BMW NP Armor Information

Discussion in 'Equipment' started by Lochlyn_Deckard, Jun 28, 2007.

  1. Lochlyn_Deckard

    Lochlyn_Deckard Dex Moto(naut)

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    I was finally able to get some information about the newer BMW NP Armor. I started in April as a result of the posts contained in the thread below:

    www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=207629&page=7&highlight=halvarssons (pages 7-9)

    Some of this is a rehash of posts from that thread.

    I was in a BMW dealer a few weeks ago and picked up their 2007 Rider's Apparel catalog. Low and behold, there's quite a bit of information all about it. I don't know why this information is not included on www.bmw-riders-gear.com (EDIT: It is now - here). I scanned the two pages that detail the armor (pages 46-47). There are also 2 small graphs on page 46 that I scanned separately.

    A&S BMW Motorcycles has a short video clip about the armor:

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NiSXiu0LJ0&mode=related&search

    During that video they refer to the first graph for the NP Armor Protectors (not the Back Protector 2) at about 0:50, stating "The armor material hardens upon impact, plus expanded coverage areas significantly increase delay time to impact, increasing rider safety. BMW NP soft armor has a delay time that is almost twice that of PU armor competitors." The video also shows the text below during this dialogue:

    Competitors Hard Armors 1 ms
    Competitors PU Armors 2-4ms
    BMW NP Armor 5-8ms

    The second graph is not referred to. The clip is worth watching.

    After looking at the info, I have a few questions.

    It says "BMW Motorrad actually applies stricter standards to its protectors, which acheive the lowest residual forces on the market: only 10 to 12 kN in the case of the joint protectors, and 4 to 6 kN for the back protectors." Later it says" The BMW Motorrad protector has a measured residual force of less than 2 kN..." Thought it was bewteen 4 and 6 kN? If it is 2 kN, then that's the best I've ever seen (BKS for example are 4 kN - www.bksleather.co.uk/techno.htm#safety). And is this for both the NP Back Protector and the Motorrad Back Protector 2? I think so, but...

    Finally, they mention a test that generates up to 180 kN of force. Okay what's that in joules? And the wording here confuses me a bit. Are they only taking about the back protector tests? Do they test the limb/joint protectors with the same test? I tried to convert to joules, but I guess I did it wrong. The results didn't make any sense to me. The EN 1621-1:1997 mentions details 3 levels. 35 kN residual force at 50 joules (level 1), 75 joules (level 2), and 100 joules (level 3). Where does the NP armor (which measured at 10.12 kN) fall?

    While I was at the dealer, I tried on their new Boulder jacket, which has the new armor in the back and on the joints. It was very nice. I didn't even really feel the armor and it comformed well to my body. Quite comfortable.

    A&S BMW Motorcylces sells the NP armor separately from what I was told on the phone. I don't know if other dealers will.


    All this being said, I think I will end up getting the standard sized limb/joint armor from TPro (Four Layer "Armour-Flex). I have three jackets that I use and to have all 3 modified to fit the new NP armor would get too expensive for my taste and I don't wish to use velcro and adhesives to make it stay in place. I think it's great that the armor offers more coverage and is assymetrical, but it negates switching the armor between jackets that use the standard size. So, I may own NP armor down the road, but it will only be when I buy a BMW jacket that includes it.


    I'm glad to see that armor is getting better and better and that companies are testing it to back up their claims. I hope that the Halvarssons Safety Suit does well and other companies start to take notice.

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  2. Lochlyn_Deckard

    Lochlyn_Deckard Dex Moto(naut)

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    #2

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  3. Lochlyn_Deckard

    Lochlyn_Deckard Dex Moto(naut)

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    #3

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  4. markgsnw

    markgsnw WTF?

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    if we move this thread into the Vendors forum, then Paul Varnsverry can contribute to it.
    #4
  5. NJ Moto

    NJ Moto Long timer

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    If I understand correctly it falls into the Level 1 category. Meaning, 10.12kN is well below the maximum permissable 35kN force at 50 joules needed in order to meet Level 1 certification.

    On another note, a single piece of protective gear can have "CE Certified" armor but it could be at varying levels depending on area(joints or back).
    A typical example is a jacket that has Level 2 armor for shoulders/elbows and Level 1 armor for the back.
    #5
  6. levain

    levain STILL Jim Williams

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    Does anybody know what current gear is being sold with the new Armor? I know the the Summer 2 pants and the comfort shell suit both do. What else?

    Also, will the new armor fit in other BMW jackets/pants? Or, is going to take major surgery?
    #6
  7. NJ Moto

    NJ Moto Long timer

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    The Rallye 2 Pro suit is also equipped with the new NP armor.

    As for your second question, probably not without some alterations. The NP armor is a bit bigger than "regular" armor.
    #7
  8. Lochlyn_Deckard

    Lochlyn_Deckard Dex Moto(naut)

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    It will require a lot of work. The armor is physically larger and its assymetrical. I took a long weekend that included a trip to a BMW dealer. I inquired about having the NP armor added to my BMW Savanna 2 jacket. BMW called Rainy Pass while I was there at my suggestion (I figured that they were the best ones to deal with this type of modification because they do all the normal BMW apparel repairs as far as I understand). Anyway, I was told that the labor would just make it too expensive. I think the labor rate was $60.00/ hour at around 3-4 hours of work to take the jacket apart and modify all the pockets and then put it back together (I did try to get my local tailor to do it and he won't touch the jacket - maybe other tailors would?). I cannot justify spending that kind of money. They end of the discussion between myself, BMW and Rainy Pass was to buy a new jacket that included it. Again, I won't be doing this. See my first post above.
    #8
  9. NJ Moto

    NJ Moto Long timer

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    Hi Lochlyn,

    Would you happen to have a link or contact info for Rainy Pass. Thanks
    #9
  10. Pax

    Pax shazam.

