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Any low speed scooters with high torque for hills?

Discussion in 'Battle Scooters' started by Lobosolo, Sep 21, 2020.

  1. Lobosolo

    Lobosolo n00b

    Joined:
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    I live in Iowa where a moped is considered any cycle that the MFG says does not exceed 39mph. Seems weird, but ok.

    Here is my problem.

    My 12 year old wants a moped when she starts high school to go back and forth in the summer.In Iowa, a 14 year old can get a moped license with a class certificate (not a problem) but we live in an area with extremely steep hills,roads, valleys etc. I could get her a small 50cc moped but I really dont want her dragging up hills at sub 20mph. I would like to find her something with more CC's or even a gearing option like my Honda Supercub (centrifugal clutch). My issue here is that all the Mfgs want to tout their top speed on all their models.

    Is there anything out there with more then 50cc's but on the lower end of top speed?
    #1
  2. MiniBike

    MiniBike Still here...

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    Might want to also look at electrics... TORQUE!
    #2
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  3. BlackMarch

    BlackMarch Been here awhile

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    125cc Honda Super Cub is like 10nm of Torque. "125cc" Zero Electric Motorcycle is like 100.

    So that is a good idea Otherwise the regular 125cc scooters do more than 20 if well maintained
    #3
  4. sanjoh

    sanjoh Purveyor of Light

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    Steep hills in Iowa:confused

    Lived in Davenport for a few years, oh the wind.

    Easy enough to change rollers for more torque
    #4
    Peels likes this.
  5. cdwise

    cdwise Long timer Supporter

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    In Boulder the Vespa Electrical is the low power scooter of choice for steep hills.
    #5
  6. TTaM

    TTaM Been here awhile

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    Maybe a NIU will work well for your kid. Their base model is classified like a 50cc since it is limited to 30mph. I believe they have tons of torque for such a small bike.

    https://www.niu.com/us/nqi-series/
    #6
  7. Lobosolo

    Lobosolo n00b

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    iowa
    #7
    Peels, Martijn Wils and sanjoh like this.
  8. Migolito

    Migolito Prognosticator and MotoYogi

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    Go electric and set a speed limiter on it.
    #8
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  9. AwDang

    AwDang Enabler

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    Cheap 49cc GY6 scoot with a 70cc big bore kit.
    #9
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  10. aguim

    aguim Long timer

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    Location:
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    Very nice and clean design (from Apple, Bosch, Panasonic chic tribe), but only 75
    realistic miles autonomy, no storage, and $6,400 + in Canada. Also, looks like the snobs who
    import those absolutely wish you not to know where the things are coming from : chinese
    sweat shops ?

    Then its meter has about sixty different readings. I'd rather keep an eye on the rear
    mirors.

    Zuma 125 ?
    #10
  11. Bar None

    Bar None OLD DUDE Supporter

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    Another odd thing about the Iowa Moped Law

    A moped must be equipped with a safety flag that extends not less than 5 feet above the ground attached to the rear of the moped. The safety flag must be triangular in shape, with an area of not less than 30 square inches, and be Day-Glo in color.
    [​IMG]
    #11
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  12. aguim

    aguim Long timer

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    I'd have the governor wear one on top of his potato head, were I from the home of the free.
    #12
  13. Lobosolo

    Lobosolo n00b

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    Yeah, many odd things about the laws for mopeds here. I think a lot of these laws popped up around the University of Iowa as the campus is spread out over parts of Iowa City. The kids zoom back and forth to class and I bet these laws came about for their safety in town. The funniest part is watching a 300lb football lineman riding a 50cc scooter on a hill. I talked to a guy from one of the local moped shops and he said they are always burning them up. Moving to a 124.5cc scooter would be way safer for them big boys that dont want to go through the hassle of getting a full motorcycle license.
    #13
    Martijn Wils likes this.
  14. JerryH

    JerryH To Each Their Own Supporter

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    https://www.niu.com/us/nqi-series/ Wow, that a $5000+ scooter. If you are going to go battery powered I would suggest a battery powered bicycle instead. A 50cc scooter will not make it up steep hills. They do not have a low enough gear ratio. I had a couple of 125cc scooters that would not make it up steep hills with my 240 pounds on them. Again, they make plenty of power, they just lack a low enough gear ratio. That is very common with small displacement CVT scooters. OTOH, I has a completely stock 50cc 2 speed Puch pedal moped and a 50cc 2 speed Tomos pedal moped that had no problem carrying me a a lot of cargo up the same hills. It was slow going, just under 10 mph, in first gear. But first gear was really low, and allowed the engine to spin fast enough to develop enough climbing power. Once in a while they would shift into second gear, and I had to immediately back off the throttle to get them back into first. Sadly new mopeds are no longer sold in the U.S. But if you can find a nice used Tomos, or a 2 speed Puch, they will definitely climb steep hills.

