2009 990 Adv stalling/fueling issues etc...

Discussion in 'Crazy-Awesome almost Dakar racers (950/990cc)' started by Gluaisrothaí, May 17, 2009.

  1. Gluaisrothaí

    Gluaisrothaí Feckin' gobshite

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    I picked the bike up from the dealer after work today. Warmed it up correctly, took off noticing the idle had been increased (great). Got about half way home- about 2 miles- in heavy rush hour traffic when the bike stalled under power and wouldn't restart. I pushed it to the side of the road and cranked it for a while. It eventually started and got home without stalling again. This was scary to say the least. I'm not a happy camper.

    I don't know if I should dig straight in and pull the secondary butterflies and adjust the primaries or leave it back to the dealer for warranty work.

    Edit: Rode it into work today (50 mile ride; 10 city, 40 freeweay). Observations: Bike runs way cooler; almost to the point I'm thinking the thermostat might be stuck open- but maybe this is normal for the 990 with the new waterpump, plus it was a chilly morning. The throttle is much more responsive; previously the bike would bog when blipping the throttle durnig downshifts. I experienced only one or two momentary hesitations when starting off at junctions. So it seems better, but the stall in ttraffic yesterday makes me want to pull the secondaries...
    #21
  2. crashmaster

    crashmaster ow, my balls!

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    pull the secondaries, takes all of 30 minutes, its stupid simple, just do it and see what you get.:lurk
    #22
  3. azkiwi

    azkiwi message in a bottle

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    Not like its going to hurt anything, and its reversible in another 30 minutes. Just be sure and stuff a clean rag in there so you don't drop a screw down the hole!
    #23
  4. crashmaster

    crashmaster ow, my balls!

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    :thumb

    Also please keep us updated, will be very interested to see if it fixes your stailling problems.
    #24
  5. Gluaisrothaí

    Gluaisrothaí Feckin' gobshite

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    I'll take care of it in the morning and let you know. Thanks for the encouragement ;)

    KL
    #25
  6. Corni

    Corni Adventurer

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    I quess this thread is closest to my problem, didn't want to start new. Anyway, my bike 2009 990 Adventure with only 2000km/1250mi driven is having hard time keeping it running when started after it's been sitting overnight outside. It starts nicely but runs low rev and stalls few times before it's warm. When it get's warm it runs nicely, no problems. I thought that these FI engines doesn't need choke, but this one certainly would need one.

    Also when engine shut's down it does it with metallic "clank" noise. It sounds like someone threw spanner to block the crankshaft. :lol3
    Is this noise normal when engine stalls?

    I'm thinking that does it have something to do with humidity because I used to cover my bike with bike cover. It's advertized to be breathable though..

    Anyone else have this kind of issue? Any help greatly apprreciated.
    #26
  7. Gluaisrothaí

    Gluaisrothaí Feckin' gobshite

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    The kickback noise you hear when the engine stops is the sprag clutch engaging on the starter and sending it spinning backwards.

    Anyway- my issue is 85% resolved after a trip to the dealer in San Francisco. Apparently the '09 has a different ECU than the earlier bikes which created some problems trying to get the map right. There was also a ambient air temp sensor issue when it was first set up at the dealer which caused terrible stalling, low idle and no throttle response at low revs/small throttle openings. So for example if you tried to blip the throttle on a downchange it would bog.

    The fix so far has been with the dealer- I haven't pulled the secondary butterflies but I swear I will next weekend. Be persistent and ask them to call Scuderia West if they're really stuck


    KL
    #27
  8. CHRIS_D

    CHRIS_D Been here awhile

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    Helmet head,

    Since there's a idle stop screw on each throttle body, did you need to mess with the back cylinder's screw at all? How has it been running since?

    My bike has been stalling too. I have managed to get it to do it consistently. I have found when running 5k RPM or more, by rolling off the throttle and immediatelly pulling in the clutch that she will usually stall 6 out of 10 times. It's like the computer can't compensate for such a quick RPM drop after being under load.:huh However, she seems to be fine if you don't pull in the clutch and just roll off the throttle at any RPM.

    Do me a favor, try to do this and see if yours stalls.

    Crashmaster,

    Since you removed the seconds have you had any more stalls?
    #28
  9. Gluaisrothaí

    Gluaisrothaí Feckin' gobshite

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    It honestly didn't make any difference to power delivery or stalling. I did notice while I was in there that the secondaries are not like typical primary butterflies in that they have a large circumferential clearance when fully closed; more than enough to allow the engine to rev to 5000+ RPM. So I'm thinking that unless there's a an indirect effect of removing the secondaries (such as the ECU gets confused and increases the idle) that this may not be the fix for stalling.

