790 Adventure R Suspension Mods

Discussion in 'Parallel Universe (790/890)' started by windblown101, Jul 5, 2019.

  1. turbofan790

    turbofan790 Adventurer

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    Ah, that makes more sense. So essentially the 43mm would be modified by just changing the shim stack a bit? Definitely interested in increased bottoming resistance still, but perhaps a closed cartridge conversion is still the best path since along with that you gain adjustability, as the base forks have no adjustment at all.
    #81
  2. Torque

    Torque Been here awhile

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    No I would design a new mid valve as long as there is room. Let me do some homework and will get with you in a bit.
    #82
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  3. turbofan790

    turbofan790 Adventurer

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    OK no problem. No rush on account of me, as I mentioned in my email I may not be able to do anything quite right away. But if you have a way to upgrade the S forks a bit, I think there's a strong market for it.
    #83
  4. SoilSampleDave

    SoilSampleDave Dr. Zaius was right!

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    Closed cartridge forks are generally speaking not ideal for offroading, short of full on racing, although with enough money, anything can work.
    #84
  5. chippertheripper

    chippertheripper motorcycle junkie Supporter

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    I don’t know about that.
    I’ve had open chambers, closed chambers, 4cs and now these xplor. The CC were my favorite, all done up, but these xplor have been the best out the box.
    02, ymmv, all that happy horsehay applies.
    #85
  6. sherloc

    sherloc Been here awhile

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    I

    I’d be interested in improving the S as well. Thx!
    #86
  7. SoilSampleDave

    SoilSampleDave Dr. Zaius was right!

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    Yeah, if you throw some money at them and are a fast/aggressive enough rider, CCs can be good. But if you say anything good about 4CS forks, I’m going to assume you have been day drinking.
    #87
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  8. chippertheripper

    chippertheripper motorcycle junkie Supporter

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    Lol, they went back 3x before they were “tolerable”, but they really have such a narrow focus, it’s impossible to make them as good all around.
    #88
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  9. Torque

    Torque Been here awhile

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    Ok checked out the specs and the pistons are the same size as the 1090 meaning the cartridges are the same diameter and very likely same piston cause WP uses parts over and over. That means highly likely I can re-design the mid valve and get you a good improvement. But if you are riding hard, I would opt. for cartridges. or Replace with open bath 48's with fork lugs off the R model might be possible. Or find an Xplor set that fits straight away.
    How much do you weigh?
    #89
  10. Torque

    Torque Been here awhile

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    We had the closed cartridge kyb SSS working as good as the open chamber in off road and ECross last year. We were able to get them just as light in initial stroke even. Took a few shots but once you have the formula it is same same although a couple custom parts were thrown in the mix. For the Worcs at higher speeds and the moto tracks they use the CC was a better fork at pro level though.
    #90
  11. turbofan790

    turbofan790 Adventurer

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    They use the same size piston in the 43mm Apex fork as in the 48mm unit on the 1090? Crazy.

    I currently weigh 200 lbs, but will be in the 170 range shortly so that's what I'd be planning for (part of the reason why i'm not doing suspension right now haha)

    I'm probably 80% satisfied with the stock S setup. It's a bit harsh at times but works well enough. My only complaint is lack of bottoming resistance. Coming down from CNF towards silverado, I bottomed it on those bars that cross the road at least once. I don't go super fast but just gaining some bottoming resistance would be fantastic. I'd also be OK with a touch more travel but I don't know if that's possible.