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    I picked up the R2 Suit and the armor is awesome. After it warms up a little from your body it is quite comfortable. The stuff is really heavy compared to some of the other armor out there, but it is comfortable and molds to my body which means I'm more likely to be comfortable and thus, more likely to wear my gear. Of course, the BMW stuff is uber-expensive, but the old question, "what would you wear today if you knew you would crash?" solves that for me pretty fast. Good luck!

    -G
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  11. Lochlyn_Deckard

    Lochlyn_Deckard Dex Moto(naut)

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  12. soloyosh

    soloyosh Dad and husband

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    Sorry I missed this before, thanks for linking in the other thread.

    The area under the curves in the graphs equal the Joules. So the area under the NP Armor curve and under the PU Armor curve should be equal (same energy; Joules).
    #12
  13. makinwaves

    makinwaves Long timer

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    Ditto! Missed this thread as well. Good info!
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  14. Questor

    Questor More Undestructable

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  15. Lochlyn_Deckard

    Lochlyn_Deckard Dex Moto(naut)

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    Yep. Doing this helps out so much later when you are doing searches on topics. If I think it will help, I always try to link things. It may seem a bit silly to some members I guess, but it saves time later.

    And speaking of that, here's the link Soloyosh mentioned. You didn't include it to make me do the work eh? :D

    3Do Body Armor Video
    #15
  16. makinwaves

    makinwaves Long timer

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    Hey Lochlyn, have you been following the NP armor since your original post? Just curious to know if it's moved further along into the marketplace or not.
    #16
  17. 2slow

    2slow Road toad

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  18. Lochlyn_Deckard

    Lochlyn_Deckard Dex Moto(naut)

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    Looks like I missed your post MW. Sorry.

    The link in 2slow's post (thanks for this update :thumb) does point to BMW offering the armor separately now: www.bmw-riders-gear.com/BMWRA_products.asp?page=1&mm=Apparel&c=Suits&sc=Armor&m=MC%2DRiders&r1=&md=&a1=ON&d1=ON&i1=ON&p1=1&p2=12&s1=&bplo=&bphi=.

    That is defintely a newer thing to the BMW site. It was not there the last time I checked, but that was a while ago. I have no idea how long it's been up, however.

    As far as retrofitting, many of the older BMW jackets or jackets from different manufacturers would have to be be modified on the inside to accommodate the increased size of the NP armor (www.advrider.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4872041&postcount=8). Done correctly, it is not cost effective in my opinion.
    #18
  19. estcstm3

    estcstm3 Adventurer

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    I Know this is super old, but im in the market for new gear and started looking at the BMW NP2 stuff....if this article is to be believed they are stating that the back protector offers 2 nm of transmitted force. That would be lower than the Forcefield sub4 back protector which i thought was the first to be sub 4?

    Is this NP2 stuff no joke? I was looking at D30 xergo (seems to only be in the kilm line) and the SAS tec 1/42 prestige (can buy individually from the german ebay).
    #19
  20. AlwaysRolling

    AlwaysRolling Been here awhile

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    Hello There,

    I don't know about the 2nm value as claimed in the article. I have two suits with the BMW NP2 armor (the orange colored armor), and it seems to be very high quality padding. Here are some points on it:

    1. The armor is malleable, so you can slowly press into it, but if you knock at it (like you're knocking on a door), it instantly hardens on the acute impact of your hand.

    2. The back protector, in particular is very thick and has a large area of coverage.

    3. On maybe 2-3 times I've had the bike slip out from underneath me while going between 10-20 mph on the road. In those occassions I've fallen on my side, but have never had any pain from the fall. On time I fell on my should (and scuffed up the suit), but had no injury from the fall; one time I fell on my side, and had no impact.

    4. At very high temperatures (maybe in the 90+F), the armor feels too malleable and when I knock on it, does not so much instantly stiffen on impact (though it's still very dense).

    5. I have had too of the knee pads tear in half (after about 2 years of nearly daily wear, and including being on my knees to check tire pressure etc). I know try to avoid being on my knees with these pants, or I try to be very deliberate about how I put my weight on them -I don't know if that was the problem, but I don't want to damage them like that.

    6. The armor is a very, very dense foam (which I saw when the knee pad had the tear.

    I saw that BMW is going to be using a new kind of armor in their suits which is not as thick, and might offer smaller surface area for the back protector. -At least I saw it on a GS dry suit, and was surprised that the back bropector was not as large or bulky as the ones in some of their other suits. Maybe that's because the GS Dry Suit is not for full on road (?) like one of their touring suits.

    On this last point, I would call up and ask the dealer if they will be replacing the armor in their suits (and if so, is it all the armor or just some).

    I don't know anything about ForceField, and someone here once said the BMW armor is rebranded stuff made by another company. I don't know if that's true.

    If you'd like any pictures of anything, or have any specific questions, please let us know.

    Bottom line is the BMW stuff definetly not a joke (but in all fairness, I have not compared it to other jackets. I was in a DAInese store the other day and did a very quick knock test on their forearm armor and it also seemed very good like the BMW). Best thing is to go check it out in person, see its size, knock on it, see how flexible it is, etc, but I think it's very high quality.
    #20