2004 R1150RT Wideband O2 Sensor Project (and AF-XIED for BMW)

Discussion in 'Vendors' started by roger 04 rt, Dec 13, 2011.

  1. roger 04 rt

    roger 04 rt Long timer

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    Like Terry mentioned, since the r1200 has two O2 sensors, the AF-XIED kit contains two controllers and two OEM cables. Steve at Nightrider decided to discount the R1200 and make it less than twice the price of a single.

    As far as keeping either a BoosterPlug or iice air installed, it doesn't matter one way or the other so removal would be the most reliable way to go since it eliminates the extra parts. The reason it doesn't matter is that the BMSK and Motronic use the O2 sensor to learn and correct fueling errors caused by deviations of the other sensors, air flow, battery voltage, fuel pressure, and ethanol content.

    After a BMSK reset, the BMSK can learn its mixture adaptations a little faster with the BoosterPlug installed if you have properly located its temperature probe inside the intake system so that it is measuring intake air. Since the iice air doesn't have the probe I would say remove it or relocate it inside the intake.

    Hope that helps.
  2. ebrabaek

    ebrabaek Long timer

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  3. MTrider16

    MTrider16 Ridin' in MT

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    With more trucks using NG, there have been some specific NG wide band O2 sensors made and adapted to industrial engines.

    The Y axis is grams/hp-hr emissions or %02. And the grams/hp-hr is pretty rough approximate.

    David
  4. Mike Figielski

    Mike Figielski Been here awhile

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    Hi Guys,
    Thought I'd chime in. As mentioned the reason the R1200 units cost more is that 2 control units and 2 cables are needed to service the 2 O2 sensors. Install is very easy. Another option for the locating the controll units may be on either side of the airbox. That is where I mounted them on my R1200R. It is a simple as unplugging the O2 sensor connections, plugging in the AF-XiED cables and finding a convienent place to locate the 2 control units. There is also a ground connection for each harness which can go to the battery negative. Roger is spot on with the advice regarding the Booster Plug or Ice Air devices. Since their effects are adapted out by the BMSK it matters not at all if you leave them on or take them off. I can say that you will not be dissapointed with the performance of the AF-XiED especially after your experience with the Ice Air.
    Mike
  5. roger 04 rt

    roger 04 rt Long timer

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    Thank you for that clarification. I am so used to seeing the numbers in percentage that I didn't slow down to read it. So 0.02% is about the same as the table I'm used to seeing. The lambda transition at 0.98 is unique to the Natural Gas engines. Thanks for the contribution, though, of such a well detailed link.
  6. BronsonRock

    BronsonRock Banned

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    Thank you Terry. Whatever you can post up here would be helpful to myself and doubtless at least a few others I have been talking with who are watching this thread.

    Question for Mike at BB. Would you consider a group buy option to bring the individual price of the units down? If so, what would you imagine the details to be?

    Thanks gents,
    BR
  7. Mike Figielski

    Mike Figielski Been here awhile

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    To answer the group buy question, as was mentioned before, Steve at Nightrider decided to reduce the cost of the R1200 units as compared to the price of 2 individual units. That amounts to a $40 discount. Because of this the margins are slim on the 1200 units. We really don't have the room to offer a group buy, sorry.
    For those who may think the price is a little high on the 1200 units you really can't compare the price of the AF-XiED to that of a Booster Plug or Ice Air type device. They are 2 totally different animals. The AF-XiED is much more of a complete fueling solution. If you want to compare price you should look at the cost of a Power Commander or Dobeck controller. I have sold and used all of these devices and in my opinion the AF-XiED is head and shoulders above all of them and represents a good value. In fact we have stopped selling the Dobeck controllers (we have them on closeout if anyone wants a deal :deal) in favor of the AF-XiED even though we have a much better profit margin with the Dobecks. That is how much better we feel the AF-XiED is. I hope this helps explain things.
    Mike
  8. MTrider16

    MTrider16 Ridin' in MT

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    The .98 lamda is a problem produced by using O2 sensors that are affected by methane. (ie automotive gasoline sensors) Once you fix the measurement problem, lamda falls in a more normal number. :huh Yeah, it drives our maintenance folks nuts.

