BMW 450 enduro (merged) threadfest...

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by Max Kool, Mar 4, 2007.

  1. Sportsbud

    Sportsbud Been here awhile

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    Still learning about this bike, but had a weird episode that had me worried for a second... After riding it around the yard and letting it sit for a minute when it fired up it burned some oil you could smell for a good 10s... Is this the infamous blowby I hear about pushing the oil into the airbox then into the combustion chamber. It has only happened this one time... My bike only has 45 hours on it, I still need to do the DMD breather as I am still concerned about the TL... I really like this bike but also when I do ride it on the street it really likes to stall at a light right when I go to take off.. That is both embarrassing and dangerous.... Since I have a complete Up-tite racing exhaust system I have put the bike in "High-power" mode as I think it may have been contributing... I will keep an eye on it now...
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  2. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    13D42D7E-40A6-4BDD-A0B3-B6A33E7293B1.jpeg F79BA892-82D6-407F-A328-0D43A44C09FC.jpeg

    Couple pics to keep ya’ll interested.

    This is my first bike where “hours” mattered. Is there “gold ratio” to look for between these bikes?

    For checking blow by, does anyone have a good test? ( other than checking for oil in the air box). Maybe taking the hose off the crankcase and looking for white smoke?
  3. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    Alright, team, I’m an owner. Got the bike for less than $3k.

    I’ll give you the good and bad…
    Good:
    • Engine looks remarked clean.
    • No oil in the airbox
    • Plastics look clean (couple scrapes in otherwise clean stickers
    • Someone installed toggle switch for the power maps.
    • Oil looks/smells good.
    • Radiator looks in good shape. Followed all the coolant lines, no signs of leaks.
    • Started right up. No smoke. (Did it from cold). Ran strong.
    • Brakes feel strong. I’ll check the fluid tonight.

    BAD:
    • The previous owner cut the signals. I have them, but I’ll need to reconnect them.
    • The dummy lights didn’t work. Neutral light. Switch light high beam. (These will need some attention).
    • The headlight switch, that is to say the left hand switch, is a little busted, and I want to replace it. The PO rigged up a switch for the headlight, so it’s functional.

    Questions:
    Is there an indicator on the dash for power modes? The PO didn’t know which toggle was high or low power.

    Haply to finally be part of the team!
  4. DirtyDog

    DirtyDog Omnia mea mecum porto Supporter

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    Congrats. I don’t recall there being an indicator light because it’s normally done by installing a wire jumper, not an actual switch.

    since you have the Akra exhaust system, I believe high power mode is what you want anyways. Unless you’re needing fuel economy.
  5. Sportsbud

    Sportsbud Been here awhile

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    I guess I am obligated to post my beast...
    KIMG2253 (1).JPG
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  6. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    Hey team,
    Going through the bike, any clue where the voltage regulator is supposed to mount up? Previous owner had it duct taped to the frame.
    84388713-9EB6-472D-BE0E-3BCD1F35DF3B.jpeg

    thanks!
  7. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    guys, as best as I can tell, this is where it would go…. But it doesn’t seem to match up. Thoughts?

    image.jpg
  8. DirtyDog

    DirtyDog Omnia mea mecum porto Supporter

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    @cgguy09 sorry I haven’t put out any effort to help. I have a Safari tank, so getting a look at that area isn’t very feasible. I’ll try to see what I can see next time I’m in the shop tomorrow.
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  9. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    I think I found it. I’ll send in a picture for posterity.
  10. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    Feeling confident this is it….
    83D29ED2-0FA7-4705-BBA8-EFECAE1EAC8F.jpeg
  11. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    Alright, So I'm working through the bike and I've come across an issue...

    BLUF: Radiator fan is not turning on when I believe it should.

