BMW's new EnduroGuard suit

Discussion in 'Equipment' started by Sailorlite, Oct 28, 2016.

  1. LopezXC

    LopezXC Been here awhile

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    Here's out of stock, selling last units at 50% off.

    We have an answer from BMW: They never said that this suite is waterproof, so no warranty claims, no discount, no money back. If a single drop of water is enough to overstep the membrane, it's not their problem.

    Now I have a beautiful 1300€ summer suite only for sunny days.
  2. RoundTrip

    RoundTrip Unintentional deerslayer Supporter

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    This does not sound right. Was this a response from the Motherland or did the dealer tell you. I would ask to speak to the zone rep and ask him to review the wonderful videos they produced showing the rainproof features of the suit.

    A number of years ago this came up with the OEM panniers not being water tight. BMW dealers kept getting info that they where never guaranteed waterproof. I and a few others still had OEM literature where it indicated it was. BMW relented.

    Be polite but be quietly relentless.
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  3. LopezXC

    LopezXC Been here awhile

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    Yes, it was from BMW Ibérica (BMW Spain&Portugal). So we are planning to move directly to Germany. But, as far as I know, the typical response from Germany is "Speak with BMW-YOURCOUNTRY"
  4. RoundTrip

    RoundTrip Unintentional deerslayer Supporter

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    Ya. Sorry about that. It is a bit different in the US. But I still recommend a very polite call to a Zone rep.
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  5. swimmer

    swimmer armchair asshole

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    From BMW's own literature:

    Facts

    • Cutting-edge, waterproof off-road riding jacket
    • Highly abrasion-resistant dynatec/dynatec Stretch outer with ceraspace protection technology; developed by BMW in partnership with Schoeller Textil AG
    • Three-layer laminate with BMW climate membrane; wind and waterproof, highly breathable
    • NP2 protectors at back, shoulders and elbows
    • Coccyx protector retrofittable Outstanding all-round air circulation thanks to numerous ventilation options; double front zip serves as AirVent system
    • Mesh lining in jacket and trousers, 3D mesh on the back; breathable and elastic
    • Eight jacket pockets, seven of them waterproof; men’s jacket with additional breast pocket
    • Sleeves can open wide, with wind protection in bad weather
    • Effective protection against wind and rain
    • Waterproof storm hood integrated into the collar
    • Velcro and press studs for adjusting fit in various places
    • Reflective print on jacket
    • Connector zip: 40 cm (all-round)
    • Comfort fit
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  6. RoundTrip

    RoundTrip Unintentional deerslayer Supporter

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    This is US literature for any that might find it useful.

    PhotoScan.jpg
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  7. RoundTrip

    RoundTrip Unintentional deerslayer Supporter

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    Here is the same text for the Spanish market, published in the same document. Note that it says "impermeable" and not "resistente al agua".

    PhotoScan1.jpg
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  8. bestiaparda

    bestiaparda Adventurer

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    No more to say!!

    This membrane is NOT waterproof, at least after one year of normal use, as many experiences have shown.

    I suffered the same with a Streetguard 4...exactly the very same leaking on biceps and crotch. Very soft spring rain.....unbelievable!!
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  9. NilesHenry

    NilesHenry Adventurer

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    My enduroGuard has 15,000 all weather touring miles on it and it, and my wife’s, has been waterproof. However, after hand washing woth the BMW Detergent, we also spray the suits with the BMW Functional Waterproof spray
  10. LopezXC

    LopezXC Been here awhile

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    I washed mine, once, with Nikwax. My friend dind't wash it at all.

    But, remember that real problem with goretex membrane is that some soaps will make it loose its breathability, not waterproof... I mean, washing with no proper soap will make it less breathable, as long as pores will be totally closed with soap particles.
  11. RoundTrip

    RoundTrip Unintentional deerslayer Supporter

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    Unbelievable! You followed the instructions and it worked? How could that happen?
  12. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    Washing the item will still making 0 impact on the waterproof ness of an impermeable membrane. It’s entirely to promote vapor transpiration, as that cannot happen through a wetted out face fabric. Repeated reports of a lack of waterproof ness in the same areas suggest either poor seam taping at the fabric connection areas, faulty construction of the laminate, or some difference in water column rating (you can see that the contrast areas have a much lower % of polyurethane which is the material the c_change membrane is made of).

    The newer Gore membranes (Pro/Active/Packlite etc) all have an inner layer of either fabric or a coating that eliminates the old problem of pore clogging.
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  13. Alloxxe

    Alloxxe n00b

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    I had mine for 28 months. Worked well until guarantee expiry. Yesterday drove 2 hours under heavy rain and got completely wet. Product obsolescence ?
  14. bestiaparda

    bestiaparda Adventurer

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    I had the very same problem with a Street Guard suit (same c_change membrane) but it began to happen after 22 months of use, so I went to my BMW dealer asking for a solution.
    They replaced it to me for a new one. Directly to the flea market....

    The guy who bought it to me took it with the labels on.

    BMW should return to use goretex pro membranes again, it's my opinion.
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  15. Candubrain

    Candubrain Been here awhile

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    A month ago I got caught in heavy rain running highway speed for 3 hrs. My arms were soaked and it appeared to have started at the inner elbow area.

    I wasn’t concerned as I hadn’t washed the jacket since last year and it was filthy.

    Using NiWax detergent I washed both the jacket and pants then treated them generously with NiWax water repellent spray.

    This week I once again got caught in heavy rain and rode at highway speeds for 4 hours. My arms were soaked again plus my butt this time.

    I’ve read that the NiWax is a suitable alternative to the BMW products. Perhaps not.

    I’m going to try and wash them again as I’m wondering if I applied too much of the water repellent and it had the opposite effect to what I was trying to achieve

    Brian
  16. RoundTrip

    RoundTrip Unintentional deerslayer Supporter

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    Make sure you throw your jacket in the dryer (low heat!!!) after washing. It requires low heat to get the c_change fabric working properly after a wash.
  17. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    Washing / DWR has no impact on the waterproofness of the impermeable membrane. If a bonded membrane fabric garment is leaking on of the following has happened:

    -membrane failure (de-lamination, manufacturing defect)
    -seam tape failure (more likely)
    -zipper infiltration (most likely imo)

    Factory DWR can be reactivated a couple of times after washing via a warm dryer - but again, that has no impact on the membrane.
  18. Candubrain

    Candubrain Been here awhile

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    Being a man I don't read directions.....just read the booklet for the Enduroguard suit.

    Its says:
    "Not Suitable for Tumble Drying"
    "Do not dry over radiators or other sources of heat"
    "Do not dry in the Sun, even after being caught in the rain"

    I didn't put the garments in the dryer after the washing, but I did lay them out on my hammock in the hot sun to dry.
    My bad.

    I will wash them again, and dry them indoors out of the direct sunlight. Re-apply the NikWax repellent spray and see how it goes.

    thanks
    brian
  19. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    Ahh, I was just doing some reading as well - some of the c_change laminate fabrics use an adhesive that can be damaged by high heat such as a dryer. Another company recommends using an iron on low w/another fabric between it and the jacket to reactivate the factory DWR after washing.

    Looks like tumble drying the EG even on low might lead to de-lamination?
  20. Candubrain

    Candubrain Been here awhile

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    I don't know. I just hope I didn't ruin the suit by drying it in the sun