An 800's Rebirth/The build of MechanicO

Discussion in 'Parallel Universe' started by FinTec, Dec 12, 2014.

  1. FinTec

    FinTec Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2013
    Oddometer:
    457
    Location:
    Colorado
    So here is a quick one. I installed some FastWay wider pegs. Nice units and really well designed. Eeeeexcept for one aspect, when the left peg folded in, it folded right onto the little knub that holds the spring for the side stand. I remember when I put them on I saw this I thought "man, if I go over and this peg folds up, it is going to snap that knub right off and now I have no spring for the side stand".

    Well, guess what, we had a tiny-weeny incident and the bike fell over on its left while working on it. (note to self: don't remove the front wheel while on the center stand and not enough weight to hold rear down. Bike dips forward, rolls of center stand, and falls over). Aaaaand the peg snapped the knub right off.

    So I lathed up a stainless pin

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    and then removed the entire side stand bracket assembly and put on my mill. Tricky hole to drill as it was almost at a 45 degree. Use a spot drill then normal drill, Stubby if you have one. Then final ream so the pin I made just presses in. You can see where the old one was in the picture and I had just ground it flat.

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    So back on the bike and spring attached. A little higher and more forward so It has a little more tension now holding it up but I actually like that, keeps the "slap" down.

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    Side note: good grief, the bolts holding the side stand bracket on where TIGHT. And where fully coated in thread lock. I stripped the head on one and had to get a "recovery" torx bit that worked great. But those bolts where STIFF the whole way out. They do NOT want those brackets to come off. If you have not taken yours off yet, I suggest you do not in a shop and controlled environment. Make sure they are not fully seized on now.
    KTMBLAG likes this.
  2. TR5ESU

    TR5ESU Been here awhile

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    Aug 25, 2008
    Oddometer:
    324
    Location:
    Surrey, UK
    This was me last week!:
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    I made the mistake of trying to remove the bolt before removing the foot rest first.. that resulted in the torx bit not being completely straight thus striping it too. Really tight in there and with a lot thread lock as you saw!

    Also if you are removing the engine at any point, the best way to remove the bottom left-rear bolt that attaches the frame to the engine is to remove the foot rest bracket first and fit an extended socket bit through the gap that you can just about see in the picture above, to the right of the bolt remover bit.

    Cheers!
  3. FinTec

    FinTec Been here awhile

    Joined:
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    TR5ESU: word to that. I have been reading your rebuild and am impressed with your guts to just rip into her. VERY commendable. Looking forward to the final outcome. I have on the master list a full break-down and frame paint, but that will come last after I am done with all the modifying. I am still welding and modding the frame. And saw your battle with that bolt as well. Damn they are tight!

    So time to look at exhaust. Did the research, compared, asked questions and the conclusion was obvious, the Remus full system. They seem to have some excellent engineering in their products. The fit and finish is excellent and I liked they where not afraid to talk performance gains. They also actually had a slightly larger dia. header pipe that the other brands. I wanted a better exhaust as I have some big plans for the intake and the exit needed to also be addressed.

    So received the Remus system. First a weight comparison

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    Excellent, 2lb savings just with the header and middle pipe. I suspect most of this is due to no CAT.

    So my plans are to have a 2nd independent O2 sensor (wide band) and AFR gauge. I want this as the intake system I have designed is going to drastically change the volumetric efficiency of the motor and I absolutely needed to monitor the AFR to make sure everything is "going well". I'll be talking more on this once I get to the intake system.

    So drilled a hole in the center pipe just behind the stock O2 sensor bung. You can see the bung and 2 sensors just below. I was just going to lathe up a bung but for $9 out of Stainless, why bother.

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    Now to weld the bung onto the pipe using my TIG welder. You really need to shield the back of SS when welding. You can do it using Argon fed into the pipe or I like to use this paste called SolarFlux. You just add some alcohol to the powder, mix to a peanut putter like consistency, then apply to back side of where you are going to weld.

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    Bung welding on

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    And a shot with both O2 sensors installed. This was really the only place to put it and even then it was a tight fit as both go up inbetween the swing arm and frame. But it all fits and good to go.

