Africa Twin Premature Front Fork Failure (Current Owners and Prospective New owners Must Read)

Discussion in 'Japanese polycylindered adventure bikes' started by bumbee800, Sep 1, 2017.

  1. Quercus petraea

    Quercus petraea Been here awhile

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    I'm not misreading your statement, i'm invalidating it. You missundertatood me, but it could by because my English is bad.

    You said Honda put flexy tubes in 2016-2018 ATs beacuse the frame was rigid and they wanted to bring a soft feel. I'm saying that's not a valid point as the ATAS had the same frame but they put far more rigid tubes on it. And the weight difference don't justify that decision, being about a 4% that consists, basicaly, in the extra fuel, bash plate and crash bars.

    So, in your statement, if the frame is the same, they should keep the same tubes for bike feel.

    No mention that any ADV bike over 200-220kg should have not a so flexy fork, despite it's frame. And there're even other haeavier ADV bikes that have 43mm forks wich are far less flexy than AT's.


    You just think they put that fork for a good engineering reason, and they failed.

    I just think they put that crappy fork beacuse it was cheap, but they thought it woud be enough; and they were wrong.
  2. NSFW

    NSFW who else would love noobs? Super Supporter

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    i bought a 5-year warranty when i got the bike. not really want to spend any more money hoping this could be covered by the extended warranty. i contacted the dealer and they can't do anything since they're on a shutdown. once their service department opens up, they will look into my claim.

    meantime, the AT is sitting in the garage for at least 2 weeks now. i called the insurance company and canceled the coverage, then will request the Department of Motor Vehicle for a PNO (planned non-operation) with a $22 fee.

    the lock-down order kind of justify not being able to ride the AT.
  3. Greg the pole

    Greg the pole There are no stupid questions, only stupid people

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    Not trying to be a debbie downer, but there's little chance Honda will cover it.
    If you have a good relationship with your dealer, they should go to bat for you.

    Best of luck, and let me know how it turns out,
  4. Bolzen

    Bolzen Been here awhile

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    It's certainly an engineering flaw, thou tempting it would not be easy to fix via warranty claim -- they might rebuff it with something like 'not dangerous to ride', 'looks fine to me', 'it's the nature of the beast', 'they all do that' etc.
  5. NSFW

    NSFW who else would love noobs? Super Supporter

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    i know this is a losing cause, i would have replaced them but...i'm broke, the needed parts are not available and can't ride the AT due to lockdown.

    asked my friend who works at the dealership and he'll help me. most likely Honda will not cover it, but the warranty is on a third party, hopefully they are more accommodating.

    yeah, i need all the luck i can get....:lol3

    first, i think Honda will base it on cases that were submitted, and if only a minority has stepped forward (just like in this thread), they would simply put this case aside. it sucks Honda won't admit it but makes me wonder why they redesigned it in 2018.
  6. Junglejeff1

    Junglejeff1 Long timer

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    I am in Michigan so I feel your lock down blues.Just clean them up,install new non honda seals and ride that bitch when lock down ends.If just the ano is wore off and not gouged out they have many miles left on them.Seals leak because of dirt getting in them.Plan that fork rebuild with new uppers in a year or 2 when hopefully some of the shit show passes.This is not a good time to piss money away unless your loaded.
    PistolPetey and NSFW like this.
  7. Greg the pole

    Greg the pole There are no stupid questions, only stupid people

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    Get the kwak seals. Honda ones are garbage (single spring) But yeah, the rest is bang on the money! No reason the tubes would be gauged.
    NSFW and Junglejeff1 like this.
  8. Junglejeff1

    Junglejeff1 Long timer

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    The ones I have from racetech are working great so far(13000 miles on them ).I put them in before you discovered the Kwak seals which I will use if I ever have a future issue.
  9. Greg the pole

    Greg the pole There are no stupid questions, only stupid people

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    nice! yeah, just don't give honda any more money!
    I never found the kwak seals...my buddy Richard did. I just parrot the good news!
    Junglejeff1 and gve.mcmlxxiv like this.
  10. gve.mcmlxxiv

    gve.mcmlxxiv 2016 Africa Twin DCT No.272

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    I confused the Honda dealer here when I asked for a quote on a 2020 and asked how much trade in value for my 2016. I sent him pics of my 2016 with dark fork uppers. ATAS uppers. IMG_1014.jpg
  11. gve.mcmlxxiv

