A World Of Dirt...On A 500exc

Discussion in 'Ride Reports - Epic Rides' started by rtwpaul, Apr 14, 2019.

  1. rtwpaul

    rtwpaul out riding... Supporter

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    I don't think you are the only one, as seen below, the are a great number of inmates whose only social media IS ADVrider, and as for you likes, always nice to get and they count for double for sure especially when you chime in on occasion

    I hear you on the quality, I used to read loads of them but just don't anymore, just too vanilla! One comment I did read a while back somewhere about travel writing is to NEVER use the word 'THEN' at the start of a sentence...for example - Then we went here...Then we did this.

    The writer made a solid point of saying that's the point when I tune out and look for something a little more (to quote you) freakin' rodeo!

    Thank you for the kind words, as I have said before, I'm lucky to stand in some very cool places and record them for you guys

    Thanks for the likes in other places too, I do recognize them, I get you on the photos vs video thing. I think if the writers of these reports could see more interaction, not necessarily comments but numbers beside a like here and a total number of hits it might a little more motivational for the writers to continue.

    I know @michnus mentioned this a while back and nearly quit his RR because there was no interaction. The mods have a lot to do with that, letting them determine what they think is static (as they call it) and good interaction with back and forth questions.

    I honestly think it would be nice if there was a way the writer could control their own report and be the one to moderate it themself.

    Views are on the front page if you look at the forum on a computer, for me they don't show on my phone, but that could be ten people opening the report multiple times, it does show unique hits, thats what impressions are.

    The good thing about knowing the impressions even if you eliminate the comments, you can tell what is working and what your readers like, read, share etc by a simple number that is generated by each unique view.

    A plain view count doesn't tell you that.

    That would be good, another metric is when you get the most traffic, I know on ADVrider weekends are good for posting on RR's for me, but its an educated guess, on IG all days are equal.

    Just trying to help @Rudy see patterns and ways to increase the numbers in various areas of the forum

    I think you're right for sure currently about RR's due to COVID, can't tell how much I was looking forward to this year's riding. Right now I should be in New Zealand or Australia and trying to catch you up on the 'stans, Mongolia, the BAM and the RoB, South Korea, Japan...but I'm in Phoenix eating a cheese sandwich, not really as exciting!



    Reports will keep coming for sure.

    But as mentioned earlier the views could be made up from a dozen of so readers, I guess what I'm getting at here is are other people getting put off reporting here because they don't see the numbers and want a bigger audience or think they deserve a bigger audience? For me, I could care less, I link my post to here, FB, IG, and my website for those who don't want to read past all the additional comments

    Isn't that what used to happen in the old format, IIRC there was a star system, 5 good 1 bad, I like the trending idea...@rudy/ @Baldy what do you think? Doable?

    I get it, all of what you are saying, that's why I cringe to do video because I would become 'one of those guys'

    I think the big reason ADVrider is such a success is that @Baldy made a point of no ads for years to keep the site clean, sadly FB and IG (same company) do the opposite and uses this to their advantage.

    I did make a suggestion a while back to have Ride Reports have another section, ones that were longer more ongoing in years rather than weeks, like there is a day-tripping section, how about the polar opposite riders who don't have a home...I think it ended up on the cutting room floor.
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  2. rtwpaul

    rtwpaul out riding... Supporter

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    Awesome reply, came in after the others so you get a singular response :fpalm.

    The reason I made the post was to help out @Rudy to get an idea what you guys think, want, and need out of a forum in this little corner of ADVrider how or if it could be made better and increase numbers

    I think you hit the nail on the head with your reply and covered what most think but might not say or want to say.