    David
  9. Wallowa

    Wallowa Diver Down

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    Since the IICE Air doesn't have a temp sensor....why put it inside the airbox? I had the BP probe on the end of the air horn, away from motor heat...AF-XIED does look like a great product...


    Thanks again,

    Phil
  10. roger 04 rt

    roger 04 rt Long timer

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    Hey Phil,
    The IICE Air's temperature sensor is inside the unit itself (in fact there are three of them) you should have it sense the temperature of the air going into the combustion chamber, not just any-old cool air. That would be the same for the BP, you would want its silver probe positioned so that it measures the temperature of the air in the intake horn--one could drill a hole it you found a good location.

    Since you have a 1200 which has a powerful ECU, you might as well remove the IICE Air and no need to install the BP but you can if you want.
    RB
  11. roger 04 rt

    roger 04 rt Long timer

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    R1100, R1150 and R1200 Alpha-N Fueling and the Dyno: Post #1

    R1100, R1150 and R1200 Alpha-N Fueling and the Dyno: Post #2
    R1100, R1150 and R1200 Alpha-N Fueling and the Dyno: Post #3
    R1100, R1150 and R1200 Alpha-N Fueling and the Dyno: Post #4
    R1100, R1150 and R1200 Alpha-N Fueling and the Dyno: Post #5
    R1100, R1150 and R1200 Alpha-N Fueling and the Dyno: Post #6
    R1100, R1150 and R1200 Alpha-N Fueling and the Dyno: Post #7

    I've put together a series of fairly detailed charts on BMW Fuel Maps, Bosch Motronic Air Charge, GS-911 Engine Loading Data, and Intertial Dyno Testing. This information will only be useful to a few who read the thread but I've decided to include it because it has been hard to come by.

    In particular I'd like to review the inertial dyno results from an unmodified R1200GS that was sent to me, during which they ran the GS-911 also, and got some interesting insight into what goes on in the BMSK during a dyno test. My conclusion, which I'll show in a few posts from now, is that the inertial dyno isn't a great tool, but let's park that issue for a moment.

    I'm going to draw on several sources:

    --Bosch Motronic Documentation for Alpha-N (RPM/TPS based fueling)
    --R1100GS Fuel Table Data taken by John1100GS
    --R1150 GS-911 Realtime Motronic MA 2.4 Values
    --R1200 GS-911 Realtime BMSK Values
    --R1200GS Dyno Data

    My hope is that those riders working to improve the performance of their motorcycles will be able to review the charts in this post and a few that follow it, and use the previous Mixture Adaptation & Self Learning Cabability (post #358) from earlier in this thread, to get a good idea of what might or might not be effective improvements for their own motorcycles.

    The Bosch Motronic Air Charge chart, below is the ratio of actual air charge to theoretical maximum air charge. Although the chart is typical for a Motronic Alpha-N ECU, it is a good representation for the R1100, R1150 and R1200, and is consistent with the fuel table values read from the R1100GS chip. The amount of Air Charge in the cylinder is directly proportional to the Engine Load data we captured with the GS-911 during the dyno run (coming later). Notice that the maximum air charge is at mid-RPMs and is only about 85% of the possible charge. BMW developed this type of data for every motorcycle engine it produces as part of building the Fuel tables. Anyone claiming to have a replacement chip or reflash should have measured this data for themselves (I've yet to see anyone who's done this), which is time-consuming and costly.

    As an example, to get a 60% Air Charge (Engine Load) at 2000 RPM you open the throttle 14 degrees, whereas to get a 60% charge at 5000 RPM you need the throttle open 35 degrees, twice as much. (I'll come back to this later since the WOT dyno run produced only a 60% load at WOT, not nearly the 80%+ load the engine is capable of.)

