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Carbon

Discussion in 'GS Boxers' started by bigj, Jul 7, 2005.

  1. bigj

    bigj Adventurer

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2005
    Oddometer:
    33
    Location:
    Chino Hills, CA
    I am new to this forum. I owned an '02 R1150R which carboned up so bad, it got a new top end at 6k miles(totaled at 9k miles). When my '03 GS started pinging at 8k miles, I ran Redline FI cleaner and Techron through it( about 400 miles worth) before it went away. I've run a bottle of Techron a couple of times since, but now with 13k miles, it's pinging again. I've read all the threads on here concerning this, but there really doesn't seem to be a consensus about what REALLY works long term. Any thoughts?
    #1
  2. JimVonBaden

    JimVonBaden "Cool" Aid! Supporter

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    Feb 11, 2005
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    88,594
    Location:
    Alexandria, VA
    Two things, has it started pinging more since the weather has gotten hot? Or is it when you dog it?

    If you have a history of carbon fouling after so few miles it may be more the way you ride it than anything.

    The bike really prefers to be run over 4K rpm, with long regular burts to redline. If you dog it a lot, carbon is a result.

    Fixes equal an Italian Tune-up where you use half a bottle of Techron and ride the bike hard and long, the whole tank, sometimes twice, keeping the revs way up.

    Or, some have had luck drawing in a small amount of water through their TB vacuum line where you hook up a Twinmaxx. Instead of water there are a variety of "carb" cleaners you could draw in the same way.

    Jim :brow
    #2
  3. bigj

    bigj Adventurer

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    Jul 5, 2005
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    Thanx for the reply, Jim. Actually, I do keep revs up. Fortunately this is easier as I have the "Sport" with the lower 6th gear. I'll just keep blasting it with Techron.
    #3
  4. glassgs

    glassgs Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2004
    Oddometer:
    266
    Seems to me that the GS was designed to be ridden between 3-5000rpm. The overdrive 6th gear puts you at 3500rpm at 70mph and the high first gear makes it tough not to bog it on launch. That 7500rpm redline should mean a 3-5000rpm sweet spot. I don't dog the engine but developed a ping/carbon problem at 2700mi that was cured by Techron. I never thought that when I put down my $13,000.00 on this bike that I would have to deal with this shit.:bluduh
    #4
  5. JimVonBaden

    JimVonBaden "Cool" Aid! Supporter

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    The GS does have useable power down low for off road use, but still shouldn't be dogged all the time.

    Part of the problem is people are afraid to rev the engine as it sounds like it is hard on it, when in actuality is is good for it.

    Lots of cruiser riders convert to BMW for the handling, but try to ride it at low RPMs like a cruiser.

    At 2700 miles there is definitely something wrong with a bike that has a carbon issue. My bet is your bike is pinging from Oxygenated gas. Also don't be afraid to take it back to the dealer and have it checked out. Pinging shouldn't occur normally unless you are dogging it.

    I can always get my bike to ping if I am in 5th gear (R1100GS only has 5 gears) if I am going like 40-45 and give it a lot of gas. Any bike without a knock sensor, ala R1200GS, will ping under those circumstances, or when very hot and slightly dogged.

    Jim :brow
    #5
  6. glassgs

    glassgs Been here awhile

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    Sep 21, 2004
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    266
    I did take it into the dealer, but by that time the techron had worked. They said; "Rev The Piss Out Of It" See you at the 6000mi service $$.
    #6
  7. BeemerBill

    BeemerBill fillerup agin'

    Joined:
    May 2, 2005
    Oddometer:
    611
    My '02 1150GS is in the shop right now with severe (and I mean SEVERE)ping/rattle/knock issues on hard acceleration. My BMW service tech has no clue whats wrong with it nor any ideas regarding diagnosis. He, along with the BMW customer service rep that I was on the phone with today for 30 minutes, are willing to pull the heads and take a look but warned me that if it is a carbon problem I will have to pay the labor. My contention is that I should not have to pay for diagnosis, especially since they know (but won't admit nor deny) that this is an inherent problem with this engine. I would prefer to pull the heads and clean the carbon myself (if that's the problem) but we all know what that would do to my warranty. Now I have a motorcycle that my dealer surely doesn't want for a trade in and no one would possibly buy. I've tried the water torture and all the different spark plugs with zero results. I'm thinking a class action lawsuit might be the next step.
    #7
  8. Mandrake

    Mandrake Adventurer

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    Sep 2, 2002
    Oddometer:
    22
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    As I recall, doing your own maintenance does not (by itself) void the warranty. You void the warranty when you screw things up. So, you should be OK pulling the heads yourself as long as you know what you are doing. I pulled the heads on my 02 GS a few weeks ago to have them dual-plugged. (Incurable surging + pinging + lousy gas mileage (31mpg)) When I got the heads off I discovered about 1/16" (???!!!) of carbon on the pistons and the heads. I'm beginning to wonder if carbon is not a big (and difficult to diagnose) contributor to the whole surging problem, in addition to causing pinging.

    Unfortunately, my experience thus far is that BMW is only motivated to properly fix warranty problems if they would have to worry about legal liability (brake failure, etc.). If it is a 'minor' problem like pinging or surging, then the warranty is worth less than toilet paper. At least TP doesn't hurt when you use it to wipe your arse.
    #8
  9. 4SEVEN3

    4SEVEN3 Been here awhile

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    Jul 14, 2003
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    Location:
    Whitsett, NC
    I rev the piss out of my S all the time. No pinging ever!

    Water is good for carbon deposits.......ive seen the proof through a boroscope!
    #9