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    I think my final plan is to send these out now and have them ceramic coated. I hate how SS pipe turn a crappy color of brown and are hard to clean. And the ceramic has some performance pluses. It's new and off the bike, might as well.
  4. FinTec

    FinTec Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2013
    Oddometer:
    457
    Location:
    Colorado
    Soooo guess what, the Remus headers now mean the Alt Rider engine guard that came with the bike won't fit. I contemplated modifying it, but decided to get a Black Dog one as I have heard nothing but good things and I really liked their "two bolts only" oil change. I thought that was a brilliant design.

    However, I knew I wanted to mod it slightly and I did not like the "crinkle" paint job they give them. Not my style. So I called them and asked if I could order one without paint. They where very nice and receptive and agreed to sell me one unpainted. I was a little put-off they charged me an extra $25 to not paint it, but I can see also they had to treat it differently in the production. I can respect that. But I still would think it might be a wash from the savings of no cost to paint. Oh well, you pay for different I suppose.

    So when it came in I was very impressed with it's beefyness. Here is is next to the Alt Rider one

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    Quite a bit heavier as well. Almost double the weight of the Alt rider.

    So at this point I quick mounted it on the bike and immediate did not like the way it looked. It is very clunky and boxy looking on the bike. To me the one spot they missed the boat on was tapering the lead corners with a 45 degree piece. Looking at some of their other models they do this, but for some reason not for the 800. It really makes for a crude looking guard. I know I am being a weeny here but it just did not go with the look I wanted.

    So I started with cutting some of the aluminum off. Removed the front tab where their logo is, cut about 6" off the back as it was designed to protect the CAT I no longer had, and finally, cut the corners from the front. You can see all the bits cut off to the right.

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    Now make a piece from cardboard to check the fit and have a template for the aluminum version in the second pic

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    Weld them in and a little grinding on the front surface

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    Now for some direct weight savings and aesthetics. Some holes on the side plates. Also, it will give a little cool air around the stator area that some say fails due to the heat around this area due to the hot exhaust path hear. Can't hurt I suppose.

    Clamp in to the table and using a hole saw, drill out both sides. I did scribe them and center punch them so they lined up nice and true.

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    So I wanted to add some air flow holes on the tab in front that covers the oil cooler. I know it really will not make much of a difference, but cannot hurt and has a "thought out" look I like. Now that many holes at once I could try and scribe and center punch but I know a few will wonder and that will drive me nuts seeing that. So I machined a guide plate from steel on the CNC mill

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    and then clamped it on the tab

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    Drilled the hole using a hand drill, remove the plate and you get a nice clean array of holes. Hmmmm, fresh air :clap

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    So a few shots of the near finish guard

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    A little weight saving from stock does not hurt either. And I do not believe I have not weakened the integrity of the guard at all. As a matter of fact I might argue that the corners I made in front add strength (non-right angles) and will do a way better job of deflecting hits there.

    I still need to figure out if I should send this in to be heat treated after I welded on it. I believe I do as it really will bend easy now that large parts of it are T0 heat treated (fully annealed). Can anyone confirm if they heat treat these after welding? I bet they do.

    Two small details I wanted to hit as well since we are there.

    I put a nice aggressive bevel on the two aluminum studs in back as you have to align these up with holes in the plate to mount it and with out the taper you had to be dead-on and I found myself hunting around with the plate until it indicated. The taper makes it WAY easier. And i figured 7 grams each weight savings :D

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    Last detail, I did not also favor the way they had two hex heads sticking out the front for mounting. Looked crude and a great spot for thing to catch or hang-up on. So I lathed up some brass countersunk washers and then used some quality M8 Flat Head SS bolts. Looks much cleaner.

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    Final guard mounted onto bike. Did not show this but when all done did sand blast the area I worked on so it all matched the stock factory sand blasted look.

