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Discussion in 'Japanese polycylindered adventure bikes' started by uk_mouse, Jun 22, 2016.
Also they use the same springs if its lower or stock.Just have to cut spacer a bit.
Regarding the firk wear, the major wear was reported on bikes doing mostly road miles.
With that, the bash plate is not a factor.
Besides the 30 years of flexy fork problems known by racetech n others.
Just had a 10K km service done on the front suspenders after Kashima coating done,
no issues, buddy has 30k Km on his hard anodizing and they are toast need to be redone. I do run the lower clamps at 12 Nm. Have been running out of rebound adjustment (have been setting to about 1/2 a click from soft but wanted less) Dave tuned up a new config on the Dyno.
Have any of you run heavier weight oil in the forks to increase the effectiveness of the valving?
I've got stronger springs (0.75 in both) and find that with the Honda fluid (8W) there still isn't enough rebound to keep the fork from bouncing after topping out. I'm thinking I'll try 10W and see if it improves it.
Revalve it. The stock valving is too weak to deal with it. It can't cope with stock springs.
You could use 15wt as a cheap option. Hyperprousethis option, itisa lazy option.
Spend the coin on valving, you won't regret it.
Here is some info. Even if you don't go DIY, It will giveyouan idea of whats required and how weak the stock valving is.
Yes, you're right, and I've done gold valves on prior bikes with excellent success. However, knowing that these forks may eat themselves in the future, I'm saving for the Ohlins forks. I just need more time to save up (and for them to become available). Thus consdering other options in the meantime (like changing the fluid).
Thanks for those links, looks like I have some reading to do.
One of the things I came across doing some research last night was the fluid viscosity; apparently fork fluid viscosity is all over the map. One brand's 15 wt may be like another brand's 5 wt, and temperature has a lot to do with it. Apparently 'centistokes' is a better way to measure it ... and this is what I found:
Assuming stock is Showa ss-8 with a centistoke of 36.8 then I'll need to find something heavier than that.
Don,t get all crazy with the oil thing.Going up or down 5 wt is not real noticable on cartridge forks.Was a good tuning tool on old school damper rod forks but not as effective on modern suspension.I just picked bel ray as my preferred brand for oil back in 90,s and stuck with it.We used to use atf a lot on the old damper rod bikes(about 10 wt).
I am with @Junglejeff1 on this.
Don't sweat the numbers on fork oils.
The info is interesting, have read this in the past. But forks operate at mostly ambient temp. All this info is lab spec. Not worth much in the real world. Not many forks that run at 40c, unless its summer.
Viscosity isn't linear, example,
An un named fork oil, about 5wt,
600cst@-40c, (no ones riding here!!),
Seems labs can't work out we ride somewhere in the middle.
There are very few people that could tell the difference between oil brands in use.
We're not GP/pro mx/sx riders,Pick a brand you like, run it.
Good to see you back.
I talked with the owner of TBT Racing on the topic of fork oils for a while at his booth at the Touratech rally. He did a presentation on servicing and how suspension works etc. He also was setting peoples bikes up for free all weekend. I learned a ton from talking to him.
On fork oil: I believe he said that he uses only KYB fork oil (2.5wt I believe) for every application.
He talked quite a bit about experiments he's done using a lot of brands of oil and different weights. My understanding of what he was telling me is that different fork oils will change viscosity at different temperatures. Changing for oil is a bad way to change fork behavior because the properties of the oil will change as it heats up, so you get varying performance during your ride. Using an oil that doesn't change in performance through normal operating temperature variances is the only good way to ensure reliable performance.
Most good fork oils stay about the same in the limited heat range humans can survive riding in.
I have noticed my forks being a bit warm on a cold day while riding some bumpy fun routes. Not hot though, and it might not matter. I wonder how much the fork oil in an ADV bike heats up during riding?
Looking more at my mountain biking days, I remember about 15 years ago when the fork tubes on my downhill bike would be hot to the touch at the end of a run, and the damping performance definitely suffered towards the end of a run.
Yes, I did. When I first opened up my forks to change the oil at 18K ml / 29K km (and saw the wear in the rear area around the lower clamp), I used Eurol 10w oil. I noted immediately increased compression and rebound damping, and given I had increased them before, I brought them back to the original settings. Since then, Honda replaced my fork tubes under warranty at 30K ml / 48K km and they used again the Honda 7.5W oil. I immediately found the damping wanting again and had to increase settings (for information, I run rebound damping at 1 turn from max and compression damping at 6 clicks from max). Note that I still run the stock springs in the front with increased preload although I have installed a K-tech 95 N/mm spring in the back.
Motorcycle forks have quite a bit of aluminum to shed heat and a lot more oil.Its the shock is were you need the real good stuff like HVI bel ray or similar.Yesterday i could have cooked eggs on my shock after pounding gravel and logging roads all day.If a guy wants to spend the money use shock oil in the forks.Overkill but gives you 100 more hp lol.
I have used 5 wt and 10 wt in mine and with 10 they have a little bit more bite hitting sharp bumps.Right now 5 wt but have custum rebound stack and gold valve compression stack.Did notice the difference in oils but not huge.I have .82 s in front and stock rebound valving did not have a chance.Have a 10.3 in back but shock is a customized stock body with a high speed compression adjuster and custom piston.Bike is more fun not being the stock pogo stick.
Just sniffing around. Thought i'd offer my 2 cents.
My wife gets mad when I'm sniffing around.
Thats why i use a hit and run method!!!
Over before it starts!!!!!
Here is some info that follows same train of thought as TBT.
As for temp, hard use will certainly warm up forks. You mention mtb, small volume, hard use, hot to touch. They could be up to 50c. Which is warm.
If using centistoke to choose fork oils, choose one with the least change between the numbers. Same with shocks. Less change between numbers is less change in viscosity across temp range. Hence the reason TBT etc use 2.5 exclusively in forks.
For viscosity index, forks around 150 is good, and 300 plus at a minimum for shocks. Shock damping is anything from 4 to 9 times greater than fork requirements, and gets much hotter.
I use 10wt Motul in my forks and Motul VI400 in shock. Itisabout a 2.5wt.
I have yes. Would have find data again.