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790 Reported Clutch failures - My 12k mile examination

Discussion in 'Parallel World (790/890)' started by windblown101, Nov 10, 2019.

  1. Velociraptor

    Velociraptor TrackBum Super Supporter

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    Pulled my clutch cover after enlarging the oil jet to 1/64 inch. Wanted to make sure the oil jet was staying put. All good and there did seem to be a bit more oil than before. Could be my imagination though.
    1coolbanana likes this.
  2. 1coolbanana

    1coolbanana Long timer

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    This is what the 15 mm + (probably more) freeplay looks like at the lever.
    I like the looser feel compared to the hydraulic clutches and the take up closer to the bar.
    Just my personal preference.

    Mud Bucket, braaap!, merc16 and 3 others like this.
  3. gsuks

    gsuks Long timer

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    oil circuit 790 adventure.1.PNG oil circuit 790 adventure.2.PNG
    Snowq, Velociraptor, kubcat and 2 others like this.
  4. kubcat

    kubcat Been here awhile Supporter

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    Upstate NY
    :doh RTFM strikes agian:fpalm
    Velociraptor likes this.
  5. brad21

    brad21 We have a pool... and a pond.

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    Took my wife's S model into the shop the other day to have some knobbies and a high-fender kit installed as well as have them check on some weird shifting behavior she's noticed. Had them take a look at her oil jet as well since mine on my R was clogged.

    Verdict: hers was clogged too, clutch plates were dry. Her bike has 3800 miles on it... :doh
  6. gsuks

    gsuks Long timer

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    regarding the jet drilling

    my tech talked to the main tech guy at ktm in Holland
    about the drilling,
    he did not advice it as it might make the bike lose valuable oil pressure elsewhere in the engine!!(there haven't been any reports of clutch problems here in Holland)

    my tech said,
    but what if we run into clutch problems
    the ktm guy said file the claim and he will look into it.

    during the 1000km service my tech took the clutch cover off and inspected everything it was nice and moist in there and all was good
  7. GodFatherOfChill

    GodFatherOfChill Adventurer

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    May 2, 2014
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    Anyone ever heard of the Righteous Stunt clutch? https://www.righteousstuntmetal.com/

    I have one on my Yamaha WR250R. On my WR it reduced the amount of force required to activate the clutch by a substantial amount. It does so by changing the angle of the clutch cable at the perch. As far as my novice mechanic brain understands, this is a universal fit part that can go on any motorcycle with a cable clutch.

    I was wondering if using this righteous stunt clutch is in anyway a safer alternative versus the Camel ADV clutch?

    Even if it isn’t any “safer”, is there any feedback about using the righteous stunt clutch over the Camel ADV clutch?

    I have already purchased the Camel ADV clutch, but I have yet to install it because of all the back-and-forth information about free play settings.
  8. kubcat

    kubcat Been here awhile Supporter

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    The talk about free play is independent of which lever you use (stock or camel). Once properly installed, the camel lever will be able to be adjusted for proper free play, just as the stock lever is.

    Regarding the RST lever, from reading their website, it should work to achieve the same results as the camel lever (greater leverage and longer engagement zone), but at the handlebar end. Personally, I would want to see the geometry laid out in a diagram by RST so I better understand the leverage ratios they claim to achieve. Another thing to note is that the Camel lever is MUCH less expensive. But if you haven't yet replaced your stock levers, and plan to with shortys, then this would be more cost effective, provided the RST angles on our bikes produce the claimed results. Of course like me, you already bought the camel lever, so just go ahead and install it and ride.
  9. kzeb

    kzeb Been here quite some time

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    I don't get the fuzz about the clutchcable freeplay at all... we used to set it all the time before the hydraulic ones came to be the norm..
    Set it ones and check it when it starts to feel tight or whenever you feel for it what's the big deal :hmmmmm
    The free play should be the same in the wire no matter what lever used in the two ends of it...
    What am I missing :confused Feel free to enlighten me :lurk
    ramirin, Venturer and TrailTrauma like this.
  10. sideup

    sideup Been here awhile

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    I was out playing around yesterday on a gravel / dirt road on my 790R I received in December. It was only the second time I put it in Rally Mode and I was doing some hard accelerations and seeing the difference between rally settings 1 through 9. After about 5 or 6 hard accelerations I noticed a nice clutch plate smell that I have never have before. I check my cable play before each ride and it was the recommended amount. Has anyone discussed that the clutch on the 790R just cannot handle the sudden instant hit that happens in Rally mode and overtime over heats the plates leading to a failure? I was not dumping the clutch was just a quick roll on of the throttle. I have never experience this on many of the other KTMs I have owned. I read somewhere the Chris Birch put in stronger springs with the Camel long arm, I am sure his normal mode is Rally mode . Very quick - Rally Mode.
  11. TrailTrauma

