Calling out, TRS owners! Questions/things to share.

Discussion in 'Trials' started by Sting32, Mar 14, 2018.

  1. Sting32

    Sting32 Trials Evangelist

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    OK This is not about pointing fingers at anyone, just to share what happened to me.

    My Bike is the 2017 300 raga version. It was bought by me, used 29 hours on it total, as of last night. The original owner I bought it from, actually was able to get the GRO branded oil, and he put it in the bike, I assume since new.

    He solemnly swears that he put the hour meter on the bike within minutes of unboxing the bike. When I got the bike the meter showed 17.7 hours. I noted the clutch seemed to have what I call chattery feel to it, like warp or something. Rode it, adjusting only clutch lever to my liking. it never got any better. so then, bike is at 20 hrs. I changed the oil to Yamaha's 0w30 like we used in all the gasgas's I have had since the 04 models (after been steered away from the GM Autotrack debacle).

    So, once this oil changed, the end result was the fiber plates decided to dissolve off the clutch packs. FWIW the cluch is made by S3 (least that is what is stamped on these replacement ones I got more or less directly from our TRS importer). THe fiber plates from my inspection are (compared to the gasgas clutch kit sitting on table next to my clutch) are identical. the metal plates are tiny bit thicker, but still mostly the same (could swap the fibers if needed IMHO, but the steels you cannot).

    the finger height with new pack installed was 15.3 mm, when I took my (unknowing at the time were dissolving) finger height was 17.5 easier to pull but would NOT even hold the 1st gear (aka means that I didn't have to pull the clutch to come to a stop in 1st gear).

    new clutch is smooth engagement, seems to be fine, loves the yamalube synthetic we have always used.

    FWIW, GRO oil was in the manuals I got off the internet, but wonder if that oil and oils most of us have, are somehow incompatible, or if I just got lucky and got 1 of the MFG'd badly set of fiber plates, by luck of the draw? It was one of the plates that actually was able to dig the material off with a fingernail. you know, one in a hundred MFG defected set of fiber plates or something? dad and a friend of his, bough 2013 model raga with the serials being 1 or 3 digits apart and from same US shipment we picked up both bikes in crate the same day but, that friends bike had the bad crank bearings (rattled and replaced by factory warranty) where dad's did NOT have that issue.
    #1
  2. 2whlrcr

    2whlrcr gooligan

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    My TRS has been absolutely bullet proof so far.
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  3. heffergm

    heffergm Long timer

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    I fail to understand how anyone could only put 17 hrs on a bike. That's like 4 event weekends. No practice, no other riding. 17 hours is virtually unused.
    #3
  4. jonnyc21

    jonnyc21 Trials Ninja

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    I know I am not a TRS owner but if first owner really was using the GRO oil its hard to believe it caused it. GRO is a well known and often used oil in a lot of Europe and was even recommended by Gas Gas at one point from what I remember correctly.

    I would guess it was that very odd ball defective fiber plate set. But that is just a guess... Hope the current set last as they are suppose to.
    #4
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  5. 10K

    10K Trail Runner

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    :imaposer
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  6. Norman Foley

    Norman Foley Devotee of the Husqvarna

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    They usually are, if they aren't ridden! :jack
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  7. motobene

    motobene Motoing for 46 years

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    Cool that you got your clutch to work well because that was the one thing you complained about.

    Sometimes I wonder if fiber plates get really cooked and that wipes out the binder for the paper/cork.

    And now we know that GasGas, Sherco and TRS are using the same fiber plates.

    Vertigo has a Belleville spring clutch too, but instead of 10 posts they use 11 or 12, and different plate shapes.
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  8. Sting32

    Sting32 Trials Evangelist

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    Not like it really is you business, BUT, I want to dispel any assumptions of shenanigans from a trusted friend... He got talked into selling the bike to me, because he was going to have a few major procedures done, he might as well sell it to me, buy new next year, after all the recovery.
    #8
  9. heffergm

    heffergm Long timer

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    I think posting things on the internet kind of implies it's anybody's business, lol.

    In any case, I wasn't implying, or not, any shenanigans. I was just saying that 17 hours is basically new.
    #9
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  10. Sting32

    Sting32 Trials Evangelist

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    Hey we found out the hard way, that at least the 2018 Raga 300, the shaft that is in the sprocket has been changed, and is smaller, AKA is NOT the same as previous years, so sprockets that fit mine do NOT fit dad's bike.

