly several different iterations.
    Having dealt with fire protection for the past decade, I have been afforded the opportunity to see the ins and outs of coal, natural gas, hydroelectric and wind generation plants many times. My job took me all over Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota. Being a social guy, I always struck up conversations with the employees I worked beside. I've learned a lot of the truth that the media will never let on because "it won't sell papers".
    One of the biggest misconceptions that the general public still holds onto is the "gasoline caused fire after an accident". Fires can and do happen but to say it happens everyday is just like saying Lithium batteries are dangerous.
  17. TorkeFUN

    TorkeFUN Adventurer

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    Not really, this has been studied in depth by multiple independent groups time and time again. The basic issue is that Internal combustion engines are 15-20% efficient while Electric vehicles are upwards of 90% efficient. In fact some studies have shown that oil refineries use 4 ~ 6 thousand watts of electricity per gallon in the production process. That's enough electricity to drive my motorcycle 35-55 miles alone.

    Now, your right that SOME areas in the USA are better then others, Here's a nice map that can illustrate areas that are better then others for MPG equivalents for electric vehicles. Please note, that is for Vehicle MPG, NOT motorcycle MPG.

    You'll notice that some areas are as high as 160 mpg equivalent, while others are as low at 38 mpg equivalents. But the majority of the nation driving an EV is well above even Prius MPG territory.

    Screen Shot 2017-09-17 at 9.11.29 AM.png

    This map has been updated several times over the past years, the numbers ONLY increase. Meaning that your Electric vehicle gets cleaner and cleaner with age.
  18. TorkeFUN

    TorkeFUN Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2016
    Oddometer:
    47
    Location:
    Grand Rapids MI

    Between 2010 and 2015 if your average the numbers, there were 1,945 vehicle fires PER DAY nationwide. Thats probably everyday in the USA that a car catches fire, and I HIGHLY DOUBT the news will cover each and every one. But you can rest assured that if a Tesla or Zero crashes and catches fire it will make headline news.

    If you divide the 1,945 vehicle fires per day into 50 (states) that's about 40 vehicle fires per state. I don't remember seeing 20~40 news stories daily in Michigan about gas car fires. Heck, I've driven by some cars engulfed in flames here in Grand Rapids and not heard a peep on the news about it that night.

    http://www.nfpa.org/news-and-resear...tatistics/vehicle-fires/highway-vehicle-fires

    Here's a snipet from the link above.

    Screen Shot 2017-09-17 at 9.19.09 AM.png
  19. TorkeFUN

    TorkeFUN Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2016
    Oddometer:
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    Location:
    Grand Rapids MI
    And as for the battery pack sitting in a land-fill, that doesn't happen.

    1. The battery pack and intelligent Battery management system are designed, and warrantied to last 331,000 miles / 10 years until 80% of its original capacity. (we have a couple Zero riders near 80,000 miles in California with no noticeable reduction in range)

    Here's a picture of the warranty screen, the second row is my Zero DS.

    Screen Shot 2017-09-17 at 9.38.33 AM.png

    2. The batteries will either be used in a Grid-Storage application for the next 10+ years, or will completely recycled. The lithium, Cobalt and other materials can be re-ionized and re-used in another battery or other application.

    Explore their website if you want to read more- http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/technology/

    And don't act like gas bikes don't pollute, The maintenance alone produces plenty.

    Screen Shot 2017-09-17 at 9.36.15 AM.png

    But HONESTLY, I don't ride a Zero because I want to be a tree-hugging hippie, to me these are all just cool side-effects. I ride one because it has a neck-snapping 116 Ft/lbs of instant torque and 70 Hp, no clutch and shifter to slow you down, No blazing heat between your legs, almost NO maintenance! They are incredible machines and I encourage you to all give one a try. I used to cast the same doubt on electric vehicles until I rode a Zero and found out he facts, it will instantly change your mind upon the first throttle twist. A lot of people doubted Fuel-injection, smart phones, computers, cordless tools, etc... Open your mind and give one a try, I promise you will not leave disappointed.
  20. ApriliaPete

    ApriliaPete Even in the future nothing works.

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2014
    Oddometer:
    188
    Location:
    Grand Rapids, MI
    :rofl
    Kawasakirob likes this.