    Air Charge Chart
    [​IMG]

    The bottom chart below shows binary fueling values, read from an R11000GS Motronic Chip by John1100GS. (Although the R1150 and R1200 data will be different by degree, it will be similar in shape.) The surface map chart was produced by entering the data from the fuel table, into an Excel spreadsheet. The fuel table values look correct to me, compared to Bosch documentation for Motronic Alpha-N fuel maps. However, I believe the axis in the table that's labeled Load is for a vehicle with a MAP sensor so I've modified the labeling axis for the Surface Map below with my estimates of TPS position for those Loads using the above Air Charge chart. This data looks consistent also with a stock Bosch Motronic Air Charge diagram.

    One of the most striking things in this data is that 2/3 of the data points are below 4700 RPM. Later I'll show that most of these values are within the area of Closed Loop operation, so if you were to install a new chip (or Re-flash the R1200), you wouldn't get different fueling since Mixture Adaptation and the Lambda Control Factors would bring you back to lambda=1 (14.7:1) unless you shift the O2 Sensor. Later I'm going to post a chart showing how little of the fuel table is exercised in a typical Dyno "pull" on an Inertial Dyno like the Dynojet 250i.
    RB

    Fuel Surface Map
    [​IMG]

    Fuel Table Values
    [​IMG]
  12. roger 04 rt

    roger 04 rt Long timer

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    R1100, R1150 and R1200 Alpha-N Fueling and the Dyno: Post #2

    Earlier in the thread, Roland (Oldpathfinder) mentioned that he took his R1200GS to a Dynojet 250i to see what it did in stock condition and we've started to dissect the information from that run. Luckily for all of us, Roland and Terry also logged data during all their dyno runs with a GS-911 and therefore we have actual engine data from that time, in addition to the large set of R1150 data that we also have.

    I want to point out as I did in the last post that to get a full suite of information I've used R1100GS, R1150RT, and R1200GS data. Even though the data sets come from different bikes, the similarities for this type of analysis are far greater than the differences.

    Before looking at the Dyno data, take a look at a "scatter plot" of a spirited 25 mile, local & highway trip on my R1150RT (lambda=1) and then after an R1200GSA (lambda=0.94). Every diamond on the chart is an RPM/Throttle Position data point as recorded by a GS-911. Although the throttle range of the R1150 is 0 degrees to about 80 degrees, and the RPM range is 1100 to 7250,

    --2/3 of the data falls into the 0 - 20 degrees throttle,
    --and 2500 to 5000 RPM range (2500-4200 on the GSA after adding LC-1s).

    That's where a lot of our riding is done and ideally our Dyno tests would measure the points in this range. Unfortunately, that isn't what the Dynojet 250i inertial dyno measures.

    [​IMG]

    EDIT: Added chart for R1200, 45 minute local-highway ride

    [​IMG]

    Below is the table of data that was read from the R1100GS by John1100GS (advrider), entered into an Excel spreadsheet (used to create the surface map in Part 1). I've added highlighting to show the area from the chart above and other areas where there's GS-911 data showing the Motronic is in Closed Loop. (Although the table isn't from an R1200GS, that model has a similar Closed Loop range of operation, perhaps larger.)

    Also of note in the table is the area above 2000 RPM but below 5 degrees throttle that is NOT Closed Loop, which is a leaner area (based on LC-1 measurements) related to deceleration. This is an area prone to surging--light throttle mid RPMs.

    The table has also been highlighted to show those cells that were measured during the initial R1200GS Dyno test. Of the 288 cells in the fuel matrix, the GS-911 data shows that only 9 of the fuel cells were used by the Dyno run. Only nine! This is the norm for all inertial Dyno runs.

    In the next post, I'll show the Dyno information and then take a detailed look into what it measures.