    Doing a ride report is like a part-time job sometimes but to me, its just one part of the journey, and on occasion helps me wind down at the end of a days ride...kind of like chatting to family
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  3. flying.moto

    flying.moto Earthbound Misfit, I Supporter

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    Paul,

    a similar thought you asked about on the previous page crossed my mind when ADVrider added the “like” button. i still have a love/hate relationship with it. to me it is a “that was really nice/cool/rad” kudos to the OP. Which is great! The next level is a reply. I personally think YT is losing ground. too many ads and it is a bit tasking on the data... i personally only use it to host videos i post here and an occasional DIY hint search. IG now. why its “statistically” bloating. because general public does not want to read! Millennials. majority don’t like to read nowadays and want to see a visual “feed” much rather than even open a magazine, let alone read a book. This is exactly why IG will have more action and statistics for shows/views/clicks/likes. if that photo you posted flashed on my IG feed when i accidentally scrolled past the dreaded “and now we bring you content you might like” portion of said feed, it adds to the statistics of views, but did i even notice the photo let alone the story behind it?

    its all about advertising though. some riders still gain meaningful sponsors via IG tagging. i know a few personally. or at very least a couch. it’s a decent platform. how do you turn up the action here now? is it quality or quantity that you are seeking?
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  4. flying.moto

    flying.moto Earthbound Misfit, I Supporter

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    I relive my ride while writing my RRs. thats the second best treat to telling the story in person over a beer or a whiskey. Latest outing i tried to do it live. day to day. it seems like a delay of day or two is best for me...
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  5. Scribe

    Scribe £Bob£

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    Interesting topic you bring up. Speaking for me, and me only, I've read so many ride reports (joined this site 16 years ago) that it takes a really interesting and well crafted ride report to hold my attention. The first time I see a food pic in a report I'm suspect, the second time I'm out. And if the OP is on a GS, 1290 or similar and not doing anything particularly interesting and heroic, I'm also out. Just not interested.

    I think people vastly underestimate how difficult it is to create good content. That goes for writing, shooting pics and video. It's all about knowing what constitutes a good tale and ruthlessly cutting everything else. As they told us in journalism school, you can't be afraid to kill your babies. Too many ride reports end up feeling like vacation diaries, too few take us somewhere and teach us something. I'm posting this in your thread so you know which side your work falls on. :thumb
  6. flying.moto

    flying.moto Earthbound Misfit, I Supporter

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    agreed! every time i parse my media i shot at the end of the day i tell myself “ruthlessly! delete ruthlessly!!” :2gunsi’ve never been “taught” but i do agree.

    >end hijack. :photog
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  7. skibum69

    skibum69 slave to gravity Super Supporter

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    Good topic to bring up Paul, I can totally relate when I look back at my own ADV reading habits and how I look at other social media. I stopped FB a couple of years ago, I am on IG but rarely post and only look at it on an irregular basis. ADV, BMWMOA and ridetherock.com are forums I'm on daily. These days on ADV I only look at the threads I'm subscribed to and the rare occasions I look at new posts I see very little that interests me. I don't typically do YT unless I catch a link from something else or I'm looking for something instructional.

    I agree that the quality of content has gone downhill over the last number of years but the amount of content has gone through the roof. My own RR's probably are nothing exciting for most folks so I'm part of the problem. But then again I find plenty of the backyard wandering RR's fun if the writer is a reasonable story teller.

    I like the idea of a place for the truly great RR's to be located and separate from the average. How many ways can you break up RR's to make more palatable locations?

    What are the reasons for decreased interest? I'm not sure, I owned a beer themed forum based in structure on ADV that had good interest for a number of years when our beer club was operating but after a time there were only a couple of us on there and then there was no traffic so we put it on ice. I couldn't figure out why the interest died as the interest in craft beer etc ramped up. I tried to get the home brew crowd to use it and they did for a bit but then all seemed to migrate to an FB page. TO me it looks as if interest in forums in general has diminished as I look at forums I've been on for awhile. I see core members but less new growth except for ADV but with the number of inmates there will always be new stuff.

