BMW's new parallel twins - F800/650GS (merged) threadfest...

Discussion in 'Parallel Universe' started by kejago, Oct 11, 2005.

  1. John E Davies

    John E Davies Runs at Mouth Adventurer

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    From BWF800.org:

    Best estimate of US base sale price, based on current Euro/ Dollar rate (this is without ABS, nav, theft deterrent system, heated grips, luggage etc.):

    S: US$8700
    ST: US$9530

    A luggage overview - the bags are pretty cool, but aren't real crashworthy IMHO:
    http://bmwf800.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=32

    More pics and info:

    [​IMG]

    F800S Preview Article:
    http://bmwf800.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=15

    F800ST Preview Article:
    http://bmwf800.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=17

    The official BMW F800 site, with small pics of engine, chassis and cockpit:
    http://www.seriousfun.com/

    As far as being bulletproof - this IS a Rotax engine. I don't see why it would be any less reliable than the single.
    #61
  2. hmoro

    hmoro Morocyler

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    Rotax makes the engine, and it will be no "new" for them, one of the main characteristics of Rotax is relyability.

    IMO this kind of bike will cover the big hole left by Africa Twins, since they are not sold nor supported in most countries.

    A twin cyl engine gives the peace of mind as in aviation do the bi-motor crafts.

    Hope the spy pics come soon :wings
    #62
  3. BigMac

    BigMac Been here awhile

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    While Rotax-Bombardier do infact already produce liquid cooled parallel twin motors used in Ski-Doo sleds (another Bombardier owned firm), this particular motor is in fact a new clean sheet design. I however would agree in general that Rotax builds a very fine and reliable motor, although our Ski-Doo sled was not the most reliable, dependable machine we've owned; most issues were electrics related.

    From what little I have read, this motor was designed to be extremely compact and lightweight for its displacement but has a rather severe forward slant design (60-65* iirc) that may be difficult to facilitate in an off-road setup. The cams for example are gear-driven off an accesory balance shaft which is chain driven off crank, very similar to the LC8 valvetrain although in this case the chain runs on right side of motor while gears are located in head beween the 2 cylinders, iirc. The most intrigueing design element, which I REALLY hope was maintained in production version, is the use of a separate oil sump for tranny/wet clutch. This would add DRAMATICALLY to the length and ease of service intervals, probably allowing 10k miles for oil/filter changes at the very least given a decent oil sump capacity and use of good quality synthetic oil. That alone would be a Adventure traveler's dream!

    It's a really wonderful concept, but then again so is the Aprilia SXV with the 700-800cc version which unfortunately due to Piaggio's fiscal struggles may never get off the ground. For now, I think the KTM 950 is a pretty damn fine bike for off road travelling. Until i actually see a production version of something better, I'll keep riding the big Orange Beast hard...grinning all the way! Take care.
    #63
  4. F800 Rob

    F800 Rob MotoInsight

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    Unfortunately, I have seen zippo when it comes to a GS variant of the F800. Dr. Diess pretty much came out and publicly stated where the series was going... ish...

    S first, ST next, R (or 'naked bike') after...
    #64
  5. 666

    666 Agnostic and Orange

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    I owned F650gs. It has Rotax engine.I would refrain from "buletproof" terminology in this case. 3 water pump failures in 1 year and 12 kmiles is less than spectacular.Every time fixed by dealer under warranty. The water pump impeller design is not very reliable.
    My Cagiva was buletproof so far.
    #65
  6. F800 Rob

    F800 Rob MotoInsight

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    They're up now! Sorry about that. :evil
    #66
  7. dlearl476

    dlearl476 Two-bit Throttle Bum Supporter

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    John, I think you should take the postings on an enthusiast website with a little more salt. The word I heard is that the F800S is a replacement for the F650CS, not the GS and Dakar. The price cut simply reflects BMWs realization that they're not going to sell too many 650s for the same price as a new 800.
    And BMW is still undecided whether they are going to bring the ST to the states. For some reason, they still think we don't like mid-displacement bikes. (K75, R800)
    #67
  8. F800 Rob

    F800 Rob MotoInsight

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    Hey! :D

    Yeah, that's pretty much what I've been picking up. I would be pretty shocked if they launch a 650GS replacement with a 800 motor anytime soon.

    The CS flopped because it was underpowered, overpriced, and just plain unattractive. The S, from what it appears, is designed to directly address these specific shortcomings.
    #68
  9. dlearl476

    dlearl476 Two-bit Throttle Bum Supporter

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    >I would be pretty shocked if they launch a 650GS replacement with a 800 motor anytime soon.

