(Another) "Fault in Engine Control" - Limp mode fun.

Discussion in 'GS Boxers' started by nobody0101, Jun 16, 2019.

  1. PineyMountainRacing

    PineyMountainRacing Oops....

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    My LME occurred in the first year, and before I installed the CANopener. 2017
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  2. Boxerbreath

    Boxerbreath 2017.5 GS Black Storm

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    Mine only went into limp mode once and that was when I ran it low on fuel.
    2017.5
  3. Pabst

    Pabst Adventurer

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    I have no EZ CAN. The only thing I ever plugged in was that USB charger. Just coincidence I guess, but it was towed back to the dealer again saturday after the new throttle control was repaced which didn't fix it.
  4. nobody0101

    nobody0101 Been here awhile

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    On another note, BMW”s contracted out roadside assistance proved to be worthless as to reimbursing the cost for me to haul my bike while in TN back to MI.

    Reason being that it was “unapproved”. So, while trying to locate a uhaul on the weekend prior to closing time, or otherwise being completely stranded, it seems that you need to get approval from said roadside assistance prior (and then probably some other reason would the claim be later denied).

    Not entirely surprised, just disappointed.
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  5. ExodusRider

    ExodusRider ExodusRider

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    Nice.. bastards, man !!
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  6. JimVonBaden

    JimVonBaden "Cool" Aid! Supporter

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    IIRC, read the policy. It doesn't provide for unlimited distance, or even to your home. It is to the nearest approved service facility. At least that is what it was for my past two new BMWs. Hell, same for add-on towing with my insurance company.
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  7. nobody0101

    nobody0101 Been here awhile

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    Being that I was at the nearest BMW dealer and they had directed me to do just what I did, I figured it was worth a shot.

    • $750 trip interruption protection which gives you reimbursement for unexpected expenses if your motorcycle is disabled due to mechancial disablement over 100 miles from home
    Found this info online, but I have to double check the info in my paperwork as to the specifics.
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  8. kangamatt

    kangamatt n00b

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    An update on my 18 GSA with Fault in the Engine Control and engine shutdowns:

    My dealer had my bike for over a week and finally replaced my fuel pump. They kept getting faults until they swapped it with a floor model fuel pump. I have approximately 600 miles since that fix and the problem hasn't come back.

    I'm not confident by any stretch of the imagination but I am hopeful about the fix. It seems to a better fix than the throttle replacement some have had.

    My original problems began at approximately 3200 miles and I could reboot it to continue on until it finally had to get towed at approx 3400 miles.

    I'll continue to check in and keep you updated.
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  9. Cigars&Scotch

    Cigars&Scotch My eyes are up here Supporter

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    Just picked up my bike from Max this weekend. It was there for 4 wks and god only knows how many man hrs. Turns out the right throttle assembly was the issue and replaced with a new one from a floor model. BMW had them do a complete pin out test of the wiring harness before replacing the throttle assembly.

    I can say that she idles better than she did before and I hope not to have to see the Service guys at Max for a while.
  10. nobody0101

    nobody0101 Been here awhile

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    Hopefully that works out, but it does seem to be the default part which is thrown at the problem as resolution and in most cases I've read (and including my own) did not fix the issue.

    I can say that after having the software updated, I have had the bike out for three or four times and have not had the issue. Haven't put a large amount of miles on it, and mind you that it took 3400 miles or so for this problem to occur in the first place - so I am hesitant to say that it has been resolved just yet. Will continue to update here and read other similar tales of woe.
  11. ExodusRider

    ExodusRider ExodusRider

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    So swapping

    1)a fuel pump and/
    2) or a throttle body..
    3) software updates

    anyone else with the engine fault get a different resolution to the issue?

    Makes me worried about taking my 2017 Rallye On RTW trip next year.