    This is the same model Tomos moped I had.

    http://www.myronsmopeds.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/2005-Tomos-ST-red-300x188.jpg
    #14
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  15. DaBinChe

    DaBinChe Long timer

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    How steep of hills and how far does she have to go. Might be better to get her an electric scooter. I recommend a Segway Ninebot Max. Has a real world range of about 25miles. Made by Xiaomi.
    https://www.segway.com/ninebot-kickscooter-max/
    https://electric-scooter.guide/reviews/segway-ninebot-max-review/

    I have both the Gotrax G4 which is designed as a commuter but real world range is about 15 miles, and Xiaomi M365Pro also meant as a commuter real range is about 25 miles. The G4 has 10" diameter tires while the M365Pro has 8.5" diameter tires. They both are about same price. G4 is a little more heavy duty. I have a comparison review on both scooters on my youtube channel. I leave the G4 at work for running around and the M365Pro at home for running around. I find these electric scoots to be best for a up to 5mile distance, any longer I'd rather jump on my Elite110.

    Otherwise a Honda Metropolitan would fit the bill. 49cc. There are three generations. 1st is 42mph max, carb and liquid cool. 2nd max under 40mph, FI and air cooled. 3rd max is 42mph, FI and liquid cool
    http://www.motorscooterguide.net/Honda/NCH50/Metropolitan-Giorno.html
    #15
  16. cdwise

    cdwise Long timer Supporter

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    Funny, I see 50cc scooters going 2-up (Vespa and Buddy) on Moonstone in Breckenridge. That road has a17% grade in a couple spots and is at 10,000' elevation. I've also seen Vespa ET 2 parked HP on Boreass Pass, 12,000' with the riders off taking a hike.
    #16
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  17. Blue&Yellow

    Blue&Yellow but orange inside...

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    She obviously need a 500cc 2-stroke dirt bike with shortened gearing, revs out at 38.5 mph. :lol3

    Man, that's a weird law. Had no idea about that.

    I'm not much of an electric scooter fan, they tend to overheat and the batteries don't last and they take time to recharge etc. I like idea of a 49cc GY6 engine scoot with a 70cc big bore kit. Lots of guys modding that platform so lots of experience and parts.
    #17
  18. JerryH

    JerryH To Each Their Own Supporter

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    I had a 2007 50cc Metropolitan 50cc, a 2008 Vino 125, and a 2012 Zuma 125. None of them would pull me up 15%-17% grades with approximately 250 pounds on them. All 3 scooters were completely stock. They just kept slowing down until they were barely moving, and were knocking, pinging, jerking and lurching badly, just like trying to climb a steep hill with a manual transmission bike a couple of gears too high. I confirmed this on the Vino and Zuma with an inductive pickup tachometer, connected to the spark plug wire. On initial takeoff on a flat level road, the RPMs went way up, then came back down, then went way back up again at top speed. But when I encountered a hill, at full throttle, the RPMs dropped steadily, until the engines were well below the powerband, below where you would have downshifted a manual transmission bike. But there was no way to downshift a CVT scooter.

    OTOH, my 2015 SYM HD200, with 171cc, easily climbed those grades. Yes it slowed down, but the engine was steady and smooth, and you could hear it spinning at fairly high speed. Unlike the other three scooters, it was obviously not lugging the engine. My Vespa GT200 does even better. It too slows down a bit, but keeps pulling hard, and is silky smooth.

    Oh, I forgot my Lance Cali Classic 125. It did exactly what the Met, Vino, and Zuma did. It slowed way down on even slight grades, and was lugging the engine hard on steeper grades. Had the engines been able to run the same RPMs climbing steep grades as they did while at top speed on flat level roads, they would have had plenty of climbing power.

    I have never ridden a 50cc Vespa or Buddy, so I have no idea what they would do. I do know that a 50cc bike with a low enough gear will climb almost anything, with the engine running near redline. It might be moving at under 5 mph, but the engine will be spinning fast enough to provide plenty of power for climbing. I have driven an 18 speed truck up steep grades, and it had to be kept in first gear to keep it moving. When driving a large heavy truck in the mountains, you drive by the tachometer, not the speedometer. You don't worry about how fast the truck is moving, only how fast the engine is turning. If it drops out of it's powerband on a steep grade, you are in serious trouble.
    #18
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  19. cdwise

    cdwise Long timer Supporter

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    A, Zuma 125 should not have any problem climbing hills. I've seen one all over Summit County. I know w it's the same Zuma because he has a dog crate mounted on his tail rack for a 20lb or so dog. That makes it fairly d stinctive.

    As for the ET2 I rode one as a loaner in Denver. That thing had so much torque I damned near pulled a wheelie twice. Made me realize why it was almost cult status among it's owners.
    #19
  20. rhodesr

    rhodesr Adventurer

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2007
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    18
    Hi,

    My Ruckus has pulled my 260lb up steep hills. One in particular is a half mile stretch with 15-16% grade (Oak Hill Rd in CVNP between Akron and Cleveland OH)(an article in the paper gave that grade info). My Ruckus isn't stock - I've put in 5g rollers (7g is stock) and a better shock. The scooter down shifts and keeps the rpm nice and high and it slows way down. I haven't found a hill yet the scoot hasn't got me up. Starting out from a stop is a different story. From a stop it won't start out on even a moderate hill since the clutch engages while the rpm's are low and stalls the motor.
    #20