    At the risk of speading the same sort of unsubstantiated rumors that I'm cautioning John against, I heard the Gelande and Strasse BMW were at a crossroads and BMWs was going large with the Strasse (800S, ST) and that the F650GS/Dakar would carry on for a year or two as is, then be replaced by a smaller, lighter, more off-road oriented bike developed jointly with Aprilia.

    Then again, who knows what will happen. Who woulda' thunk back in the "one trick pony" airhead days that 2005 would see BMW with a chain driven single, a belt driven parallel twin, and inline 4, and a cruiser in their line-up? (well, I guess the cruiser is history now)
    #69
  10. Zapp22

    Zapp22 ZAPP - Tejas

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    well, lets not give up yet! the F800 is a 'breakthrough' product for Beemer corporate, as I see it. Not a BMW engine [Rotax], BELT drive [better late than never!] weight-wise its in the ballpark for a larger-than-650-twin, and the old single thump F650 is long in the tooth. What if their Adventure version of the F800 were "HP2-ized" from the get-go? that would produce a bike closer to 400 lbs than 500, with a reliable rotax mill, simple beltdrive [flexibility in ratios].... and their usual good job on ergos! am I askin' too much?
    #70
  11. jasonixo

    jasonixo Adventurer

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    Looks to me like BMW is aiming to kick Suzuki right between the VStroms...
    #71
  12. Arch

    Arch Incurable Gearhead

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    Yea, yea, I know it doesn't exist yet (in public anyway), but dammit, I know that BMW has corporate eyes here and I'm gonna lay it out clearly...

    Dear BMWfolk,
    The more I look at pics of the new 800, the more I want a GS version. My 1150 has served me well, but the more I ride my thumpers, the less I enjoy giant motorcycles. I do however enjoy easy long distance cruising along with dirt two-track & such, so build me an F800GS, please. Give it nice fuel capacity, a decent windscreen and offer it with luggage. No, make that durable luggage. And for crying out loud, offer it with ABS, but without linking and power assist. Enough already. Include a sidestand that doesn't lean the thing over at a 45 degree angle like your big GSs, along with a centerstand for maintenance & such. The belt is good, leave it be. Give me reasonably long travel quality suspension bits and scoop the seat to avoid the usual & silly skyscraper stand over heights.

    Do this and I will find a way to buy one. Thanks for your time, ball's in your court.

    :1drink
    #72
  13. GsVs

    GsVs Goin' Somewhere

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    Actually everything Arch said (with ABS, but without linking and power assist, etc...)

    ..... I would be second in line to buy one !

    Leftee
    #73
  14. rider1150gsadv

    rider1150gsadv Long timer

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    :bow :bow :bow Amen to that !! Let's see what happens :lurk
    #74
  15. Rad

    Rad Done riding

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    I sure they were just wait'n to hear from you; there on it, as we speak:lol3


    For me; I'm gonna take a serous look at the street S version and see how it holds up for folks and then in a year or two decide if I want one.
    #75
  16. Saso

    Saso Happily sporting the DRD4 gene Supporter

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    It's in the works - had a wink and nod from a reliable source. Just slightly south of $12K. A KTM-beater next year in North Africa!! Oh, ahem, hmm, excuse me - I was wondering what prompted that wet-dream.
    #76
  17. * SHAG *

    * SHAG * Unstable

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    F800GS HP2 Adventure? Call Me :freaky
    #77
  18. RED CAT

    RED CAT Bumpy Backroader

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    Give us the choice on ABS and scoup seat. Some of us don't want either.
    #78
  19. Grainbelt

    Grainbelt marginal adventurer Super Moderator

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    Sign me up!
    #79
  20. DannyZRC

    DannyZRC Been here awhile

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    I like the 800 engine, but unless the 650 gets a lot lighter there isn't a lot of weight space between the 650 and 1200 for an 800.

    also, I really like the telelever and can't see them reworking the 800 to incorporate it ( I <3 the telelever/paralever giving my dirt bike the pitch/dive characteristics of an ST bike).

    I know not everyone is in favor of the power/servo brakes, but I love them :-D.

    so, I guess, unless I see a revised and lighter 650 I won't expect an 800 because there really isn't that much room to play in between the 1200 and the 650.

    it'd be nice, but they'd never build the one for me ;)
    #80