    I suppose if the issue is going to happen, it would already have happened early on w/ low mileages based on this thread.. since currently mine has 8000+ miles..
    nobody0101 likes this.
  12. kangamatt

    kangamatt n00b

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    For what it's worth, My bike (18 GSA) was updated to the latest software in May, 2,400 miles before my Fault in Engine Control problems started. I only mention it as that definitively wasn't the source of my problems or the fix.
  13. Jager

    Jager Been here awhile

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    From my off-the-cuff recollection... various dealers have swapped fuel pumps, throttle bodies (many), wiring harnesses, and have (occasionally) performed software updates. What seems to have triggered the majority of limp mode episodes are various flavors of throttle body signal mismatches.

    While failure of hard parts like fuel pumps or throttle body assemblies could certainly account for some limp mode problems, my sense is that the majority are software related. Poorly defined software requirements, poorly executed code development, inadequate testing, or outright bugs.

    It would be interesting to know how large BMW Motorrad's software teams are, and what disciplines and processes they utilize in producing their code. It wouldn't surprise me if the software project teams of a legacy automotive/hardware-engineering-driven operation like BMW were underrepresented both in size and influence. That's pure speculation, of course.

    What's not speculation is that limp mode is, at its heart, a software problem. And the fact that BMW's software engineers are intent on putting the machine into that mode irrespective of other conditions - some of which are known to the ECU (such as lean angle) - suggests that some very important questions were never asked.
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  14. NoiZboy

    NoiZboy Dirt to Track and Back Again

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    Aren't there also some being remedied by pulling & cleaning connectors? I know I've read a few posts in threads here about connector issues and/or a "coating" on recently manufactured connectors that has to be cleaned off pretty carefully. There's also at least one post saying that BMW has identified this as a problem & is working on a "special tool" for the job, but who knows given what some techs will say to customers when asked. See post #40 here: https://advrider.com/f/threads/2018-r1200gs-limp-mode-at-2900miles.1297071/page-2

    I find the possibility interesting, though. Low voltage signals are more susceptible to bad/dirty connections and changes in resistance. Intermittent connections can also be hard to isolate during troubleshooting, and can easily result in out of range/erroneous readings from sensors, error messages that mysteriously clear themselves but come back and/or get worse over time, and hardware issue-like symptoms that then aren't solved by replacing the allegedly "bad" hardware.

    In my own work, I've seen intermittent electrical issues lead to "chasing ghosts" in low voltage electrical/electronics systems, where different components of a system get blamed & replaced, only to have the problem resurface a few hours/days/weeks later. This "limp mode" problem increasingly sounds like that kind of a situation to me.

    Software can also definitely be an issue, of course, but can also be a way of masking intermittent electrical problems by modifying the code to ignore brief, erroneous readings. I've read a couple of posts suggesting that's exactly what BMW's software updates are doing, but I don't know if we really know that.

    But if that's right - if BMW is just making the software less sensitive to momentary "bad" readings - then instead of "fixing" something it might be more accurate to say the software is being used as a workaround for an underlying issue. My concern would be that by masking the underlying issue, the software-as-workaround just delays the inevitable to the extent any intermittent connections will continue to deteriorate over time.

    I'm not saying it "has" to be the wiring, but it's an interesting possibility to consider alongside the software updates & hardware fixes. I was actually thinking I'd preemptively clean & reseat connectors during my next service while I have the bike opened up ... or sooner if I do encounter a limp mode situation.
  15. Cigars&Scotch

    Cigars&Scotch My eyes are up here Supporter

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    BTW, the bike has less than 500 miles
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  16. Pabst

    Pabst Adventurer

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    Wow, I feel fortunate, I got 2,000 miles out of mine, that's 12 bucks per mile, would have been cheaper to rent one. My '18, 2,000 miles has had, wiring, throttle control and software update, still no go. Not safe, did it after a 1/2 mile (3 times) after I got it back pulling out into traffic. 3 weeks of this bs. Seems like it only affects low mileage bikes.
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  17. nobody0101

    nobody0101 Been here awhile

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    :( I'd say it's time to leave it at the shop and start making contact with BMW. On that note, any consensus as to the best path as to who to contact in these situations?
  18. ExodusRider

    ExodusRider ExodusRider

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    Man, I think its time for you to invoke Lemon Law in your state and contact BMW regarding a buy back or you'll need to get the lawyers involved..
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