    TrailTrauma Nemophilist

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    Is it possible that due to the increased friction zone that the Camel or any aftermarket, lengthened arm affords could be causing the plates to be in contact longer as they spin while disengaging, causing added friction? Whereas OEM is quickly disengaged, but an aftermarket, longer arm takes longer to get to full disengagement.
  12. 1coolbanana

    1coolbanana Long timer

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    Has the oil jet been checked and or drilled?
    The recommended amount of free play is not enough.
    nibby likes this.
  13. 1coolbanana

    1coolbanana Long timer

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    Just did 1500 km over the last couple days, outback desert hwy's to mountain passes, ridge tops and gorges, mostly dirt.
    The clutch has been really slick, quiet and smooth since drilling to 0.5 mm.

    Will pull the cover this afternoon and report back what it looks like in there.
    Crusty the Clown and ramirin like this.
  14. ramirin

    ramirin Ready to push

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    Within my 1500km test ride before winter I didn't know anything about any issues with the bike and just rode it in same trails where I take my 500. Summer was very dry and 790 run just fine on karoos, after first 2 hours tested different drive modes then wen't to rally-rally. Did plenty of clutch slipping on rocks, wot acceleration on straights, clutch blip power wheelies - the usual stuff. Nothing wrong with the bike exept it was missing the exhaust sound.

    Now that I have read all these stories and problems with it - I'm hesitant if I should ever run it again. And same goes with my tpi. And every other Ktm I have ever owned.

    @sideup How can you smell your clutch plates? They live inside engine case that is sealed area and any vapors go to airbox and are fed to cylinders and then travel through cat & exhaust into the air - must be pretty strong smell or sensitive nose..

    @TrailTrauma I think the only way to destroy healthy clutch is extended slipping in high revs (ie. cable too tight or too much fluid in reservoir). Even if you notice some slip on high revs you can usually get away with it by slightly adjusting. Many of my rides end up with my finger just not being able to pull clutch anymore while bike is still just fine.
    kzeb, Toddv, nibby and 1 other person like this.
  15. sideup

    sideup Been here awhile

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    @sideup How can you smell your clutch plates? They live inside engine case that is sealed area and any vapors go to airbox and are fed to cylinders and then travel through cat & exhaust into the air - must be pretty strong smell or sensitive nose..

    Assuming there are case breather hoses. Well I not sure what else would smell like that. it is a unique smell. I owned a Ural for a short time so I know what hot clutch plates smell like. :) Actually have a bad sense of smell having Asthma.

    Ramirin - yeah you better stop riding it right now.
  16. sideup

    sideup Been here awhile

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    Well that might be a good theory as I do have the camel arm on my bike.
  17. Crusty the Clown

    Crusty the Clown Nutup-or-Shutup Supporter

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    Hurry up! :)
  18. Toddv

    Toddv Long timer

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    Brakes pads and clutches are made out of basically the same stuff and produce the same smell when overheated. Were you using the brakes heavily in between pulls? Take a whiff of your oil, if it was the clutch you'll know, but like said it's unlikely you'd smell it because the crankcase vent feeds back into the airbox and vapors are sucked back into the engine.
    Venturer likes this.
  19. sideup

    sideup Been here awhile

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    I was going up hill so not really hard on the brakes but I wouldn’t rule that out. Thanks for the input. I will check the oil for the smell and just pull the cover for a look.

    update 3/5/20 - pull cover clutch looks fine - nice oil coating on everything so I stopped there.
    Toddv likes this.
  20. ramirin

    ramirin Ready to push

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    I had crankcase breather with only filter in my 690 and once almost burned my clutch on swamp where engine gets pretty hot and had too much liquid on reservoir I still couldn't smell anything else than warm oil. But the oil smell was strong enough for whole group to look suspiciously around to spot the source on next break.