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    Your call but I really think it looks way better and cleaner than stock. Please don't get me wrong the BD guys make a VERY nice product, but I think they could spend just 10% more effort and have a much nicer product. Just my take.
    morfic and Mark4931 like this.
  5. ebrabaek

    ebrabaek Long timer

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    Grand Valley, Colorado
    That looks really great Fin. That is about the same shape my CF bash guard ended up to be. I really enjoy to read this build.:clap:clap
  6. murph76

    murph76 Been here awhile

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    Jul 27, 2010
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    288
    id just throw it in yer oven bring it up to 350 for 10-12hrs ...turn off let cool down in oven should get u ball park maybe not... one page i was reading said take it up to 980deg for an hour yer call....or put in oven bring it to 350 for 4hrs take it to limit for 2hrs back down to 350 for 4hrs then turn off let cool down with oven...of course i have not tried this in my own oven so i dont know if it would stink up the house or not but ive always wanted to try it...when we heat stress the CM at work it doesnt smell but i dont know about AL...im sure a real expert will get on here and tell u to do it right and spend some money
  7. ramon

    ramon weezin' the juice!

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    Sep 20, 2002
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    California
    I love your detail! My friends make fun of me for being such a perfectionist, but I know what I like! You're a fabricator after my own heart!
  8. 97707

    97707 Vulture capitalist

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    Aug 19, 2014
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    Oregon, USA
    Nice work on the engine guard.

    Are you gonna put a blower on it, or just big intake and filter?

    I wonder how you are going to handle the custom map an workaround the stock BMW control unit for the fuel injection. Real interested in seeing how you make that work.

    Think you can wring another 10 hp out of that 800?

    Love your reports.


    .
  9. talltimber

    talltimber Been here awhile

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    Apr 9, 2012
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    Location:
    Yarra Ranges, Victoria, Australia
    This thread is a great read, keep up the good work!
  10. FinTec

    FinTec Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2013
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    Location:
    Colorado
    Thank you ebrabaek. I followed that fantastic build for that guard. Could not agree more, Carbonfiber/kevlar is a excellent material mix for a guard. And I suspect a VERY substantial weight savings. I would like to do this on the next "stage" but for now I was looking for the one day "get it done" fix. Next round....

    murph76, thanks you for the in put but you may be thinking of how to treat 7005 aluminum? I have made bike frames from this material (7005) and it is excellent because as you describe, you can just use an oven to treat it back to strength. However, a 6061 series needs to be solution heat treated which is NOT in the realms of most individuals. I have some other welded items in Al for this build as well so probably just collect them all and pay the minimum fee to have them all heat treated.


    I am always amazed to see someone put a billion hours into building something awesome and then cut the corner right at the end. To me all I would ever think about is that damn corner I cut. Spend the extra days and do it right. That said I have certainly cut some corners myself now and then. But i am REALLY good at hiding them :wink:

    Oh, no blower here. I know it came up before but certainly not on this one. WAY too much engineering I what to ride MechanicO all summer. I am however, redesigning the entire air box. I have a lot to talk about there so I'll wait until we get to it.
  11. FinTec

    FinTec Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2013
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    457
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    Colorado
    Ha, so the tail chasing continues. So the new Remus headers do not fit with the AltRider crash bars. They interfere at the cross bar in front

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    Bummer. I do have a neat design for my own crash bars but i do want to try and use these for now so I can "test" a few ideas I have for the full custom one I eventually want to make. So first thing I did was cut off the cross bars. They are still on in this shot but you can just see the black line I made where I cut them.

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    I then made some nice SS caps and welded them over the open tube.

    So bought a piece of 304 SS tubing the same size as the crash bars (1" x .085" wall). I wanted to use the aluminum connecting spacer that comes with the AltRider bars as it works real well and looks clean. But getting it to line-up just right and come apart was tricky. So what I dis was drill all the hole and counter sinks first, then I cut it in half. Guaranteed it would all fit.

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    Just a few ahead now but here is the new cross bar welded in place. I welded it while everything on the bike so again, knew it would all come apart and back together perfect. And you can now see we just clear the new headers

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    One final touch was I welded on this SS tab on the right side mount. You will see what that is for in a few more threads I suspect.