    I looked at going with R takeoffs but they're still very expensive. Only set of takeoffs I found were about $2200 USD plus shipping from Canada, and that's honestly a great price. Beyond that, I don't want the R shock (would rather Tractive or, at lower cost, Hyperpro) but of course nobody will want to sell the R fork separately. I figure I could do the $800 shock from Hyperpro and spend another few hundred on the fork and end up with something fully satisfactory to how I ride.
    #91
  12. Torque

    Torque Been here awhile

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    The pistons in the 1090 and 790S are small. I believe the 85sx have used the same size and a bit larger than that over the years.
    Your spring rates at .66kg and 11.7kg Hmm. Not a bad rate regarding the forks at 170lbs for the type of riding your doing. So when you are at 170 if you are still bottoming add some oil if needed to give a bit more bottoming resistance and you may be good. Not sure on the rear till you get the sag numbers at 170lbs . KTM calls for 55mm sag with static around 20mm.
    I would take on another dial in project but already have two members I am working with. Maybe someone in a cold state could send me a set of suspension when they cant ride and I will dial them in with stock components free. The rub is that's my busy season so expect me to have them for a 6 weeks.
    On another note we are today ordering a set of Cone Valve forks from Husky to modify and see if we can get them as good as what we have.
    We have dialed the AER but are unable to get top of stroke compliance wanted for Ecross.
    We sprung the Aer and that is working quite well and we will use those in the Worcs this weekend in Pro II.
    We are using the oem 50mm husky shock even though Husky has provided us with two Trax shocks. Rider is in love with the set up on the Oem shock and will not relent. Working too well.
    #92
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  13. kubcat

    kubcat Been here awhile Supporter

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    Do you have a reference for the KTM 790 sag numbers you quoted? I cannot find anything specific to the 790R in the repair manual or the owners manual.
    #93
  14. turbofan790

    turbofan790 Adventurer

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    Sounds awesome. If turnaround time would be quicker outside the busy season I could drop mine off pretty much whenever, I'm in orange county so not far away, but again not really in a rush, and OK to wait til next year
    #94
  15. Torque

    Torque Been here awhile

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    Keep in mind it is a suggested sag. They are just testers like anybody else and who knows who is riding the bike or do they just do it mathematically?
    I have a dealer look it up for me.
    #95
  16. Torque

    Torque Been here awhile

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    If you give me 6 weeks you can drop the suspension anytime. I would be setting up for 170lbs so using stock springs. If you want a custom Variable rate rear spring wound I will be happy to order one for you but that is on you, at my cost. Takes 6 weeks to wind a spring. The spring on the S is shorter than the R by 10mm. I have the springs in stock for the R model.
    Forks springs are good to go. The bike will be better even at higher weight but not optimum till you hit 170lbs.
    #96
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  17. Brilloman

    Brilloman Been here awhile

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    I was told 82mm race sag and 30mm free sag for the Xplor Pro shock.
    #97
  18. Torque

    Torque Been here awhile

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    That has more travel than the s model. I believe it is 240mm travel R model divided by 3 80mm sag 200mm for S model divided by 3 is 67mm sag 55 seems low but gotta rider it to see.
    #98
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  19. turbofan790

    turbofan790 Adventurer

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    Would you recommend a progressive rate spring?

    Do we know anything about this shock? It's a bit sproingy but not horrible. Seems a little light on rebound. It sure looks cheap though, stamped steel body and such. My thought was to modify the forks but replace the shock with something from Hyperpro or Tractive. Do you have any thoughts in this regard? Is it possible to increase front travel at all while it's apart?

    BTW you're not doing this for free haha you need to get paid. Thanks for working with me/us.
    #99
  20. Torque

    Torque Been here awhile

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    Definitely variable rate spring. A spring that has a gradual rate increase. Many I will not mention names are light for a very short distance and then go straight to full rate.
    Well I many times rebuild that type of shock even though many of them are not rebuildable. But without the adjusters you have to nail the set up internally as you are unable to fine tune with clickers.
    A diy guy like Ronski that is a little touched and disassembles his shock daily could get it good. But even then without the high speed adjuster you cant dial the shock in for real light soft work and then set it up for high speed two track externally. Another thing to take into account is they hold less oil so if you are riding hard you can overheat the shock. Ronski meaured his at something like 230 degrees with the R shock.
    All that said with a variable rate spring and re-valve the performance would be considerably better.
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