    I don't know if you are in any of the loop, of trouble shooters I worked with on this, but since the plates turned out to be same plates as gasgas, some have said at times they tried to rev the piss out of a bike, slip the clutch to get it to change how the clutch works, gasgas... I tried this, and I call that the ADV fables? LOL.

    IF you are right about the plates thing. I did kind of get pissed at one time, held half throttle slipping clutch hard with foot on the brake, for about 30 seconds 2 or three times in a 15 minute period, when I was having the chattery clutch. But I know I have slipped the clutch as hard on the gasser's I've had (all of them really), stuck in a tight spot, trying to regain balance by loading suspension on brake, sometimes I can get my balance back, but these are short bursts of same thing.... HOWEVER, even after my abuse not really that dark looking oil for 10 hours (the GRO oil) that I drained just before issues started to happen.

    when I put the normal for me (Yamalube 0w-30 synthetic motor oil) then things slowly went bad over say, I dunno about a month? Changed the oil, went to ride, bike slightly slipped in 5th (road gear). rode the bike for 2 weekends, by 2nd sunday (week before the trails last sunday) the clutch would completely resolve to, not even holding 1st gear. I changed the oil 3 times that sunday night, after less than 2 minutes of testing each oil, hoping I could get any chance of clutch holding, each time whatever oil I put in there (tried 2 standby's we had bought but not used in a while one was just type F ATF) the oil looked like a person rode the bike 20+hours slipping the clutch massively. So monday new clutch pack ordered, which has fixed issues for now.

    I DON'T know what to think... Luckily I DON'T have friends that have or work some kind of crime scene lab, so we could find out what is happening to the fibers....

    Also noted: that GRO branded oil, had a tremendous stinky, fishy smell to it when I drained it... Bad enough that well, you know spill some when draining the bike. It was as nasty smelling as some oils we've drained out of boats, bottom of the outboards... I mean wow, stinky. I wiped the floor where I spilled it and yet was also was forced to air out the shop (even though the temp was like 18 degrees F), then wipe with gasoline to get that smell out of there...
    #10
  11. motobene

    motobene Motoing for 46 years

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    The technique of putting the front tire up against a stop and smoking the clutch hard and long I think over heats the plates. I season clutches too, but not so long as to tint the steel plates brown or blue.

    Over heating clutches is perhaps the majority - but not the only - reason fiber plates fall apart.

    A friend of mine got stranded in the Big Bend desert in Southwest Texas in winter about 5 years ago. Their group had to overnight in below-freezing temperatures, spending most of the night pacing around to not freeze. They had wandered the day before into some wet Bentonite clay and one fellow did sustained WFO throttle with slipping tge clutch! :dllama:

    Please post two photos: Dad's and your countershaft sprocket up close. Be interesting to see the from-to.
    #11
  12. heffergm

    heffergm Long timer

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    If the plates are the same as the GG, get Xiu kevlar plates and call it a day.
    #12
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  13. Anachronism

    Anachronism Lived Too Long

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    Part #s are different on the TRS USA fiche for 17/18. Looks like they went smaller shaft diameter to save weight.
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  14. gu9cci

    gu9cci Been here awhile

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    I sold my trs after hour of use.Never liked the clutch !
    #14
  15. 2whlrcr

    2whlrcr gooligan

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    But you like Beta clutches? What little time I have on the TRS, the clutch feels very similar to my last two GG's It has a slightly heavier pull, maybe a little narrower friction point, but nothing my meager skills can't work with. The Beta clutches, not so much unless they've been tweaked. I may try and do a clutch burn in or two, but won't get carried away. Oh and I run Dex III in these bikes.
    #15
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  16. Brewtus

    Brewtus Buffoonery, Inc.

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  17. lineaway

    lineaway Long timer

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    Yeah, Brewtus Dex III wins out on any oil thread all day! You packed yet?
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  18. gu9cci

    gu9cci Been here awhile

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    Relax Mike!!
    Why the beta comment right away?I don’t mention anything about Beta comparison.Beta have too quick clutch for me if that make you happy!
    Best clutch I experience so far was 17 sherco 250 Factory.
    #18
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  19. lineaway

    lineaway Long timer

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    A good quick clutch is why you run Dex.
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  20. 2whlrcr

    2whlrcr gooligan

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    Are you riding the Sherco now? I only mentioned the Beta's because you bought a couple in a row.
    #20