    Background:
    • I took the bike apart to check the valves (perfectly in spec) and install a new vent hose on the top of the engine. When that was done I ran the bike and it started up and ran perfect. I let it run (at idle) for about 15 minutes and the fan didn't come on.
    • The on board computer doesn't turn on until I press a button. -That doesn't match up with the manual.
    • I hooked up the GS-911 and it gave me three fault codes: (1) Code: 1092-Tank Vent [the charcoal canister was removed; (2) Code: 279-Coolant Temperature sensor, short-circuit to negative; and, (3) Code 1376-Faulty Control unit power supply.
    Initial Actions
    • I cleared the codes.
    • I ran the bike for about another 15 minutes at idle. hooked up and did a scan.- No Codes...none.
    • Checked Engine Temp (using GS-911 real time) said the engine was at 119* C.
    • Hooked up alligator clamps directly to the fan.- It worked. .
    • Inspected the 7.5 fan fuse- It's good
    Hypothesis:
    1. The bike needs to be moving to register the codes....the fact the Tank Vent didn't reappear tells me that none of the codes had an opportunity to register.
    2. The fan & coolant circulation should kick on at 90* C. The fact the engine was at 117* without fan/coolant action indicates a problem with either the Coolant temperature sensor or the Fan/ over-temperature switch. Given the previous code, I believe the temperature sensor must be out.
    3. No clue about the Faulty Control Unit power supply...the previous owner jerry-rigged a switch in the left-hand control it automatically turns on and off the head/tail light. But it doesn't prime the fuel pump. The stock light switch doesn't work with or without it.
    Intended actions:
    1. Ride the bike: Toss the seat on the bike and ride it up and down the road...see if I can get the codes to pop up.
    2. Test the coolant sensor: Using an ohms meter, test the resistance. Test it cold (should be about 2k ohms) Once the bike's been running a good 10 minutes (or once the engine temp is over 90*) I should see resistance at 200 ohms or so.
    3. Test voltage to the coolant sensor: I should get about 12 volts at the coolant sensor leads.
    Questions:
    1. The engine temp doesn't equal the coolant temp, correct? As far as GS-911 purposes go?
    2. Is there a cheaper alternative to the BMW coolant temperature sensor? There are a bunch out there? could I take the old one to NAPA and see what they got
    3. Thoughts on the power supply?

    Just a noob with a bunch of questions....:rofl:rofl:rofl

    Thanks, team!
  12. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    Update 1:
    I had 15 minutes so I ran cold test on the voltage and resistance.

    Additional background:
    • There are two sensors on the radiator, (1) the coolant temperature sensor; and (2) Fan/ over-temperature switch. The two do not "talk."
    • The Coolant Temp Sensor is for the ECU to adjust fueling based on temperature.
    • The Fan/ over-temperature switch is for the fan to kick on after a temperature of 90*
    Initial tests:
    • I tested the voltage to the Coolant Temp sensor and the Fan/ over-temperature switch.
      • Coolant Temp Sensor registered at 5 volts (when the bike was running). 0 Volts when the bike was off.
      • Fan/ over-temperature switch registered at 12 volts (when the bike was running. 12 volts when the bike was off.
    • I tested the resistance on the Coolant Temp Sensor and the Fan/ over-temperature switch while the bike was cold.
      • I had no continuity on the Coolant Temp Sensor.- Expected
      • I had no continuity on the Fan/ over-temperature switch.- Expected
    731421FE-4E2E-4DC1-BB5A-D63988219A43.jpeg
    7. Coolant temperature sensor
    8. Fan / over-temperature switch
    Reassessed Hypothesis:

    • (Unchanged) The bike needs to be moving to register the codes....the fact the Tank Vent didn't reappear tells me that none of the codes had an opportunity to register.
    • (Unchanged) The fan & coolant circulation should kick on at 90* C. The fact the engine was at 117* without fan/coolant action indicates a problem with either the Coolant temperature sensor or the Fan/ over-temperature switch. Given the previous code, I believe the temperature sensor must be out.
    • (Unchanged) No clue about the Faulty Control Unit power supply...the previous owner jerry-rigged a switch in the left-hand control it automatically turns on and off the head/tail light. But it doesn't prime the fuel pump. The stock light switch doesn't work with or without it.
    • (NEW) The voltage to the Coolant Temp sensor and the the Fan/ over-temperature switch indicates the problem is with one or maybe both of the sensors.
    • (NEW) The temperature reading from the Coolant Temp Sensor at 117* Celsius may be in error. Which could mean the engine temp may be cooler. If that is the case, then the the Fan/ over-temperature switch, if operating correctly, would not switch on.
    Intended actions:
    1. (unchanged) Ride the bike: Toss the seat on the bike and ride it up and down the road...see if I can get the codes to pop up.
    2. Test the coolant sensor when hot: Using an ohms meter, test the resistance. Once the bike's been running a good 10 minutes (or once the engine temp is over 90*) I should see resistance at 200 ohms or so.
  13. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    Alright.. update 2: I’ll provide my analysis later. But it appears the fan switch temp sensor is bad.
    I drained the coolant and pulled both switches. I’ll do a controlled test later with a heat gun. Or boiling water