    Of course some have seen stalling go away around the same time as the secondaries were removed, but given the way issues come and go with these ECUs the removal of the secondaries may not be causal.
    #29
  10. mesopotamia

    mesopotamia Been here awhile

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    Hum... I'm reading this thread (and so many others) and I feel sorry and worried at the same time... I just don't understand how come a bike seems to have consistently stalling problems over the years and how come both the manifacturer and the dealers can't solve the problem. I feel sorry for owners that have to bring their bike half a dozen of times to the garage to try to solve the same problem. I feel sorry for guys that cannot just have fun on their bike because they're to concentrate on observing the reaction of their machine and trying to understand the cause of the problem. And I worry at the same time because I'm picking up my new 09 990 Adventure next week...
    #30
  11. azkiwi

    azkiwi message in a bottle

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    Classic expectation management!

    You'll fit in well here - welcome to the Crush! :D
    #31
  12. FalloutMan

    FalloutMan Been here awhile

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    Has anyone ever installed a Power Commander (the 5?) yet and seen if it cured the stalling problems? I was thinkin that when I pick up a 990 this winter to throw on a PC V and autotune with some new exhaust.
    #32
  13. racer49

    racer49 Been here awhile

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    The dealer should have told you the truth, that they just have not purchased the new diagnostic tool to install new maps . I have an 09 adv r I purchased in late April and had the Akras installed right then, runs fine no problems. I purchased the bike from another state and then asked my local dealer if they could work on my bike , install maps etc. They told me that the 07-08 FI is different from the 09 FI and that his tool is for the 07-08 bikes and that he could not map my 09, he did not renew his LC8 franchise and did not see a reason to purchase the new tool.
    #33
  14. MookieBlaylock

    MookieBlaylock Long timer

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    seems tuneboy will do the trick and allows for loading the akra map and tweaking that. PCV for the superduke uses the same plug i think...it's amazing people buy a $12k bike and don't bother addressing the fueling if it needs it
    #34
  15. FalloutMan

    FalloutMan Been here awhile

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    Yeah I've noticed that every adv owner never replaces the ECU with a PC of some sort after an exhaust change but every sportbike rider I've ever known buys a PC as their first upgrade. I cant find a PCV for a superduke anywhere though for USA, hopefully it'll be out for the SD or specifically the ADV this winter.
    #35
  16. racer49

    racer49 Been here awhile

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    I did not explain myself very well now that I have read my post. The dealer I bought my bike from installed the Akras and remapped with the Akra map. Bike runs good if a little rich and could use some more precise adjusting of the FI. Waiting for the PC V and auto tune module to come out (probably never happen) or eventually get the tune boy.
    #36
  17. FalloutMan

    FalloutMan Been here awhile

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    after googling I found a dude in the uk that stated that he had a PCV for that POS kawi ZX14 here that apparently works.
    Would anyone be willing to take a picture of their ECU plug so I could see if I could find a matching PCV plug? As long as the plugs match there shouldnt be a problem with using a PCV for a different model. The only issue I can think of is finding a map to start out with thatd actually run well enough to let the Autotune to work its magic. According to the feedback that some people are stating, you have to hold the throttle at different RPMs to let the Autotune actually tune the motor. Reports are coming in that if you just normally ride with it in itll take about a month for the Autotune to calculate out a great map.
    #37
  18. crashmaster

    crashmaster ow, my balls!

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    Quite a few folks have gone round after round with KTM on this issue. The explanation from KTM is similar to this from the HOW

    Engine stalls when clutch is pulled in ~5,000 RPM:

    The fuel injection computer shuts off fuel to the injectors when the throttle is closed at 5k and above. This can cause the engine to stall if the computer doesn't sense the clutch is pulled in at this time.



    Andreas Berner, KTM Factory Rep: "When you pull the clutch, do you have one or more fingers behind the lever, and what position of the lever adjustment do you use?
    Because there is an electrical switch telling the ECU that the driver pulled the clutch lever and with the lowest position of the lever and a finger between the lever and the handlebar it is possible that the switch is not activated!
    So the ECU doesn´t know that the clutch is open and can not react by giving the engine enought fuel for idlespeed, this can also cause a stalling engine and is very hard to detect for the dealer, because there is simply no "failure".



    However, I have bypassed the clutch switch, taken out the secondary butterflies, and bumped up the idle to 1600 and I still get the stalling. Oftentimes it will be accompanied by a low idle condition where the bike will sputter at around 500 to 1000 rpm before it dies.


    If you figure it out, let us know....... :rofl
    #38
  19. MookieBlaylock

    MookieBlaylock Long timer

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    use tuneboy software,check delete o2 sensor box or buy the resistor plug(s) dynojet makes, slightly richen the bottom end and idle of the akra map,plug sas system and you are done
    #39
  20. mudpie

    mudpie n00b

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    Hi guys,

    I am looking at a '08 990 Adv w/ Akra's and am worried about the stalling issue. Are there known stalling cases for the '08 model?

    Thanks!
    #40