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    Happy with results. Again, I know I butchered these up a bit but to me it is temporary and I plan to replace later with the better design.
  12. FinTec

    FinTec Been here awhile

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    OK, here is another one that rubbed me wrong on something I bought. I purchased the Touratech CS guard. It looks cool, fits my theme, etc.... However, it is a MAJOR pain to install only because it is comprised of a pile of pieces you have to not only figure out where they, but in what order they go in. It was a huge hassle to put on and sure as heck do not what to take it off again. Can't imagine doing it int the field and not you have all these little aluminum spacers falling all over.

    Here is the shot of the pile

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    If you don't count the fasteners, you have 9 individual aluminum pieces. So I ground of the anodizing and while I was welding up the guards I tack welded the pieces so know I only have a total of three pieces to install

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    Works great. Goes on and comes of in a snap. I also added this little extra plate as I wanted to stop grease from flinging onto the electrical plugs that are right there in front of the CS.

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    Overall I do like the design and look of the guard. But goodness Touratech, go the extra 10% and tack weld the parts together. WAY more user friendly.
  13. FinTec

    FinTec Been here awhile

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    Colorado
    Not my favorite but it is time to move to the electrical. I have some big plans for the intake box so the first thing I need to do is relocate the battery down to behind the engine. I like this as not only will it give me tons of room up-top, but we drop the center of gravity quite a bit.

    So here is a shot of the area once you remove the charcoal canister and ABS (as I have done back a few pages). Obviously the rear shock is also missing but you really have a lot of room here to work with. FYI: the Nuda also locates the battery here. I actually thought of just ordering a batter box for the Nuda but it was just as easy to make something myself. You can see here where I removed the paint on the rear support to get ready for welding. I also had to cut down this tab that came up right in the middle of the area. I think it held some clip or something. But now it was in the way so off it goes. I weighed the tab, it was 18 grams. Yes!

    There are two M6 threaded bosses already to be used in the area. However, I needed two contact points near the rear.

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    So I made a parts kits to make the base of the battery tray

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    First I welded the aluminum bars together to create the main cradle

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    Then I made the two steel tabs for the rear mount. I always try and include welded in threaded bosses when I can as it can be a pain to have to insert a nut and hold it. Higher parts count, nut can vibrate off, etc. Takes more effort than just drilling a hole in a tab, but it is worth it.

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    Then a dry mount to make sure it all lines up before welding

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    Rear tabs welded in place. Aluminum foil was to protect the rear brake line. Still singed it just a tad, but integrity is fine. Heck, I'll still have front brakes right?

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    Now I have added some uprights and lower tabs to take the dual rubber straps I plan to use to hold down the battery. Brass of course! Also added some rubber bases for the battery to sit on. You will also note I added a piece of .063" aluminum sheet that attaches on the front of the tray and goes up between the engine and battery. I figured we did not need the battery to get any hotter than necessary. This will really only stop the radiation heat but that is VERY effective at lowering temps. Much like the exhaust guards to for an exhaust pipe on a motorcycle

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    OK, we'll get back to how that all comes together later. Now we need to work on the batter. OK, I could not resist, I went with a nice Lithium battery from Anti-Gravity. Did the research and this was the best candidate for the job. But the key here was I stuck with the stock form factor/physical size. I did this so I could at anytime use a stock batter. Good option to have if on the road or country X and just need to get something that fits.

    Good lord the thing is light. You always hear that but you really have to pick it up to understand. The stock batter was 11 lbs, this Lithium one is 3.2 lbs. Wow. And now dropped a 20" from the top of the bike. That should help on low speed handling.