    I think part of it is the ever decreasing attention span of everyone.
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  8. ricochetrider

    ricochetrider MotoMojo

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    Nice topic for conversation. I personally have fallen off a bit in some of my forum involvement, not only here but on the “other” motorcycle forum I used to frequent all the time. I have a couple RRs I follow currently here- but honestly it’s too difficult to keep up with all the content on this site and beyond that the (as mentioned) quality of the ride reports has either fallen off or everyone’s doing almost the exact same shit on the exact same bikes. Makes for one massively impenetrable wall of blah. if people we’re riding RTW on old Indians or Harleys or Vincents or Britbikes then I’d be all over that- because I’m mostly into vintage bikes- just speaking strictly for me.

    Here at advrider, some of my backing off also has to do with the new format. I can skip the adverts easily enough- tho they are annoying, but all the “articles” on the new front page I find distracting rather than them adding anything really meaningful or interesting. Tho I do occasionally read them and comment, this is simply one distraction I would prefer not to have to wade through.

    For my part I’m only really interested in vintage bikes but as a friend and fan of photography I follow your stuff where ever you post. I’m
    Currently following another RR, the guy who rode the Honda 125 from Spain to Mongolia and back. I also mess around in Old’s Cool and peruse the flea market periodically.

    My interest in photography has led me to some other photography forums so there’s that split too. I only have X amount of time, after all.

    In general I know that many forums have suffered reader loss simply because of social media platforms like f@c3b00k and IG- so if readership has fallen or is falling here, it seems like probably that’s simply the current (or ongoing) trend. The MOA forum several years ago all but died off, replaced by f b, where the MOA page was booming with members and non members alike! Meanwhile my old fave, BritBike.com also had some issues with forum use falling off hard while their f b page soared. Let’s face it, everybody has a phone and accessing these social media sites is WAY easier than opening a site url in a browser. For that matter, with all these phones, I’m pretty sure lots of people don’t even use actual computers (laptops, desktops especially) any more although devices like tablets or pads may still be pretty prevalent. Paying for internet at home AND paying for it for your phone = double or more billing costs so there’s that as well.

    All that said, if anyone would look at the bulk of my own content on any forum or platform it’s almost all about photo sharing these days. I tend to “like” stuff that I um, well, “like”, because it means something to me when my posts get “likes”. But what I really want to know is how does one find out what traffic one is getting as in the “impressions” aka views vs “likes”, here or anywhere else? One last thing, I’m really not happy with the new ownership at IG, FB and their algorithms bull shot makes me sick and I really hate all the adverts there fucking yo my feed
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  9. BLucare

    BLucare What could possibly go wrong?

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    Good discussion idea. A couple things first: I'm relatively new here on ADV Rider, and I'm a young'n, having grown up in the Internet and social media age. Like many people my around age, I have spent far too much time on social media over the last decade, and have since pulled back immensely from "typical" forms of social media over the last couple years. Nowadays, my social media consists largely of ADV Rider and IG, and a few bike/car/food YouTube channels. I would include ADV Rider in the social media sphere, even though it's not typically thought of that way.

    Easily, easily 95% of my social media time is spent on ADV Rider or IG, and is focused on bikes and travel, period - that's it. Here, I stay out of the basement, because frankly much of what goes on there consists of junk I am purposely avoiding by being on ADV Rider in the first place :thumb ADV Rider has always been my release from the real world, when I need a few minutes away from the job during the day, from stressors, from political and other nonsense. It's a break from all of it, like an escape portal into a whole 'nother world of travel and bikes, engines, garages, gear, and just plain fun stuff around my hobbies. It's like a mental vacation, where I can interact with amazing and inspiring people from around the world, whom I'd never even know about otherwise. I come here specifically because I can read long-form, unbiased, real adventures that real people are having. Nowhere else does this exist on the Internet.

    There's a common theme I've seen in here since joining: A select chunk of inmates here are not on typical social media. Either they never were, or they've largely abandoned it, but nonetheless – they remain active here. Sure, some people prefer video content and have dipped away from RRs as time has gone on, but those people would have preferred video and left anyway. It's like pie – I don't know why I prefer certain pie, but I know what I like and what I don't. Some people like reading long-form writing and seeing good photography, others like video that they can play on their smart TVs. Not sure there's much that can be done about that, to be honest.