    In looking at the Temp Switch sensor. It is 2 prong 14 mm (1.5 pitch) insert. BMW call for a 90* centigrade switch & wants 80 bucks or so for it.

    In looking online there are cheaper solutions. KTM uses a similar item but at 85* Centigrade.

    Has anyone’s gone down this path? I’m a ears for cheaper options available without shipping from Germany!
  14. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    Update 3:
    Tested the two sensors using boiling water.

    Tertiary
    1. Coolant temp sensor- at cold water it was at 2.5k ohms of resistance. When tested is nearly boiling water, it was at 550 ohms.
    2. Coolant temp switch: I couldn’t get any specific resistance reading, showing that it never had any continuity.
    Hypothesis:
    This confirms that coolant fan temp sensor is defective and the temp sensor is functional.

    I ordered a KTM sensor from eBay that kicks on at 85 * C… I’ll let you know it goes!
  15. DirtyDog

    DirtyDog Omnia mea mecum porto Supporter

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  16. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    I do my best!
  17. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    Proposed Solution:
    • KTM shares the same Temperature switch for the 500 EXC (2012-2013)
      • 2 prongs, same thickness, length, and separation as our sensor.
      • 14mm 1.5 thread.
      • 85*, 90*, 95* are all available. 95* is stock.
      • About 25 bucks from KTM...much cheaper elsewhere.
    • I got one from fleabay for about $8.00: Radiator Fan Switch Coolant Temperature Sensor 85℃ M14 For KTM 500 EXC 2012-2013 | eBay
      • I went with the option of 85* to lower the temp at which the fan kicks on.
    Action:
    • Tested it with boiling water. Kicked after being in 90* water for about 10 seconds.
    • Installed in radiator and attached pigtails.
    • I'll be filling the cooling system today via a vacuum method that is typically recommended for the 798cc and 849cc parallels.
      • likely unnecessary with the relatively simple cooling system of the single cylinder g450, but it should make it easier

    Question:
    • Has anyone used a vacuum method on this bike?
  18. DirtyDog

    DirtyDog Omnia mea mecum porto Supporter

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    I didn't do a vac, because IIRC, it has a burping location on the motor. Perhaps I'm confusing it with my 950, but it would be easy to put the bike on a steep incline to fill without much air capture. Run it to temp and top it up once it cools. Since it doesn't have an overflow reservoir, just check it a few times after the initial fill. I've never needed to top it up after that, even with enduro racing and lots of hard singletrack. I used Engine Ice for coolant. Never had an overheating issue. I think my body craps out long before the bike does.
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  19. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    Yea, I think it's unnecessary. But, it would make it a bit easier/faster and it would provide peace of mind. The BMW twins have a complicated cooling system...BMW initially required a "rain dance" where you shook the bike with the coolant cap off. Since the F800 radiator was smaller and less effective at cooling, it was pretty necessary to get it right
    Since I have the VAC system, I'll do it & record the process for other riders.
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  20. cgguy09

    cgguy09 Scientiæ Cedit Mare

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    Lastly, while I'm blowing up everyone's "alerts" for this thread, I figured I'd repeat a request for a turn signal holder that I have posted in the FleaMarket.

    I need to have turn signals on my bike for on base riding privileges (military). The PO took them off & threw out the signal holder. If anyone has one laying around, I would like to take it off your hands.

    [​IMG]