    [​IMG]
  13. SeeRace

    SeeRace Been here awhile

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    Would like to see some pics also of the GSA as I have ordered one of these units for my camhead. I will probably take the tank off though since I have some serious cleaning to do under there anyway. Probably more interested to see where the controllers are mounted for adjustment access. TIA

    Dave
  14. webberle

    webberle n00b

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    Roger, i can see, that "everyday riding" takes place in a region of the fuel map, that is quite different from the data from your dyno run.
    But isn't that only a question of the time that people take or a dyno run?
    I can imagine that if i want to see the performance data of my bike in a region other than > 5000 rpm and TPS > 45 degrees the dyno man can surely record the mid rpm and mid tps area if that is more important to me....correct me if i am mistaken...
  15. roger 04 rt

    roger 04 rt Long timer

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    There are a couple issues that I'm going to show with GS-911 data taken during the dyno runs. The first is that a conventional WOT run is far off from where we ride--fuel and spark. The second is that the inertial dyno is often presenting a decelerating load condition to the Motronic/BMSK just prior to its start, leading to a dry lean intake tract. (A good part of the fuel for instantaneous acceleration is from the wet film in the TB and back of the intake valves.) The third piece is that the Inertial load of the dyno is roughly 50% of on-road resistance and as a result we found that the rear wheel accelerates twice as fast on the dyno as on the road.

    The result of lower than road loading, and lean intake tract is a slow start to any acceleration, followed by an overly fast acceleration once fueling catches up, which I'll show through real numbers measured.

    I believe with care you could simulate real riding on the dyno but you would at least need an initial Brake load and a good way to stop the throttle at a target TPS reading.
  16. terryckdbf

    terryckdbf Bumbling BackRoad Riders™

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    To Dave in Kennesaw(Seerace) and all those expecting to be hit with the bad weather, I hope all will be well.

    The following photos represent an AF-XIED install on a GS Hexhead. I have a 2011 GSA Camhead, the connectors are identical in location. This is not meant to be an install guide nor is it procedural in nature. The AF-XIED devices are extremely easy to install, truly plug and play. Hopefully these photos will be an aid in some small way.

    The first photo shows the connectors located underneath each cylinder head.

    [​IMG]

    The next shot shows another angle as well as a 90 degree wire cover. The cover is easily removed by releasing the tab, it can be reinstalled later.

    [​IMG]

    There will be a tab lock on the connector coupling, a small screwdriver can gently lift the tab while working the mating plug out. It will be snug, it has a nice seal that works very well. I should note I chose not to remove the connector coupling, not for lack of trying but it is very well secured and I did not wish to break it. After installing many of these I see no reason not to leave it in place.

    [​IMG]

    The mating plug removed.

    [​IMG]

    Another view.

    [​IMG]

    One from underneath.

    [​IMG]

    From here it is plug and play.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Being a temporary install these units were placed behind the trim panels on each side.

    [​IMG]

    On a more permanent install the units reside nicely under the seat in the tray just ahead of the service connector, really nice. They are easy to get at to adjust and more protected.

    This is the wiring harness for the unit.

    [​IMG]

    This is one of the units.

    [​IMG]

    There are mating connectors (white) to plug the device into the harness, they plug in one way only so no issue there.

    [​IMG]

    There will be a ground wire to connect, I chose to connect directly to the battery.

    The entire process for a dual installation taking time to check everything and secure neatly is less than an hour.

    Hope this helps.

    Terry
  17. BronsonRock

    BronsonRock Banned

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    Thanks for posting that up Terry. I bought my set yesterday and expect to get them by the end of the week. Your pictures will certainly help with the install.
  18. terryckdbf

    terryckdbf Bumbling BackRoad Riders™

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    Good for you, you'll be fine, take it slow, enjoy the ride.

    Terry
  19. roger 04 rt

    roger 04 rt Long timer

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    Terry, very good of you to document the install on someone else's motorcycle. Well done, thank you. RB
  20. MTrider16

    MTrider16 Ridin' in MT

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    Well, the inertial dyno results were more narrowly focused than I thought they would be, but not very far from my expectation.

    A water brake would be more accurate but harder to set up. One of the nice features of the inertial dyno is the ease of set up.

    Your results are agreeing with what I have seen on the natural gas engine side.

    Nice job. David