    I know for a fact that people like Paul, @dave6253, @michnus, and so many others taking the time to write and photograph their adventures has kept me around, and has surely kept other inmates around, as well. If we could get access to data to show that, yes, people are continuing to read what we write, that would help motivate inmates to keep writing Ride Reports. It helps to know that the work is appreciated, and in the digital age, data gives us the insight that people are watching.

    Sorry for the rambling. Hope something in there was useful. :lol3
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  10. Ladybug

    Ladybug Bug Sister Supporter

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    WOW! Lots of good comments have been posted. I don't know that what I have to say has an impact other than agreeing with what has already been said. I don't do IG but I do follow facebook although following any type of story (ride report) there doesn't work well for me. I use facebook mostly to stay in touch with family and friends and it just consists of short comments if any at all, pictures, and lots of memes.

    The RRs on ADV are the equivalent, for me, of a good book or magazine article. Pre-internet days I subscribed to motorcycle magazines and waited each month for them to show up and I couldn't wait to have quiet time to read them. I especially liked the travel stories. What drew me to becoming a member of ADV were the ride reports and I still enjoy them. ADV and Ride Reports took the place of my magazine subscription. In the winter when the bikes are put away, for too many months, I spent time enjoying what others are sharing about their adventures. With ADV I get to subscribe to the reports I like and when a new post is added I know it is there. Each day when I check ADV I always check my watched threads and when I click into that thread it takes me to where I left off. If that's available on FB I don't know how to do it. I struggle with FB but I am able to navigate ADV with no problem.

    It seems like when I first joined ADV the ride reports had more real content. I like reports that explain things as well as showing pictures. A report can be full of professional quality photos but if there isn't a story to go along with it I lose interest. Photos are great at telling a story but I like the reports that have the personal thoughts included. When I finish reading a ride report and feel like I know the writer it was a great report. I don't expect professional writing or photos in the reports - I like the story in the person's own words, bad grammar, misspelled words and all.

    I think people have become so used to others having short attention spans that they try to keep their ride reports short. Not that the reports are all that short but they seem to have limited information anymore. How many times have we seen "too long, didn't read" in other areas of ADV? Has this gone unwritten into the ride reports too? Some of my favorite report writers no longer have reports out there or if they do they are rare. Many of the newer reports seem like the writers are trying to get through the reports quickly and just throw something out there.

    Perhaps an outline of what makes a good ride report stickied on the RR forum but different people have different ideas of what makes a good report.

    At times I wonder if motorcycling as a whole is fading away. I sure hope I'm wrong about that.
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  11. Cro59

    Cro59 Been here awhile

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    I think it is a function of the form of media. IG and FB, in particular, are short form media. It takes nothing to scroll through the feed and hit Like on whatever post catches the eye. ADV rider is more a long form media. It takes effort to find ride reports that may be of interest and more effort to work through the text and pictures. By its very nature, long form media will generate less engagements, but the engagement it does generate is more interactive and, potential, deeper. Trying to compare ADV Rider, or any text based forum, to IG or FB is like comparing apples and oranges. IG and FB are all about click bait and instant emotional impact. This type of forum is about storytelling. Trying to replicate IG type engagement on a text base, storytelling site just won’t work.

    One reason many of us enjoy this sort of format is because it is still focused on the reader experience. That seems to be what is important here. The other sites are all about keeping eyeballs on the screen in order to maximize advertising revenue. In my opinion, ADV Rider is about education and story. Readers come here to learn and to be entertained.