    gve.mcmlxxiv 2016 Africa Twin DCT No.272

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  12. Junglejeff1

    Junglejeff1 Long timer

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    Yup,honda does not have to worry about me buying anything from them again except for parts I can only get from them.I was thinking about trying a Montesa but want no part of a honda owned company.
    NSFW and Lost Cartographer like this.
  13. gve.mcmlxxiv

    gve.mcmlxxiv 2016 Africa Twin DCT No.272

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    I replaced the uppers when a fork seal blew. They we’re getting gouged but not yet affecting the ride. But I replaced them while I was in there the Greg/Kwai seal way. 5000 miles later I revalved with motociclo calculated shim stacks and when I went back in not so much as a scratch inside the ATAS uppers. The stock forks are really close to be really good just have to do a little bit of work and reading. I never worked on forks before and I did it. The Peeps on this thread are helpful if you want to try.
  14. DSM8

    DSM8 Where fun goes to die....

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    I just had my forks done again to sole the issue once and for all
    Got them hard anodized and reduced travel by .75” so at full extension there is more distance between top and bottom bushings which will increase rigidity.

    Now I just have to get time to ride that damn thing
  15. Junglejeff1

    Junglejeff1 Long timer

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    Mine are hard coated with gold valves and .82 springs. They work decent but far from excellent.Old 1989 cr250/450 old school junk on a modern bike.Forks were crap then and still are.
  16. Greg the pole

    Greg the pole There are no stupid questions, only stupid people

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    morning Skip, a few notes
    1-Flex.
    Is the factor due to Honda skimping on the thickness of the tube. The only fix is thicker tubes.
    My 48mm ohlins tubes wore, due to the same issue. My 48mm Beta forks wore due to the same issue (about 85 hrs of technical riding) and my buddy's Beta forks (same size, a bit more hours) We sent all three sets in to a local place for type three anno (hardest, Kashima is next up, but mostly a name thing) It was very cheap for the three sets..$210 CDN Paysos.
    https://advrider.com/f/threads/afri...wners-must-read.1253181/page-82#post-39380615
    2-Recoat. Talking to a smart dude at work (he's got a doctorate in metalurgy..I think) basically likened the tube walls to a house wall. He said that if the wall is not solid, the paint (anno) will not stick to it. The wall simply flexes, and weakens the anno.
    So the hardest coating on a flexy tube is money wasted.
    He suggested that a thicker tube would be the anwser.
    Reducing the clamping pressure down to a more modest 18 Nm doesn't work. I tried it, right when I got the bike. Tubes were toast by 8k km...

    So yes, the Honda is not the only one that suffers from it. Shit out of the three brands I have in the garage, two are afflicted.
    btw...my rear beta shock body had anno wear on it as well in the body of the shock:1drink

    I was out for a very sprited ripper out on sunday, and stopped to look at a 990 that was terrorizing the local gravel road with me.
    The portion right after the bell end is not as tapered as the AT. Who knows if the 990s wear.
    I do have a few friends that ride the 990's so will ask them to have a look see next time their forks are apart.

    I hope the 2020 has the issues sorted.
    And the crap seals, and the poor valving. I doubt it.

    BTW...has anyone watched any reviews of the new 2020s? specifically the start up sequence?
    Allegedly it takes ages for the screen to turn on, go through the lawyer read, then go.

    at 5.35 mark

    At one point in the vid he fiddle fucks with the modes for 20 seconds. Granted, its not his bike..but instead of giving buyers proper forks, and a shock...they gave them fancy electronics, and gold wing controls.
    EDIT: Not trying to hate, but it looked distracting and dangerous.
    Really, I want to ride a bike, yeah, I like some settings, but it seems like total over kill.
    With my 2017 the TC sticky switch is a god send. Leave it in one and go.
    I do wish I would have splurged for a TC/rear ABS off switch as well.
    It's one button I need to press to leave off...no big deal.

    On a positive note, the motor feels/sounds fit.

    But like you said, the people that dive into the forks, and are aware of the issue is likely less than 5% of all AT owners..
  17. Torque Request

    Torque Request Been here awhile

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    Can someone save me 84 pages and tell me what the recommended fix is for this issue?
  18. Junglejeff1

    Junglejeff1 Long timer

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    The thicker adventure tubes and proper spring for your weight.
  19. Torque Request

    Torque Request Been here awhile

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    Thanks Jeff, any additional parts needed with the AS tubes?

    Any recommendations on a spring supplier?
  20. William Wolfen

    William Wolfen Long timer

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    Cogent Dynamics. They have springs that fit without custom spacers. Plus, the owner is an inmate with a regular presence. Awesome guy!