    The issue now is the terminals on these batters are on top. And access to the top is VERY difficult now positioned behind the engine. I also had some big plans to expand the electronics and would be adding all sorts of items that needed to go directly to the battery terminals (more on these items to come in this electronic chapter of the build). I absolutely do not like it when I have to position and juggle half a dozen ring terminals onto one battery terminal bolt. Did I forget one? Is this negative or positive? Nuts I need a longer screw! Forget about it! Pain in the ass and looks shoddy. So I wanted more terminals and needed it to preposition the terminal 90 degrees. So we start with these blocks of aluminum

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    Some cutting

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    and a bit of a jump but profile and cuts done, M6 holes drilled and tapped, mounted on battery. I even made a nice brass collar on top for the main terminal screws

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    My eventual plan is to Plasti-Dip each one in red and black for easy color code and keep tools from playing the big spark show. I might also eventually make a non-metallic cover for the positive side. Those who have a keen eye will note I also switched the positive and negative location from the stock battery (you can order this from Anti-Gravity). I wanted the positive upfront where there was no chance of it ever coming in contact with the frame or other close by stuff. I can still take a stock battery as the wires are long enough to swap over. Also, positive ions are known for being lighter than negative and I figured this would also lighten up the front end....yea...and stuff.

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    You can now see the wires terminals I have coming into the battery. They each have their own location and screw:
    • inner two are starter and stock electronics
    • outer two are inputs from alternator/R&R
    • middle two are my (soon to show) accessories

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    Note: so I searched high and low for the perfect battery rubber hold down straps. It is one of those things where you buy like 6 of them and hope one will work. None did. Then I walked over to my 1979 Vespa Scooter and found its battery strap was perfect. So yes, MechanicO now has some Italian in him. And as long as I don't use any electronics from the Vespa, we'll be fine. Or engine parts.....and pretty much everything else :wink:
    olsburk likes this.
  14. FinTec

    FinTec Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2013
    Oddometer:
    457
    Location:
    Colorado
    In the last picture above you can see what the tab on the right side crash bars are for...this beauty

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    This is the Touratech "Extreme" rear shock by Tracktive. I did a pile of research and this guy is the real deal. Tractive is a bunch of guys that splintered off from WP to start their own line of high-end suspension stuff. If you look at the white sheet on this shock, there is nothing else out there that is close. Also, great service and customizing. I filled out a sheet on the bike, on me, on my style, etc. Also talked to one of the techs there to answer some more in depth questions. They tune the shock to your specs.

    And I love the remote height adjust. The location they built it for is in back, under the right rear seat area behind your right luggage. I did not care for this spot: takes a beating from the rear wheel and really hard to get to when luggage mounted. So know it is on the right crash bar behind my right calf. It is not in the way and inside the plane of the bars. Standing or sitting. Very convenient. Heck, can adjust on the fly!

    I also like the mechanical fixed height adjust on the bottom of the shock. This will come into play when I need to tune the rear height to the new front end.

    I thought this was also neat, you get a way better shock with more options and adjustments and you save .5 pounds over stock. Excellent.

    [​IMG]
  15. Captain Excellent

    Captain Excellent Stay weird, or you'll be normal like everyone else

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  16. wipe-out

    wipe-out Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2012
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    509
    Location:
    Germany
    Tears of ecstasy running down my cheeks :cry Pure gold!
  17. foogr01

    foogr01 On the scorpion trail...

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2011
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    48
    Location:
    Crete, GR
    Took me a few hours but read the whole thread non-stop...

    AWESOME WORK !!!!

    Can't wait to see more...

    Rock on :super
  18. ebrabaek

    ebrabaek Long timer

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    Jan 12, 2010
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    5,672
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    Grand Valley, Colorado
    Fin is extremely talented. I have a feeling it's fixing to go to another level..... shortly......:evil:deal:freaky:clap
  19. Wallrat

    Wallrat Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2011
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    957
    Location:
    Orange County, Ca
    Really enjoying the build. Thanks for taking the time to post your progress.


    I'd actually make the argument that PDM's are just one more thing on these bikes that can break without any hope of fixing in the field. Sure fuses are archaic technology, they also work 50 years later. Even if you blow one, any gas station in America has replacements. Sure a PDM will probably never fail on you, but what if it does on day 2 of a 30 day trip?
  20. neomodi

    neomodi Adventurer

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    Dec 18, 2014
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    Chile
    I don't know if I came too late, but that plug if for Stock Anti-Thief Alarm.
    the last week I was triying to add a break flasher I found the same.

    awesome post,