    The growth of this site and the volume of threads and ride reports show that it is successful. Don’t chase IG type engagement, rather find ways to make it easier for the inmates to find relevant material. Find ways to highlight promising new OPs. It seems to me that the site is a victim of its own success; there are so many threads now that it is hard to sift through and find something worth reading. In the end, my advice to the site owners is to decide what they want the site to be. Is their intent to entertain and educate, provide IG-like instant gratification to the content generators, or is it to entice more dollars from the advertisers?
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  12. magnussonh

    magnussonh Been here awhile

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    Things are always evolving. Baldy did a great job maintaining the forum while it was still small enough to be maintained by one person. I don't really follow the numbers but let's start with the number of inmates. Nearly 380 000 as of today. That puts the forum between Iceland and Maldives in population. Number can be deceiving, lot of these are people who no longer visit ADVrider. Duplicate accounts, lost interest, never really had interest, even passed away. Maybe some of the older inactive accounts with zero posts could be deleted to get more realistic idea of number of inmates.
    I don't feel that there has been much of a drop of quality in the trip reports here, granted I only read few of them and Covid is not helping. There are still jewels that come up here, like the lady writing to her mom that she joined a motorcycle gang, some with great pictures, like Paul's and Joseph's. It's more IMHO the general commercialization of so many reports that might be negative. If every second line is "The Brand X luggage is great, so strong and handsome." "The Brand Y helmet saved my life when I hit a snowflake at 10 mph." "The heated Brand Z clothing kept me warm all the time in the desert." Once the signature includes a list of sponsors my interest level drops. Sponsoring affects both the writing and reading of reports. I'm not saying sponsored rides/riders are bad, bless those who manage it, it's just that too much mentioning of free* products reduces my interest.
    I made a trip last year and was going to write a report about it, then a comment I made was basically trolled, and I lost interest in sharing. Maybe if I knew I could moderate replies to posts I start, or just hide comments there, I'd be inclined to share more.
    Then there is the comments. Popular threads here, like Pauls, get so many unrelated comments that it becomes difficult to follow. You get a notification that a thread has new comment but it's just someone who is asking what oil and filter to use in the Baja desert. I'm not saying it's bad to know what oil and filter to use in the Baja desert, just that other places might be better than trip reports to ask/share that information.
    And I sometimes feel like there are closed groups of people here. People who know each other and like each others posts but don't really let others in. That includes part of the moderators group.
    I don't bother with IG, YT has driven me away with the increasing number of intrusive ads. FB has high activity is chaotic and up to date.
    I keep coming here because I like the trip reports. I will never go around the world but I like weeklong trips. I wish I could sponsor the forum without a subscription. There used to be a donation button, that I used few times, but my finances are uncertain so I will not make a commitment to regular payments.
    Sorry for the rambling.
    * Free products are rarely free. Some are, but sponsors are usually using this method to raise awareness of their brand. Many push relentlessly to get their name in the articles. The small print in the sponsor agreement often obliges the rider to publish weekly/biweekly/monthly reports, complementing the product.
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  13. Champe

    Champe Been here awhile

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    It is not possible to reply to this topic when the forum rules prohibit any moderator or site criticism. I am personally on the fence with writing reports because content is restricted, while writers cannot control reader's posts at all. I moderate two other forums and find light moderation to be best.
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  14. Jeathrow Bowdean

    Jeathrow Bowdean Been here awhile

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    Too many words and not enough photo's on this thread...

    Post pictures,,, cut back on the long drawn out lingo...
    20201101_102310.jpg

    Thats what makes a great thread or R&R...

    20201101_105626.jpg

    No one has time too read post after post,,, put up a photo and call it good...

    Looking West too Abraham Lk...
    20201101_140056.jpg

    Keep it simple,,, the only thing people want too do today is ride...
    20201101_140121.jpg

    Keep it simple,,, a picture is worth 10.000 words...

    Would folks like too read whats going on,,, or is it easier looking at life threw the lens of the poster dude...
    20200911_114905.jpg

    This thread needs alot more photos and alot less ramblings...

    Post up the photos and lets ride...

    Life is just that simple...

    Its all about the Eye Candy that makes it happen...

