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Discussion in 'Racing' started by yooperbikemike, Nov 11, 2012.
Rossis average finish about 6.5.
Haydens average finish about 7.5.
To finish tenth, first you have to finish...
Ok, cool. I tought the carbon frame was part of the problem.
BTW Nicky had more DNF's and DNS's.
I like Nicky and he is talented but not in Rossi's league IMO. Yes he did beat him on 06 but that is the only time. Also the only time I remember Rossi actually folding under pressure.
However if you put Hayden and Rossi on the same Yamaha's it wouldn't be close. On the tail end of his career I predict Rossi will tie or beat Hayden's career win total of three.
I don't think anyone is questioning that. Nicky did compare quite favorably to the GOAT, though, regularly out qualifying and out racing him.
So, I think the point is, Nicky is better than the equipment and team situations he has been stuck with might suggest.
The numbers would be even closer if Nicky hadn't tried to give Ducati podium glory at Mugello.
Exactly. Can't take anything away from Stoner, but there were other important factors in their favour that year. Only 6 years, but really seems like a long time ago now!
it was the first year of the 800s and the 20?L fuel limit.Honda and yamaha were conservative with the power to ensure they could finish.Ducati werent figuring they could roll back the throttle if they needed
I didn't say that there wasn't a problem with the carbon. But the steel trellis was much worse.
If it wasn't for that whining, pesky little Ozzie their plans would have worked too.
Careful you may upset Rossi fan bois with that statement. They pray to the alter of "the 2007 Ducati was so good that its the only reason Stoner beat Rossi".
I think Casey retired with his 2 moto gp championships. So it really does not matter for 2013.
Not saying Casey wasn't a talented rider and a multi world champion but most people will admit that the duc's 6-8 years ago were much more competitive than they are today. Troy Bayliss jumped on one for one race in 2006 and won! I don't believe anyone now (dani, JLO, stoner,rossi) can win on the Ducati unless severe weather occurs.
This is so right.
Four wheels good, two wheels better
If this season is a nailbiter down to the last race, and Vale or Marky wins the championship, i bet Casey comes out of retirement on a factory backed satellite Honda
Maybe, but that bike seemed to hold its own with the others more often, and with more than one rider. Just mentioned was Bayliss' wildcard ride, and Capirossi was leading the championship and winning on the thing before being injured.
You have to separate the 990 from the 800. The bikes were totally different beasts. The 990 had horsepower to spare, and as a consequence, you could use that to turn. The 800 - especially in '07 and '08 - did not have the horsepower, and were much more dependent on the front than on the rear. This trend was exacerbated by the fact that the '07 tires were built with the data from the 990s, and so had masses of grip with the 800s. The 990s had more power than tire, the 800s had more tire than power.
Capirossi could ride around the weak front end of the 990 using the outrageous amount of horsepower the bike had. With the advent of the 880s, that possibility was gone. Bayliss won on the 990, not the 800.
To see the difference in competitiveness between the bikes, compare Capirossi's results from '06 and '07:
06 - 3 wins, 8 podiums, 5 fastest race laps, 2 poles, led for 88 laps, 229 points. This, remember, in a year when he had a massive crash in Barcelona, and rode the next three races pretty banged up.
07 - 1 win, 4 podiums, no fastest race laps, no poles, led for 12 laps, 166 points. His win came in mixed conditions in a flag-to-flag race, and had more to do with wily racecraft than outright speed.
The numbers would be closer because of this, and further apart if it weren't for that. This is why the ranking is based on crossing the finish line. The rest is just topspin.
Face it, Hayden has won just three races in 10 years of riding in MGP. That is simply not top-echelon.
Seemed to me when they went to qatar that year in 07 with the 800's the duc had top end on everyone???
It did have loads more top-end than the Yamaha and Hondas (two factories that had gone another (wrong) direction), but having an 800 that is faster than other 800's does not make it faster or more powerful or more competive than the previous 990.