950 SE Subframe Weakness !

Discussion in 'Dakar champion (950/990)' started by Oldfatbeerman, Aug 6, 2009.

  1. Oldfatbeerman

    Oldfatbeerman Enroute to a PUB

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    While going over my 950 SE after a good clean post last weekends ride I discovered some movement in the luggage rack on the rear tail piece and dismantled the rear end to investigate

    I found this broken subframe where the rack / passenger rails mount
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

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    [​IMG]

    I suggest all SE owners who have luggage racks and who use their SE's as adventure bikes with a load on , keep an eye on the sub frame , I caught this one at home , It could have been a lot more expensive and inconvenient had it failed a long way from home . I will get an engineering qualified mate to do a repair that will be able to take the beating I tend to give my equipment .

    I have my 640 Adv in the shed in bits fixing a broken rear Sub frame on it too ! :eek1 I might have to take up a less demanding pass time :1drink.:lol3

    Yep , I ride hard and fast , luggage or no luggage. Breakages are all just part and parcel of the fun . :wink:

    Cheers Alan
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    #1
  2. summitdog

    summitdog It's an Azawakh

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    It is my understanding that the subframe is not designed to carry more than 22 lbs of luggage weight. How much would you estimate your fully loaded luggage to weigh during your last adventure?

    Scotty
    #2
  3. pipster

    pipster KTM 950 se

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    #3
  4. Gimme 2

    Gimme 2 wheels , with nobs

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    ugly
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  5. zenKTM

    zenKTM -

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    bummer

    have to keep an eye on 'em eh
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  6. HOT DAMN!

    HOT DAMN! ♪ ♪ ♪

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    No problems yet and I have over 50lbs. easily on this trip. It has been dirt napped loaded like this as well.

    [​IMG]
    #6
  7. Oldfatbeerman

    Oldfatbeerman Enroute to a PUB

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    I don't think it is the weight I am carrying as much as my inability to restrict my speed and combined with the terrain (last two rides have been on steep , rough terrain ), the suspension often reaches it's limit of travel which puts stress on all the components........... which has resulted in the weakest point in the sub frame breaking in this instance , I needed to increase the rear spring preload to stop the rear bottoming as often , I have done so this morning , but I will have to wait until the repairs are done to test the resistance to bottoming now .

    Does anyone know the Material specifications ( alloy grades and / or mixes ) for the rear sub frame , I would like to match the welding material specs for the most strength and longevity of the repair !

    Cheers Alan
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  8. pipster

    pipster KTM 950 se

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    Alan

    Send Vern an email and ask him what he used ...He did say a the time that he had used some really high grade alloy to make the box section up and he would also be able to give you some feed back on how he found it to weld ...

    He's a top bloke who makes very high end panniers for a living ...http://www.projectvnd.com/
    #8
  9. Oldfatbeerman

    Oldfatbeerman Enroute to a PUB

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    Thanks , I'll see how I go with talking to a mate that was welding up alloy boats for a living , he should be able to steer me right , if not I'll ping Vern an email .
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  10. HickOnACrick

    HickOnACrick Groovinator Super Supporter

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    This weekend, the subframe on my SE snapped.

    I just put the Blackdog Cycleworks rear rack on, and mounted a 2gallon Rotopax.

    I was on a 200 mile ride through the desert, hitting some high-speed stuff, lots of double-track and some fun whoops. The last few hundred feet of the ride, and I heard something flapping.

    Broken subframe :hair

    [​IMG]


    I need to find a welder today who can repair the damage as well as reinforce the subframe.

    For what it's worth, one gallon of gasoline weighs between 6 and 7 lbs. The Rotopax itself is 5 lbs. The rear rack probably weighs 3lbs.

    That puts the total weight between 20 and 22 lbs and the f#cking thing snapped.
    #10
  11. ABYSS

    ABYSS KTM

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    for the guys that have loads of luggage on the the easy fix is get a ADV the SE is a warrior not a off road goldwing. :rofl



    As for you Hick thats shouldnt have happened as that is a nominal weight. Sorry ....

    Maybe this is a CJRACER mod in the making a new solid Billet subframe? HINT HINT HINT:evil
    #11
  12. HickOnACrick

    HickOnACrick Groovinator Super Supporter

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    Talked with my dealer today, they were a bit surprised that it snapped - I think they were doubtful that I only had about 20 lbs on it. However, I have witnesses.

    Also, based on some worn areas around the snapped area, it appears the subframe actually cracked weeks ago. Up until this weekend, I had not carried more than a couple spare tubes on the back. We also noted 2 more cracks in the subframe in the same area as Oldfatbeerman's.

    Hopefully KTM is going to cover this.

    In the meantime, I found a welder to repair and reinforce the cracked subframe; so hopefully I can make it to the KTM rally this week after all.

    If he does good work, I will post pics and his contact info. It's hard finding an aluminum welder who is willing to do small jobs well.
    #12
  13. crankshaft

    crankshaft Guns are for pussies

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    I've been to a few ADV events and its not just the luggage.... some of the boys need to go on a diet:lol3
    #13
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  14. zenKTM

    zenKTM -

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    that's why they're on motos in the first place right and not pushies :D
    #14
  15. HickOnACrick

    HickOnACrick Groovinator Super Supporter

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    I had only 2 days to get the subframe fixed before leaving for Riggins for the KTM rally. It is incredibly hard to find an aluminum welder willing to do a small job well. My dealer recommended a guy and he was willing to do the work. Cosmetically, there are some blemishes, but I had him pushed for time, and he was the only guy willing to take on the job:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Repaired and reinforced.

    Now I need to figure out a way to re-mount the rear fender without drilling holes. Right now it is held up with wire-ties, which coincidentally held together through some fairly gnarly riding this weekend in Idaho.
    #15
  16. Brown Dog

    Brown Dog North Georgia Dual Sportr

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    any other ideas and / or pics ??
    #16
  17. HickOnACrick

    HickOnACrick Groovinator Super Supporter

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    My subframe snapped again...this time where it had not been reinforced. The load was around 20 lbs and the riding was aggressive. I spoke with KTM, and the gentleman I spoke to on the phone recommended no more than 10 lbs of cargo, and in fact, recommended no cargo be carried on the SE subframe.

    They have been good enough to warranty the subframe, but said they will not do so in the future as I have now been warned:deal

    Regardless, when I receive the new subframe, I will have it reinforced in its entirety as I do want to carry small loads (less than 20 lbs) and use the bike as an ADV bike.

    The guy that did the welding did a good job and I still have his number if anyone is interested. I think he would welcome the business right now.
    #17
  18. David37

    David37 Been here awhile

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    Looks like he did a good job on your welding and reinforcement brackets. Glad to hear KTM took care of you.
    #18
  19. zenKTM

    zenKTM -

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    this is probably a stupid question but i'll ask it anyway.....
    is there anyway of fitting a 950/990 subframe and using that rear end set-up, or is it too much of a pain in the ass/impossible.....

    i've got a 1 month solo ADV ride on the SE booked in at x-mas - i'm gunna reinforce the subframe b4 then for preventative maintenance

    plus i've put it down enough times already with luggage to stress it a bit :puke1

    Al, how did your subframe reinforcing go?? got any pics??
    #19
  20. ADVJake

    ADVJake ***** dweller

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    Subframe differences:
    You can see there is alot more bracing on the adventure frame. they will fit as the main frames are the same, but not so sure about the SE rear fender.

    [​IMG]
    #20