    J.T
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  15. jdrocks

    jdrocks Gravel Runner

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    MY MOTORBIKE, MY CAMERA, MY BIG TRIP

    "Then I went here, took a picture, then I went there, took another picture, then I went to a real interesting place, took lots of pictures, then I took a picture of my motorbike, and here's a picture of the BLT I had for lunch. Then after lunch, I rode my motorbike lots of cool places, look at all the pictures, must be a hundred. Then I had dinner, here's a picture of my cheeseburger. This report thing is easy, I think I'll do an ebook, maybe something hardbound for the coffee table."
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  16. borderlinebob

    borderlinebob Been here awhile

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    Jeathrow— I respectfully disagree.

    A competent writer (lots of them on this forum) can do an excellent ride report with “zero” images.
    The description they write, implants the image in your mind.


    I personally enjoy a “descriptive” report with a good mix of pictures.
    I usually only open imbedded videos after reading the full report. ( Go back)

    But that’s just my opinion and we all have one eh:jack
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  17. staticPort

    staticPort Meditrider Supporter

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    "In my opinion, ADV Rider is about education and story" nails it for me. As does's @Ladybug 's point about AdvRider filling the gap left by print motorcycle magazines. I'm drawn to long form trip reports, full of great photographs and descriptive writing. They are not easy to produce, require hard work, talent and dedication. But they are fundamental to the hold this forum has over many of us. Words and Pictures are what matters to me. Producing great video content is orders of magnitude more challenging and rarely achieved. Just fixing a GoPro to a helmet does not make one a movie producer.

    So find a way to encourage the submission of more 'classic ride reports'. Provide feedback to the poster's via "views" or whatever, enhance "Likes" by adding more nuanced "Likes" (as Cake does...)
    Just keep providing a place where Writers and Photographers can communicate with an appreciative audience.
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  18. kubcat

    kubcat Long timer Supporter

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    I have a different perspective than what I've read so far. I know the thread starter was referring specifically to RRs and their apparent demise, but personally I use this forum predominantly to maintain, upgrade and prepare my bike for its intended use - adventure riding. That includes the logistics and support infrastructure (gear, clothing, nav, etc.) The RRs that interest me are the ones that intersect with my intended riding, or reports that allow me to RTW vicariously, as I know I will never do it IRL. I have no basis for concluding this, but I believe a majority of inmates are just like me regarding what they pay attention to.

    With the explosion of interest in ADV riding, many for the first time, that narrative makes perfect sense as those new to the sport stumble on this forum and immerse themselves in the "what, when, where and how to's" of ADV riding. To a much greater degree, the RRs are about the "Who" of ADV riding. Proportionately I would expect the RR readership ratio to reflect that.
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  19. HandCanonShootr

    HandCanonShootr Been here awhile Supporter

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    Thanks for bringing this up Paul, quite a self-hijack, but important.

    That a great thought, about another RR forum for longer term posts/travelers (yrs, no home base) lightcycle, flyingdutchman, michnus, dave6523, and those trapped by CoVid.

    Paul, your pictures caught my interest, then your storytelling, and the longer term view of your travels, add the great & instructive builds.

    Thanks, Liking it Lots! Pls keep it up...
    Mike B
  20. jdrocks

    jdrocks Gravel Runner

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    plenty of writers will die on that hill because, one way or another, they fail to fully engage the reader. we're in the TLDR age, and are often times trying to address folks who are multitasking 7 days per, leaving them with the attention span of a freakin' flea. have good stuff, or they don't hang in there past half a page.

    if ya can't suck the reader in with narrative that paints the picture, get better, or stay off the keys. photos serve to enhance the narrative...here's what i wrote, adding the photo is confirmation of what was actually in front of me.

    another reason for a moto traveler to work on narrative is that putting up a camera to get a photo of every interesting incident or person could get you hurt these days, that's the world we live in. personally, i don't photograph women for report photos who may have certain, let's say, assets. your ride report photo could end up somewhere undesirable within minutes of being posted, and with facial recognition, have unintended consequences. it doesn't mean she's left out, i'll let the narrative set the scene.
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