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Discussion in 'Racing' started by spezjag, Nov 7, 2011.
Well put. I was shocked as well. But we grieve and we move on. So now that it's been one year, when is it appropriate to analyse what exactly happened, and, as someone asked a while back, when will we see Bridgestone's head on a platter?
I never thought that far. I was a fan of his, because I really liked his style and I despised the way the "aliens" treated him. Would he have become that good? Maybe. We'll never know. But I think you're severely exaggerating when comparing to Diana - the tributes have been well-placed this year and not particularly exaggerated. Sure, they're probably more than we used to see for people who died in the 70s or whatever, but that's kind of self-explanatory. I wasn't devastated by his death either, I never even met him so how could I be? I was saddened, it's always sad when someone dies, but for me it was sad that we would never see the guy who brought back some flair to the sport ride again.
I definitely agree that racing is dangerous and they're in it with their lives on the line. Which is part of why I thought that Pedrosa and Lorenzo acted like asses when Sic was alive. They seemed to think that they were the fastest and no one should challenge them, especially not if it meant with a spectacular/risky riding style that they didn't approve of. Bullshit, I say. They're there to race, and the way JLo doesn't even put up a fight now when Pedrosa overtakes him while obvious and I would do the same, is fucking boring and arguably damaging for the sport.
SIC was a talented young gun. many times his ambition out weighed his talent to put it gently. It seemed to me he was first a racer with the whole " hair on fire WFO" style. Exciting? yes. but I cursed him almost as much as I cheered for him with some of the just plane bad choices he made on the race track.
What I took offence to and my comment was directed to was the lack of taste and basic curtesy from the other poster.
GO NICKY!!!!!!!!!!!! YA GOTTA PUT IT ON THE BOX AGAIN BRO!
now back to racing
yeah i no i caint spell.... no spell ck on this machine
+1 A well balanced view, although I do think Honeybunz was "stirring" at the wrong time and place. The comparison with Diana was spot on. The day she died I arrived in the Middle East for another contract, and I not only was overwhelmed by the CNN, BBC Fox News but the "rumours" and conspiracy theories that are part and parcel of the ME ensured any rational discussion was doomed. Given time Marco's place in MotoGP will be in balance.
Its been analyzed, and over-analyzed. It was a tragic racing accident, and that's pretty much the whole story.
Sic loomed large as a personality in a sport experiencing a dearth of them. Despite that, I can't say I have really noted a canonization of him around here. Opinions had pretty much hardened before his death and few have changed since. The tasteless post of the OP aside, there's not much spilling beer over it. Mostly we are sorry for ourselves because the sport is less entertaining for his absence.
If Ducati can regain their former wet-weather form, there might be a race in the offing at PI. Let's hope.
Just leave us XR650L guys alone!
Here's a question for someone like Krop who pays way more attention to these details thanI do.
In Moto3, Khairuddin and Cortese are both riding KTM's. One Air Asia bike, and one Red Bull (factory?) KTM with a small Air Asia sticker. Are these two truly teammates, or both just on the same chassis/motor combo? And what about Salom on the Kalex KTM, is this the same chassis as Cortese or is the Kalex a private chassis like Suter?
And finally, if we have people like Suter, FTR, Kalex, etc. building chassis' and KTM and Honda both running motors in this class, why do we still have spec motors in the Moto2 class? It seems like the technology of these racing 250 fourstrokes is definately going to trickle down to the consumer over time, surely at this point they could start working on multiple factory 600 fourstrokes and have the same trickle down effect? Is their politics involved in keeping the spec motor in Moto2? O.K., yes, surely there are but what are they?
Khairuddin, Sissis, Kent, Cortese and Ajo are all run by the same team, Ajo motorsports. Different sponsors, different levels of KTM backing, but basically the same team. All more or less on the same spec bike.
Kalex is a custom chassis built the same way as the FTR Honda, but but Kalex get a lot more cooperation from KTM, as the two factories are quite close geographically. Kalex is KTM's official partner.
We have spec motors in Moto2 because nobody (well, very few people) is interested in building a free motor along the lines of Moto3. At some point in the future, this may change, but not while we are in this financial hole.
Others may have better answers. From my understanding the Ajo team is one big team and they are all on the same bikes. OK maybe not the same as there is probably a pecking order of updates, Sandro, Kent, Fahmi, Sissis. Last year Kent was on an Air Asia bike, my guess is the sponsorship dollars Air Asia is spending is less this year so only one rider.
I am not sure what they are doing now, but the original plan if I remember correctly was for the KTM and Kalex to develop two engines based on the same platform at the same time. So it is/was more than just chassis but engines as well.
Too slow Krop beat me to it.
I've been around motor racing most of my life and I am shocked every time a racer is killed. We're just people and get emotional about such tragedies.
Speaking for myself, I was shocked and saddened at the time, just as I always am.
But I'm also one who thinks there is far too much emoting in public life, to the extent that it now replaces thought in many instances and is too easily relied upon by those who would rather we continue not thinking. Probably not a topic for the Racing forum, but Krop's post resonated with me. YMMV.
I try to avoid throwing cold water on celebrating either the living or the dead, but I wouldn't mind seeing an end to the tributes. We had two this year -- at Misano and Sepang -- and I think that's enough for a long, long time.
That said, HoneyBunz was out of line.
Nice straw-man argument there... but yes, his death was an untimely tragedy
I strongly agree with the grace in this statement and those that follow. It IS hard to see these dashing and courageous young men and women suffer injuries and death, but maybe a quiet contemplation of their energy and existence is better than malevolent catharsis. ADVRider is a tremendous forum and we all have, with only
a couple exceptions, great respect for each other. I wager Marco would laugh at the vitriol and say "Be cool".
I gotta say if it aint broke don't fix it. The racing in Moto2 is top notch and won't improve with multiple engine manufactures. I can understand the appeal of different engines but I want to be entertained. Maybe Honda decides not to be an only supplier at some point? Until then leave well enough alone and continue with the great racing.
The 3 cylinder cross plane Yamaha engine looks interesting.
My only grip with Moto 2 is that the fat street bike engines make the bikes fat and ugly. No argument with the racing they produce, though. I will say that Moto 2 is threatening to become almost respectable, racing wise. Both bikes and riders are behaving much better these days. That is kind of a shame.
Wide engines and fixed ratio gear boxes. The two biggest problems in Moto2.
With this, I'd agree 100%.
With this, not so much. Our entertainment and interest certainly drives sponsorship money into the sport and raises the stakes, but I find it rather unlikely that anyone successful enough to ride MotoGP isn't also a born risk-taking type. Technique and tactics can be learned; an innate desire for speed (and to win) cannot. If these guys weren't hurtling motos around a road race track, they'd be racing their buddies up a canyon or racing Tour de France or otherwise pushing their own limits.
(if you disagree, I'd obviously defer, as you've met these guys and my personal experience is with ski racers, but the competitive drive and desire to push boundaries seems to transcend choice of sport.)
I wonder if they will try to get Vale released one race early?
Poor Ben,a disapointing end to a disapointing season(s).He never really has seemed to get to grips with the Yamaha,or is it the bridgstones.?I just can t get my head around how some riders just cant get on with these tyres.Tony Elias is the one i just dont understand.How can he be a moto2 world champ and virtually a backmarker in motogp.It not like a satelite Honda 800 was a dog of a bike.